What to do with my old S&W 19-3

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ironlung

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Let me start by saying what a great site to find out here on the internet!!!


Well I have an old 19-3. It is blue finish with 4 inch barrel. The serial dates to 1973. My family purchased the revolver from a friend in law enforcement in the mid 80's when his department switched to semi-auto.

My dad gave it to me when I was 16 back in the early 90's. I shot alot(+15,000) of 38 special at my range. 99% of the 38 special was 800 fps lead wadcutters. The range did not allow magnums.

I also did some cosmetic damage opening the side plate a little more carelessly than I should have.

Fast forward 10+ years away from the hobby(1 day at a time:confused:).

The old range is long gone and the new range happily allows magnums. So I get a white box full of target/range 125grain .357 magnums.

On my third set of six round I notice a change in report on a few rounds and get a little spatter of hot particles hitting my face.

Halfway through the box I get the strange report and spatter and notice cocking the hammer takes a little more effort for the next shot.

Fire the next shot and it locked up tight as a drum. The cylinder will not rotate or drop. I talk to the range gunsmith and he states I have a bent crane.:cuss:

So I take it home and start my google search(and found this site) only to find out that Smith & Wesson were aware of K frames having trouble digesting 125 grain mag loads and warned against using them in K frames.:banghead:


Have you read this far? Boy your persistent!


So I ask the board what direction to take this old classic? Assuming the forcing cone is still intact (Smith claims no new barrels for 19-3).

What is the best way to take this project?

Is this revolver "special" and should be returned to factory original function and finish?

Is this revolver "common" and could be taken as an opportunity to get a laundry list of Smith & Wesson Performance Center work done on the old 6 shooter?


Thanks for your time,

Ironlung
 
A 19-3 is definitely worth "saving" that's for sure. :)

Someone smarter than me will come along with just how to do it.
 
Well, it's "common", but they aren't making any more of them. IMO, it'd be a shame to "modernize" it. I'd send it to a good gunsmith, preferably one who knows his way around S&W revolvers, and have it mechanically restored. If you have the money, and it's worth it to you in sentimental value (the monetary value of the gun will be exceeded by the cost of cosmetic work) then you can have it carefully refinished as well.
 
You do have options.

Not having examined the revolver, hard to know if your diagnoses is correct.

What I heard the old M19’s and M66’s had with 125 grain bullets was cracked forcing cones. Not crane issues.

The splatter you had was probably lead splatter, and I suspect the revolver is out of time.

You can shoot a lot of 38 Special rounds through the K frames, but still there is the chance the thing was out of time. Then you fired a 357 through it, and the barrel was not aligned with the cylinder, and something got bent.

Cranes do bend, and guns do get out of time. If you like the thing, get it fixed.

You can call Smith and Wesson and see what services they offer. I talked to them last year, there is a cut off date for warranty work, and if the revolver is too old, they don’t have parts.

You can also call recognized gunsmiths and see if they will handle. Just buy a gun magazine and look in the classified ads.
 
A 19-3 is definitely worth "saving" that's for sure.
Click to expand...

+1

So I take it home and start my google search(and found this site) only to find out that Smith & Wesson were aware of K frames having trouble digesting 125 grain mag loads and warned against using them in K frames.
Click to expand...


Well, sorta.. There is/was a problem for smaller framed s&w revos in relation to forcing cone errosion.

I talk to the range gunsmith and he states I have a bent crane.
Click to expand...

Not the end of the world, this is something that can be fixed. I had a similar problem with another brand of revo and the factory fixed it in very short order.
 
