Grizzly Adams
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Any gun is loaded that I have not personally cleared myself!
What is the definition of a "loaded" firearm?
- Thread starter Dope
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loaded?
The definition of "loaded" depends on context. For safe handling a gun is ALWAYs loaded unless dissasembled, and even then there are exceptions, for example the upper from a Luger can be made to fire without the frame.
For functional purposes, design, understanding how it works, etc, its loaded only if there is a round in the chamber, but we still have exceptions, how do you figure for a revolver?
Then there is the legal definition. Here in Iowa a firearm is loaded if the magazine is loaded, even if the magazine is not in the firearm. For example, if I lay a pistol in a case on the left side of my car trunk and lay the loaded magazine in another case on the right side of the trunk, that pistol is loaded. But we still have exceptions. If I have a muzzle loading rifle loaded but remove the cap then it's not loaded. But you won't catch me looking down the barrel to see what's in it.
The definition of "loaded" depends on context. For safe handling a gun is ALWAYs loaded unless dissasembled, and even then there are exceptions, for example the upper from a Luger can be made to fire without the frame.
For functional purposes, design, understanding how it works, etc, its loaded only if there is a round in the chamber, but we still have exceptions, how do you figure for a revolver?
Then there is the legal definition. Here in Iowa a firearm is loaded if the magazine is loaded, even if the magazine is not in the firearm. For example, if I lay a pistol in a case on the left side of my car trunk and lay the loaded magazine in another case on the right side of the trunk, that pistol is loaded. But we still have exceptions. If I have a muzzle loading rifle loaded but remove the cap then it's not loaded. But you won't catch me looking down the barrel to see what's in it.
ctdonath
Member
Yes: context is important. The term does not have an absolute definition.
For safety: all are loaded unless you've personally & recently proven otherwise. "It's not loaded" is probably the greatest famous last words, slightly edging out "hold muh beer and watch this".
For defense: magazine inserted, chamber may or may not be empty. Ready to fire, or just a slide-rack away.
For law: your jurisidction may vary. NY and others define "loaded" as "readily accessable".
For safety: all are loaded unless you've personally & recently proven otherwise. "It's not loaded" is probably the greatest famous last words, slightly edging out "hold muh beer and watch this".
For defense: magazine inserted, chamber may or may not be empty. Ready to fire, or just a slide-rack away.
For law: your jurisidction may vary. NY and others define "loaded" as "readily accessable".
Check your local statutes for the particulars as to what statndsard you;ll be held too if you're concerned for whatever reason about being prosecuted, but as a general rule a semi-automatic is "loaded" when one of the following occurs:
1. A cartridge is in the chamber
2. A magazine with cartridges is inserted.
1. A cartridge is in the chamber
2. A magazine with cartridges is inserted.
Thanks guys.
Judging by the myriad responses, there is no "standard" definition. I guess it depends on the person and even on the location.
While the explanation of the extremely obvious mindset of "all guns are always loaded" (or however you want to paraphrase it) was not what I was looking for, it's good to see that so many people are so adamant about safety. I'd rather have annoying safety nazis than people shooting each other by accident.
Personally, I was the one that considered a "loaded" firearm to be one with a round in the chamber or otherwise able to fire with a pull of the trigger. After thinking about it a bit though, I can't really consider a firearm with any ammo in it to be "unloaded" either. I guess there's no middle ground term. I will just have to be more descriptive when describing the state of a firearm. IE: instead of just saying "It's loaded" I will say "It's got a full mag but nothing chambered" or something along those lines.
Dope
Judging by the myriad responses, there is no "standard" definition. I guess it depends on the person and even on the location.
While the explanation of the extremely obvious mindset of "all guns are always loaded" (or however you want to paraphrase it) was not what I was looking for, it's good to see that so many people are so adamant about safety. I'd rather have annoying safety nazis than people shooting each other by accident.
Personally, I was the one that considered a "loaded" firearm to be one with a round in the chamber or otherwise able to fire with a pull of the trigger. After thinking about it a bit though, I can't really consider a firearm with any ammo in it to be "unloaded" either. I guess there's no middle ground term. I will just have to be more descriptive when describing the state of a firearm. IE: instead of just saying "It's loaded" I will say "It's got a full mag but nothing chambered" or something along those lines.
Dope
yesit'sloaded
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Reminds me of my favorite gun store. Guy clears it and hands it to me slide locked back. I inspect chamber and drop mag before dry firing. I give it back to him with the slide locked back with the mag in. He checks chamber and racks twice before dry firing and placing back under glass. For some reason that place has never had a ND.
romma
Member
The firearm is loaded up till I personally check the chamber, then after I check it as well... Look at the Glock Fotay man that relied on someone else clearing his firearm...
tydephan
Member
Pax summarized it pretty well (as usual.)
For autoloaders:
IMO, The gun is loaded when the magazine contains at least one round and the magazine is inserted in the pistol, regardless of whether there is a round in the pipe or not. However the opposite does not hold true. The gun is NOT unloaded when the magazine is removed. It is unloaded when the magazine is removed and the chamber is verified as empty (by me) using all means available, including but not limited to touch, vision, smell, ESP and the phone a friend lifeline from WWTBAM
For Revolvers:
I consider a revolver that has at least one round in the cylinder to be loaded.
