What is a "converted" saiga AK?

[Nick5182]

I know my local gun guy can get me a saiga in .223 or 7.62X39 for about 320 bucks, and the 12 gauge or .308 for about 400-450 dollars. I know a Tapco T6 AK style stock set for the saiga is roughly 60 bucks. I keep seeing "converted" saigas for sale anywhere from 600-1100 dollars, and am utterly confused, because I think I can make a "converted" saiga for about $400-525 after tax/ transfer fees. Am I missing something here?

 

[TXHORNS]

Nope, you can convert a Sagia for that price but you aren't paying for labor if you do it yourself. However, depending on what type of furniture or accessories are added you can get north of $1000 doing it yourself real quick.

The problem is that some of the stocks and handguards you may want are not bolt on so you need added parts which are pricey.

 

[Nick5182]

So...am I right in assuming that a "converted" saiga has a pistol gripped stock rather than a standard rifle stock? Are there any other mods that are done? I want to get a saiga, but the only conversion I'd do to it would be the AK style pistol grip stock. Are high cap mags hard to get for them, or are they pretty common as well?

 

[CoRoMo]

The purpose of the conversion is to get the rifle compliant with US law so that you can legally use a hi-cap magazine in it. You'll have to replace a handful of the rifle's parts, with US made parts, in order to achieve this compliance. The parts you choose to replace is up to you.

This is one of those topics that can/should be searched. The information is all over the place.

Search the terms '922r compliance' and 'saiga conversion'.

 

[Sam1911]

CoRoMo is completely right. "Converting" doesn't refer to a simple cosmetic change or the addition of a pistol grip. It refers to a series of (still pretty simple) changes required under federal law to convert the gun into what the ATF considers a "US-made" firearm so that you can use standard capacity mags (AK mags, even) and have the other features you want.

It isn't completely intuitive, but it is a WELL-worn path and the information you need is easily available.

 

[nalioth]

Are high cap mags hard to get for them, or are they pretty common as well?

Well, they really don't make "high cap" mags for the Saiga.

However, there are over 180,000,000 other mags floating around out there that aren't used by the great Soviet any longer that'll work just fine.

 

[zoom6zoom]

Best info source for this: http://forum.saiga-12.com/

 

[TXHORNS]

They make 20 and 30 round mags for the Saiga that work great. Or you can convert the rifle to take AK mags.

For $60 or so you can buy a Tapco kit that replaces the saiga stock with a pistol grip AR-type collapsable stock. Technically that will allow you to use a 30 round mag by Fed standards. If you want one pm me and you can buy my old one cheap!

Or you can choose the conversion that removes the Saiga sporting stock, replaces the factory trigger and moves it up to the magwell, puts a pistol grip in the place of the old trigger and add an ak stock or any other stock available. The advantage is better handling, better trigger, and its just plain fun to do. Instructions are readily available online. Google "dinzag" or "mississippi auto arms" for some good suppliers. There are many others but I have first hand experience with both of these and can recommend them.

 

[kyjoe]

Dinzag is great. I converted a .308 and my bbl was thicker than normal so the attachment for the lower handguard did not fit. Dinzag took it back and made a custom one on my caliper readings at no additional cost plus a lot of guidance for me.

 

[D Boone]

I had my local smith press off everything and install a $15 handguard retainer for $20. Pretty cheap and I doubt you will find that. Dinzag has a great reputation. A simple conversion that you do yourself will leave the front handguard as is, but replace the stock and add a pistol grip and use a tapc0 fire control group. Depending on what you choose, can be done for $30 fcg, $40-60 for stock, and 20 for grip, 5 or so for the the grip screw. Not at all hard to do... with a dremel.... if your careful!

edited to add, you can add a bullet guide for about $5 if you make it yourself with a piece of pipe or flat stock depending on your model. Might want to practice tapping for a screw before you try on your rifle, but if you go slow its not hard at all.

 

[aka108]

Saiga is a sporterized AK. The can be converted to look like a "real" AK for several hundred bucks and up. Nothing really changes except appearance. For around 700 you can get a Arsenal converted Saiga with decent furniture. The Arsenal converted arms look very good but they are still a Saiga with a pretty pink dress on.

 

[noob_shooter]

i guess one of the main reason for me was the trigger. The stock trigger was the worst ever in this world..