I'd love to have a Model 19, but can't really afford a new gun right now. Send it to me (I'll even pay shipping - that's just the kind of guy I am). I'll get it fixed and cherish it - and I'll thank you every time I fire it! ;)
 
Lets see if I get this right, the RO got the cylinder open and determined that the crane was bent? Or, because the cylinder wouldn't open, he assumed the crane was bent. It very well could be that the ejector rod has backed out slightly, that will lock them up in a heartbeat. The diet of .38 special and wad cutters could have leaded the forceing cone and barrel up enought that it was causeing some cylinder gap splatter. I wouldn't assume the worst until it was checked over completely by a competent smith, or by someone who shoots lots of revolvers.
 
Pictures please. As xring44 said...I have never seen a mod 19 bend a crane over a few 125 grain magnums. Have a competent gunsmith look at it. I bet it is just jammed with excess lead or as xring44 says...
 
I concur with xring44.

I've had similar problems that I swore up and down were a crane issue, only to have them clear up with a good cleaning.

It does sound like your revolver is out of time, and needs a good Smith 'smith.
But I'd wager that the lead debris from the spitting has more to do with the stuck cylinder than any bent crane.

And as ozarkman said, the issue with 125 gr. .357's was premature eroding and (in severe cases) cracking of the forcing cone. And yes, if that happens, you're screwed unless you can find someone who'll sell you an old barrel, 'cause they ain't making them anymore.
158 gr. bullets in moderation should be OK (lower velocity), but an 80-90% diet of .38's is best.

Good luck. You've got one of the finest firearms ever made (IMHO), and someone ought to be able to get you up and running again.
 
Bent crane, no problem having it fixed by S&W. Play gangsta' with the gun by flipping the cylinder out and in with a flick of the wrist and that's what you get. Now that you are all grown up you can quit doing that.

Cracked forcing cone and need a barrel replacement, you are out of luck getting a new one from S&W. The full powered 125's cracked the forcing cone in the thinned out part on the bottom, they didn't bend the crane. This was usually damage caused by many rounds of this type not just 1 box of ammo. Lead spitting is a timing issue and can be repaired.
 
So I ask the board what direction to take this old classic? Assuming the forcing cone is still intact (Smith claims no new barrels for 19-3).

What is the best way to take this project?
Click to expand...

If it is in fact a bent crane, send it to S&W or your smith of choice to fix. It shouldn't be to horribly expensive.

s this revolver "special" and should be returned to factory original function and finish?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't. Make it shootable and shoot the heck out of it.
 
The problem may have been the “white box” .357 ammunition…

But anyway, I suggest that you return the revolver to Smith & Wesson’s service department to get a diagnosis and opinion. They can and will gauge the parts to determine if anything is bent or out of spec. The company clearly has resources that your local range ‘smith doesn’t. If repairs are needed that don’t fall under warrantee work they will send you a quote saying in advance what the cost will be. You have the choice of either sending them the money so that the work can proceed, or having it sent back “as is.” Unless the gun has been more seriously damaged then is suspected it would be well worth fixing.
 
I would ship it back to S & W. I had a cylinder lock up on my model 19. I was able to open it and unload it. I think you have to do that to be able to ship it. I wrote to S & W, and they wrote back and said send it to them. They had to replace the cylinder and a few other parts. You can ship a handgun directly to the manufacturer by UPS, and they can ship it back to you. I was very pleased with their service, but this was a bit over 20 years ago.
 
Ah, those old things are junk. You should send it to me right away for, ummm, proper disposal. I'll even send you a hundred bucks for the scrap steel. :evil:

I'm another who'll recommend contacting the factory for diagnosis and treatment. I discovered some of the best customer service I've ever encountered when I got in touch with Smith & Wesson's Customer Support department last fall; they're at the following email address:

[email protected]

If that address is only for warranty work (the reason I corresponded with them), then I'm sure that they'll put you in touch with the right people at their shop.

Their telephone number is 1-800-331-0852, and I was given extension 2905 to call (if I'd needed to call) in one correspondence that I had with them.

If it should turn out that you need a barrel, Numrich Arms is currently listing blued, 3-inch heavy barrels for Model 13s and Model 19s as available from them for seventy bucks. That's not the 4-in bbl. that you mentioned, but it would be better than having no barrels available at all.

