rodinal220
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Goex
What is Your Prefered Black Powder?
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Driftwood Johnson
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Howdy
I mostly load Black Powder in cartridges, such as 45 Colt, 45 Schofield, 44-40, and 44 Russian. Although I started using Goex back in the 1960s, today I prefer Schuetzen. Pretty much the same price as Goex, but it burns cleaner. Probably not as clean as Swiss, but it is much less expensive than Swiss. I mostly use FFg Schuetzen.
I mostly load Black Powder in cartridges, such as 45 Colt, 45 Schofield, 44-40, and 44 Russian. Although I started using Goex back in the 1960s, today I prefer Schuetzen. Pretty much the same price as Goex, but it burns cleaner. Probably not as clean as Swiss, but it is much less expensive than Swiss. I mostly use FFg Schuetzen.
351 WINCHESTER
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Dupont Superfine.
vagunmonkey
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Goex and Swiss.
J-Bar
Member
Presently have dabs of Schuetzen, KIK, Goex, 777, and Pyrodex in the magazine.
Schuetzen and KIK go into the percussion revolvers, the rest go into cartridges and shotshells. The reason being I think Schuetzen and KIK ignite easier and foul less in a percussion revolver.
Your mileage may vary.
Schuetzen and KIK go into the percussion revolvers, the rest go into cartridges and shotshells. The reason being I think Schuetzen and KIK ignite easier and foul less in a percussion revolver.
Your mileage may vary.
I'm about to try Black MZ. As I have said, I almost always use T7 but if MZ performance is similar I might switch.
Don't get me wrong, I really like T7 but it performs best when only minimally compressed. That is sometimes difficult to achieve since it so fluffy. It's like compressing cotton. I modified my D/D loader to us a positive stop to make sure that the bullet seats at the same depth in each chamber.
The directions on Black MZ say to use a lot of compression. That may make it easier to load more consistently. We'll see. The chronograph doesn't lie.
Don't get me wrong, I really like T7 but it performs best when only minimally compressed. That is sometimes difficult to achieve since it so fluffy. It's like compressing cotton. I modified my D/D loader to us a positive stop to make sure that the bullet seats at the same depth in each chamber.
The directions on Black MZ say to use a lot of compression. That may make it easier to load more consistently. We'll see. The chronograph doesn't lie.
I began shooting with Pyrodex as my father gave me some P and RS when I got my pistol. I wanted power, though, as I was trying to obtain 45 Colt levels, and from what numbers I was seeing with Pyrodex and Goex the levels were closer to a 38 Spl. So I chose Triple 7 as I couldn't find any Swiss locally, and I was happy.
But then Goex offered Olde Eynsford, a sporting grade powder to compete with Swiss. And what little I could find where a head to head was done all 3 (Swiss, Olde E, and T7) gave similar performance by volume. So I bought a pound to try out....
And I liked it!
It's only $1/lb more than Goex at Grafs ($16/lb vs $15) and it is much cleaner than Pyrodex, which I dislike quite a bit. And it's about $4.60/lb cheaper than T7 there as well.
But then Goex offered Olde Eynsford, a sporting grade powder to compete with Swiss. And what little I could find where a head to head was done all 3 (Swiss, Olde E, and T7) gave similar performance by volume. So I bought a pound to try out....
And I liked it!
It's only $1/lb more than Goex at Grafs ($16/lb vs $15) and it is much cleaner than Pyrodex, which I dislike quite a bit. And it's about $4.60/lb cheaper than T7 there as well.
BullSlinger
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AbitNutz, I have been trying Alliant-mz and so far like it. It has pep and shoots POA at 25 meters for me (ROA 30gr Alliant, 457 rb, CCI #11). Will try it out on my other revolvers this week.
Yes I know it's not the "HOLY BLACK". I don't care if its dirt if it puts the lead where I want it to go and cleans up easily.
Yes I know it's not the "HOLY BLACK". I don't care if its dirt if it puts the lead where I want it to go and cleans up easily.
bonza
Member
Used quite a bit of Swiss, but found that KIK pretty much duplicates the performance for considerably less cost. I use 1.5Fg in my m/l bullet rifles, .577 Snider, .577/.450 Martini, & smoothbore musket, & 3Fg in my c&b revolver and other bp handguns.
Steel Horse Rider
Member
You have discovered what it is like to ask what oil should I use or what tires are best on a motorcycle forum. I have used both Goex and Pyrodex in my muzzle loaders. I have not noticed any difference in the cleaning process but many others experiences will vary according to their opinions......
Blackhorn 209. There's essentially no residue after the shot so swabbing between shots is not required. And it cleans up with the solvent you use to clean your centerfire rifle or shotgun so you don't have to initiate rust by cleaning your firearm with water.