 

[nalioth]

The can be converted to look like a "real" AK for several hundred bucks and up.

You're kidding, right?

I've converted Saigas for less than $75 over the cost of the original firearm.

 

[DMK]

I've converted Saigas for less than $75 over the cost of the original firearm.

It depends how far you want to go. If you start swapping front sight blocks, gas blocks, riveting a proper trigger guard and mag catch, add a quality muzzle brake, the proper handguard retainer, refinish the whole thing and add some quality furniture with the handguard heat shield and maybe a real Russian sling, it could add up.

Then again, some folks are happy with bending the original trigger guard, attaching it with two screws, throwing in a TAPCO trigger and furniture, maybe spraying on some krylon or barbecue paint and calling it good.

Some people are proud of how cheap they can do things, some are proud of how well they can do things, some find somewhere in between.

 

[nalioth]

Some people are proud of how cheap they can do things, some are proud of how well they can do things, some find somewhere in between.

Well, I prefer function over form.

Dumping hundreds of dollars into a Saiga to make it look like a traditional AK does nothing for me. My Saigas perform as well as any of the 'traditionally converted' Saigas.



"Looks don't feed the bulldog."

 

[DMK]

Well, I prefer function over form.

Dumping hundreds of dollars into a Saiga to make it look like a traditional AK does nothing for me. My Saigas perform as well as any of the 'traditionally converted' Saigas.

Sure. That's one of the nice things about building your own rifle, whether it be converting a Saiga, assembling an AR from parts, or building a FAL or AK from a parts kit and new receiver. You can do it the way you want.

Some folks build 'beater' or truck guns, some build something they see as practical and functional (function over form) and some want to build a clone of something the military might use (form over function). It all about what the owner wants for his money.

 

[JFtheGR8]

Nick. A converted Saiga to me basically means that the trigger group has been moved forward removing the linkage that was required for the monte carlo stock. This allows for a pistol grip to be placed where the trigger was originally. I own a unconverted Saiga with the Tapco furniture. I replaced the stock, forearm and gas piston and added a high cap magazine (all of which are U.S. made). I believe mine to be compliant as long as I make sure to only use U.S. made magazines. Surely someone wil correct me if I am wrong here. I may convert it in the future or I may not. Either way I can still use the Tapco stock. It's just a matter of moving the pistol grip forward after changing out the trigger group. Just a FYI: you cannot count the pistol grip as a part to be compliant because the Saiga did not originally come with one. A compliance part must replace an original part. There is a pretty good video series on Youtube of a guy converting one on his kitchen table.

 

[arizona98tj]

Nick5182.....here is a pretty well documented do it yourself Saiga .223 conversion. I think you will find it relatively complete and a good read, if I do say so myself.

I went beyond most conversions and modified mine to take AR-15 mags. Easier for me to only have one style of .223 magazine.

 

[DMK]

Just a FYI: you cannot count the pistol grip as a part to be compliant because the Saiga did not originally come with one. A compliance part must replace an original part.

Not exactly.

If you add an imported pistol grip, that counts against you whether the rifle originally had one or not. If you add an imported muzzle brake, that counts against you whether it had one originally or not.

You can't have more than 10 imported parts. It doesn't matter how many US parts you have. The ATF doesn't count US parts, they count imported parts. Replace the imported parts with US parts or just remove them completely, it doesn't matter. You just need to get your number under 10.

What imported parts count? These ones and only these ones:

http://gunwiki.net/bin/view/Gunwiki/BuildSaigaVerifyCompliance

In stock form, the Saiga rifle has 14 imported parts (that count regarding 9.22r). If you want to use a hi-cap mag, you could use a US mag (removes three imported parts), remove the front handguard and throw it away (removes one imported part). You are now legal.

Want to add a pistol grip to this Saiga? Now you have one more part on the list. If you use a US part, it doesn't count against you and you are G2G. If you use an imported grip, you need to remove an imported part somewhere else. Swap out the gas piston for a US made one and you've removed one more imported part, bringing you back under 10.

 

[JFtheGR8]

DMK. Thanks for expanding on that. I was merely stating that a U.S. made pistol grip doesn't count for compliance since it does not replace a foreign part and thus does not lower such part count.

 

[Nick5182]

If I were to get a Saiga, the only mod I'd do is add a Pistol grip stock, like the tapco(U.S. made) and get some U.S. Hi-cap mags.