What kind of rifle can do this?
- Thread starter psyCel
- Start date
- Status
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Pretty much any firearm will shoot more than a mile (the maximum range of a typical deer rifle, IIRC, is around 3000-3500 yards at 25-30 degrees elevation). Even a .22LR will shoot a mile.
The trick is having a gun that is accurate enough to hit the desired target at 1760 yards. Ideally, you'd like a cartridge/bullet combination in which the bullet stays supersonic until it hits the target, because the supersonic-subsonic transition (transonic region) erraticly disturbs the bullet's flight and can mess up accuracy. A flat-shooting gun helps by reducing elevation errors related to range estimation, though even a .50 BMG bullet is falling like a brick at 1760 yards.
As some have mentioned, .50 and .338 are supersonic beyond a mile, and smaller calibers can also do that with the right choice of bullets and initial velocity. Ross Seyfried built a .30-416 for target shooting at a mile, and methinks the 7mm WSM will do it as well with the right loads.
Here's a group shot with a 7mm WSM at 1000 yards:
The trick is having a gun that is accurate enough to hit the desired target at 1760 yards. Ideally, you'd like a cartridge/bullet combination in which the bullet stays supersonic until it hits the target, because the supersonic-subsonic transition (transonic region) erraticly disturbs the bullet's flight and can mess up accuracy. A flat-shooting gun helps by reducing elevation errors related to range estimation, though even a .50 BMG bullet is falling like a brick at 1760 yards.
As some have mentioned, .50 and .338 are supersonic beyond a mile, and smaller calibers can also do that with the right choice of bullets and initial velocity. Ross Seyfried built a .30-416 for target shooting at a mile, and methinks the 7mm WSM will do it as well with the right loads.
Here's a group shot with a 7mm WSM at 1000 yards:
The remote aiming device in Shooter is real!
The website they gave out in the movie is genuine, too:
http://www.precisionremotes.com/
It is called the TRAP system (Telepresent Rapid Aiming Platform) and is being evaluated by the military for several uses. If you have seen the SWORDS robot on the Military channel, Discovery, etc. it is a version of TRAP on a TALON robot chassis.
The TRAP is capable of just better than .2 MOA in aiming precision. Even with the LRF unit and ballistic drop compensation reticle, you still have to be a trained marksman to make long shots with any rifle, manned or remote operated.
It was still fun to see TRAP show up in the movie - I wouldn't go see any crap with Wahlberg or Glover otherwise...
The website they gave out in the movie is genuine, too:
http://www.precisionremotes.com/
It is called the TRAP system (Telepresent Rapid Aiming Platform) and is being evaluated by the military for several uses. If you have seen the SWORDS robot on the Military channel, Discovery, etc. it is a version of TRAP on a TALON robot chassis.
The TRAP is capable of just better than .2 MOA in aiming precision. Even with the LRF unit and ballistic drop compensation reticle, you still have to be a trained marksman to make long shots with any rifle, manned or remote operated.
It was still fun to see TRAP show up in the movie - I wouldn't go see any crap with Wahlberg or Glover otherwise...
Attachments
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2003
- Messages
- 13,341
All I know is that the next time I hear some gun show commando tell Hathcock's Bicycle story in first person with him being that person I am going to throw up!
They are usually the same gun counter commandos who "served" with Marcinko after their successful sniper career in the "Nam".
They are usually the same gun counter commandos who "served" with Marcinko after their successful sniper career in the "Nam".
sacp81170a
Member
I bow down in awe....
Zak Smith
Member
Hey, you're talking about me!!! 
marksman13 is right when he says it involes "skill, science, and luck".
However, there is a lot of mysticism that surrounds long-range shooting because so few people get the chance to do it. And thus we get a lot of replies like how you need a 50BMG to make hits at 1000 yards and only a super ninja monk can do it. On the other side, there is false bravado those that claim they can shoot 2" groups at 800 yards all day long with their Dragunov. The truth is somewhere in the middle.