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How do you know when its compressed to much? Have you tried both 2F and 3F in the T7?
Yeah i dont get that, i went to a training class once and there was a guy talking about shooting black powder and once i mentioned pyrodex or T7 he acted like he didnt want to even talk to me any more. Its like if you shoot anything besides REAL black powder your cheating or something. They say the fun of shooting these guns is experimenting but god forbid you use anything but REAL black powder when you do?
I use T7 and synthetic lead balls in my REPRODUCTION guns.
So here's what happens when you compress T7 too much. The accuracy goes stupid due to inconsistent velocity. You can't really tell when just shooting it but when you fire it over a chronograph it definitely shows up. T7 when just lightly compressed throws really consistent shots.
If your'e shooting medium loads that leave more than enough room for your ball/bullet, just measure how much depth you have and do some cipherin' and gazintas to seat your favorite projectile.
If your'e shooting max loads, like 45 grains with a 220 grain bullet, it's even easier. You just seat it till it clears the chamber mouth. If your groups go whacky...well, start deducting powder. This is where a loader really works well. I made a ram stop for my "Tower of Power" that works shockingly well. Every bullet I seat is exactly at the same depth.
With T7 you really can get 50 grains in a deepened cylinder or a Classicballistx. It's about even with the chamber mouth but it's so fluffy that you can mash it mash it down pretty easily.
If your'e shooting medium loads that leave more than enough room for your ball/bullet, just measure how much depth you have and do some cipherin' and gazintas to seat your favorite projectile.
If your'e shooting max loads, like 45 grains with a 220 grain bullet, it's even easier. You just seat it till it clears the chamber mouth. If your groups go whacky...well, start deducting powder. This is where a loader really works well. I made a ram stop for my "Tower of Power" that works shockingly well. Every bullet I seat is exactly at the same depth.
With T7 you really can get 50 grains in a deepened cylinder or a Classicballistx. It's about even with the chamber mouth but it's so fluffy that you can mash it mash it down pretty easily.
AABEN
Member
I like Goex FFF and use Pyrodex P. I have powder left over from the early 80 and it still does it job.
Bower64 said:
As you are probably already aware, there are idiots in all walks of life not just the shooting sports. Actually I think that there are fewer in our sport than others by far.
As far as real versus substitutes are concerned there are some very real concerns on this forum for those who refer to Pyrodex etc. as Black Powder, it has to do with safety. There are probably as many lurkers on THR at least as there are active members. Those lurkers might or might not recognize the difference in some of the more advanced conversations on this forum. Failure to recognize the difference if it isn't plainly stated could lead to a zero compression Black Powder or Pyrodex load or an air-space load leading to a catastrophic failure. Also, someone believing that Pyrodex is Black Powder might be inclined to weigh it instead of measure it by volume which could also lead to a problem with something like a brass gun. Keep in mind that there are a BUNCH of people out there who actually think that TrailBoss is Black Powder and it's not even black!!
It's not that those of us who abhor substitutes never want ANYBODY to use them, what we don't want is for somebody to dump a chamber full of T7 into a fake navy and hit the target with the barrel instead of the ball.
I've used Pyrodex in the past when I couldn't get Black Powder and I'll be honest with you, about the only difference that I noticed was that it didn't always ignite the best.
ThorinNNY
Member
Goex.
Well ok then, i sure didnt get a welcome to our sport of black powder feeling ill tell you that.
Go over to a traditional forum and the flames can get pretty dadgum hot!
Funny how they complain that the traditional aspect has been fading all the while getting obnoxiously crazy about doing it their way.
I began with a more modern approach thinking I needed sabots and modern bullets and such, but because of the fellows who were more patient and easy going I have moved past it and became interested in the more traditional ways and tools.
The way I see it is if you can get them interested it may very well lead them into the other aspects of it, and we all need to stick together as long as it's legal.
Funny how they complain that the traditional aspect has been fading all the while getting obnoxiously crazy about doing it their way.
I began with a more modern approach thinking I needed sabots and modern bullets and such, but because of the fellows who were more patient and easy going I have moved past it and became interested in the more traditional ways and tools.
The way I see it is if you can get them interested it may very well lead them into the other aspects of it, and we all need to stick together as long as it's legal.
loose noose
Member
I use anything in the real black powder as long as it is the real thing. Goex, KIK, Swiss, Elephant, like I said I won't even shoot the "make believes" in any of my many BP arms.
Don McDowell
Member
If a person lives anyplace UPS or FedEx delivers, then buying blackpowder is as simple as placing an order with Powder Inc, or Grafs..
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