For autoloaders:
IMO, The gun is loaded when the magazine contains at least one round and the magazine is inserted in the pistol, regardless of whether there is a round in the pipe or not. However the opposite does not hold true. The gun is NOT unloaded when the magazine is removed. It is unloaded when the magazine is removed and the chamber is verified as empty (by me) using all means available, including but not limited to touch, vision, smell, ESP and the phone a friend lifeline from WWTBAM
For Revolvers:
I consider a revolver that has at least one round in the cylinder to be loaded.
depends on the context. legally, in several states it is considered loaded if the magazine has rounds in it, even if the magazine is not even in the gun. or even in the same case.
from a safety prospective, best to consider it always loaded until and unless you prove otherwise
Not true. There are 3 conditions to a loaded firearm:
1) Cocked and locked (this is blurred by a double action auto)
2) Round chambered and hammer down (blurred by striker fired handguns)
3) Loaded magazine, empty chamber
In either of these states the gun is "loaded" it's just at a different state of readiness.
OpFlash
Member
Allow me to throw a curve ball.
For legal purposes such as transporting a weapon in your vehicle (excluding overzealous places as such places as Il, CA, or NY), is it considered loaded if you have rounds in one of those hollow stocks that hold ammunition? What about my Kel-Tek Sub2000 that has the extra mag holder attached that I normally keep a loaded magazine in? There definitely are live rounds IN the weapon, but they cannot be chambered without first removing them from where they are stored in the weapon and then reinserting them or the magazine properly. I've always wondered how an LEO or the courts would view my Sub2K as I normally carry it which is with a loaded mag in the attached holder but no mag in the grip and no round in the chamber. Loaded or unloaded?
For legal purposes such as transporting a weapon in your vehicle (excluding overzealous places as such places as Il, CA, or NY), is it considered loaded if you have rounds in one of those hollow stocks that hold ammunition? What about my Kel-Tek Sub2000 that has the extra mag holder attached that I normally keep a loaded magazine in? There definitely are live rounds IN the weapon, but they cannot be chambered without first removing them from where they are stored in the weapon and then reinserting them or the magazine properly. I've always wondered how an LEO or the courts would view my Sub2K as I normally carry it which is with a loaded mag in the attached holder but no mag in the grip and no round in the chamber. Loaded or unloaded?
I am not sure why but the state police gave up on their odd claim that a loaded magazine = a loaded gun maybe 20 years ago. It was just never supported by law. Maybe they bowed to the inevitable.
I can't say I blame you much for leaving Crook County. Most of the rest of the state outside of East St. Louis is not so bad.
Even if the slide is locked back and the mag is out, its still loaded. If you always treat a firearm as if it is loaded then you greatly decrease your chances of having to explain how you didnt mean to shoot the cat/lamp/wall because you didnt think it was loaded
What do you call a gun with a "bullet" in the chamber? I would call it jammed most likely, it depends on how the "bullet" got in there... was it a squib load?
Loaded is loaded, and yes - a full magazine inserted into the grip of a pistol is in fact loaded. It's called "Condition 3" by those in the know.
ihopewewin
Member
Ive always thought that if there was ammo in the mag then it was loaded.
The meaning of loaded:
Literal: Round in chamber for a semi, round in the next hole in the cylinder for a revolver.
Legal: Varies, but virtually all jurisdictions would consider a gun with a round in the magazine or chamber for a semi, or in the cylinder for a revolver, to be loaded. Many would consider having an unloaded gun and a loaded magazine in the same case loaded, some would even consider having a loaded magazine outside the case in the same area of the car as the unloaded gun to be loaded.
But for safety's sake, ALL GUNS ARE LOADED UNTIL YOU VERIFY OTHERWISE, AND EVEN THEN TREAT THEM AS IF THEY WERE!
Have you ever noticed how accidents always seem to happen with "unloaded" guns?
Literal: Round in chamber for a semi, round in the next hole in the cylinder for a revolver.
Legal: Varies, but virtually all jurisdictions would consider a gun with a round in the magazine or chamber for a semi, or in the cylinder for a revolver, to be loaded. Many would consider having an unloaded gun and a loaded magazine in the same case loaded, some would even consider having a loaded magazine outside the case in the same area of the car as the unloaded gun to be loaded.
But for safety's sake, ALL GUNS ARE LOADED UNTIL YOU VERIFY OTHERWISE, AND EVEN THEN TREAT THEM AS IF THEY WERE!
Have you ever noticed how accidents always seem to happen with "unloaded" guns?
I consider a gun loaded if I can shoot something with it within 5 seconds.
That means that if there is a loaded magazine next to the gun... its loaded. If a loaded magazine is in the gun... its loaded. If there is a bullet in the chamber... its loaded. If I can get a single bullet in the chamber in 5 seconds without a magazine.. its loaded.
I take the most liberal view of loaded.
That means that if there is a loaded magazine next to the gun... its loaded. If a loaded magazine is in the gun... its loaded. If there is a bullet in the chamber... its loaded. If I can get a single bullet in the chamber in 5 seconds without a magazine.. its loaded.
I take the most liberal view of loaded.
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