I have taken a new shooter who has never shot a long-range rifle before, and had them hitting a 1000-yard silhouette in under 10 minutes... with my gun, ammunition, and data.
As other have said, you need a cartridge that will make it to the max distance before going trans-sonic, and you need a rifle with sufficient mechanical accuracy, and then it's all you. The other issue is the air density, which can change the max effective range of a cartridge 500 yards or more (from a cold day @ sea level to a hot day at 8000').
Super-duper calibers are not needed to make hits at long range. I have hit a 2' diameter target at 1340 yards with a 308 (albiet only about 50% of the time-- the misses were unspottable).. and that's 3/4 of a mile. 1/2 mile is "only" 880 yards, which is well within 308's range (though I'd take my 260 over the 308 any day). There are a lot of calibers that can make it that far, but you need high BC values. At my altitude, 260, 6.5-284, 300WM, 6.5x47, 7RM, 388LM, etc, should all make it there provided the right load is used. Detecting hits from the smaller 6.5mm calibers may be difficult since they are not as audible on steel.
The last time we were shooting at a mile, it took both the 50BMG and the 338LM's present a shot or two to get the wind figured out, and then they were making hits. At 1340 (again, 3/4th mile), hitting a 2' diameter circle with the 338's was boring... well, until the wind changed again. At that distance, each 1 mph crosswind (averaged) pushes the bullet another approx 8 inches. It's easy to see how a very slight change in condition can yield misses.
-z
marksman13 is right when he says it involes "skill, science, and luck".
However, there is a lot of mysticism that surrounds long-range shooting because so few people get the chance to do it. And thus we get a lot of replies like how you need a 50BMG to make hits at 1000 yards and only a super ninja monk can do it. On the other side, there is false bravado those that claim they can shoot 2" groups at 800 yards all day long with their Dragunov. The truth is somewhere in the middle.
I have taken a new shooter who has never shot a long-range rifle before, and had them hitting a 1000-yard silhouette in under 10 minutes... with my gun, ammunition, and data.
As other have said, you need a cartridge that will make it to the max distance before going trans-sonic, and you need a rifle with sufficient mechanical accuracy, and then it's all you. The other issue is the air density, which can change the max effective range of a cartridge 500 yards or more (from a cold day @ sea level to a hot day at 8000').
Super-duper calibers are not needed to make hits at long range. I have hit a 2' diameter target at 1340 yards with a 308 (albiet only about 50% of the time-- the misses were unspottable).. and that's 3/4 of a mile. 1/2 mile is "only" 880 yards, which is well within 308's range (though I'd take my 260 over the 308 any day). There are a lot of calibers that can make it that far, but you need high BC values. At my altitude, 260, 6.5-284, 300WM, 6.5x47, 7RM, 388LM, etc, should all make it there provided the right load is used. Detecting hits from the smaller 6.5mm calibers may be difficult since they are not as audible on steel.
The last time we were shooting at a mile, it took both the 50BMG and the 338LM's present a shot or two to get the wind figured out, and then they were making hits. At 1340 (again, 3/4th mile), hitting a 2' diameter circle with the 338's was boring... well, until the wind changed again. At that distance, each 1 mph crosswind (averaged) pushes the bullet another approx 8 inches. It's easy to see how a very slight change in condition can yield misses.
-z
geekWithA.45
Moderator Emeritus
Doping the wind is the skill most shooters lack for long distance shooting, largely for lack of practice.
Out my ways, most ranges only go out 100 yards, and the wind is a negligible influence that close. There's only one I can think of that stretches to 500.
Out my ways, most ranges only go out 100 yards, and the wind is a negligible influence that close. There's only one I can think of that stretches to 500.
griz
Member
The professional High Power shooter David Tubb has a video about making a shot at a mile. I don't remember the caliber but it was a "real" rifle, not a 50. It was a bit windy and it took a couple shots to get on target, then he shot a group. But to hit a man sized target at one mile on the first shot? Nobody can count on that.
- Status
Similar threads