Here's a link to the 3" Model 19 barrel at Numrich Arms.

I don't know if the pinned-vs.-unpinned barrel difference would be a problem (I'm guessing that a 19-3 has a pinned barrel and recessed chambers?). I haven't switched or replaced any revolver barrels. The factory or the more knowledgeable people here will be able to tell you that.

Best of luck with that great old revolver.
 
That Model 13-19 3" barrel Numrich is advertising looks like it's got a Model 13 (non adjustable sight) ramp front sight that may or may not work with the Model 19 rear sight?
I understand the "very rare" 3" Model 19 barrel is full lugged (but there is much about S&W K frames I don't know).
I agree however with the above posts that suggest having a local "Smith" gunsmith look the gun over before taking the range "gunny's" diagnosis at face value.
 
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I've used S&W for repairs alot and they do great work. But if you have a good gunsmith close by that's where I would go.

Most gunsmiths are cheaper and faster than you would think and it won't hurt to get to know one in person..
 
Thanks all

Thanks for all the response.

Just to clarify the range smith said the crane and extractor rod was bent. I got it open and empty in the range stall. I pushed the thumb release and at the same time pushed back the little pin at the forward end of the extractor rod(with a small screwdriver) for more clearance. The cylinder swung open with a little force.

The extractor rod is clearly bent. You can see it by eye. When it is open and you turn the cylinder by hand you can see the runout(of the cylinder).

I checked the cylinder to barrel gap clearance with a set of feelers. Depending on the chamber you check the gap varies between .008" and .013".

It's all twisted up.:)

In my defense I was a curious teen that just wanted a little peek inside the lockwork to see how it worked. Couple of mangled screws and a peened up edge of the sideplate are all it cost.:eek: Slick little mechanism though. (NO GANSTA WRIST FLIPS):eek:

I agree with the assesment that the out of alingment condition of the bore and cylinder existed way before the magnums twisted it up. Two of the teeth on the ratchet of the cylinder have visible notches where the finger pushes them. The other four look worn.

My father said he bought it for $100 in 1983 and it was "used". I think the timing was off even before I shot a zillion 38 specials through it. The magnums just finished it off.

It does have sentimental value for me. Consensus here seems to point to the factory to do the job. To be honest they were my only consideration.

So far most votes are to leave the 19-3 original. Fix the damage, fix the timing and factory refinish the gouges, peens, scratches and wear from the high polish blue. That's it.

One guy said to just fix the damage and shoot the heck out of it. So I'll put him as 1 vote for the Performance center Combat revolver package, master revolver action package and a bead blast satin blue finish. Because I would shoot the heck out of that!:D

$500-$700 is in the budget.:D


Pictures to fallow...
 
I was right. You should send that piece of junk to me. ;)

Seriously, nice piece. It should last for many more happy years of shooting once you get it repaired.
 
as posted by doublesharp-
Click to expand...

"Im not that sentimental, $500-700 will buy you a like new model 19-3"



Wow~! I have a pristine 4" barrel (factory nickel) S&W model 19-3
that I only gave $350 for, back in December of '07; complete ANIB
with all documentation, but minus the "tool kit". Very slightly used,
test fired only 37 times with 158 grain L-SWC (low velocity) .38
Specials. Then, cleaned - polished, put back in the box; NEVER
too be fired again, as its a family heirloom too be passed down
to the next of kin. Even when I handle this handgun, its with
non powdered rubber gloves; in order too preserve its distinct
"old timey flavor". Not really that old, as its 7K26xxx S/N dates
it back to 1975; or the Bangor Punta era of Smith & Wesson;
but its a solid performer, and deserves too be treasured~! ;)

You ask, "would I sell it for that aforementioned $500-700"~?
No way Jose, as its a "SAFE QUEEN"- only to be admired by
those that know quality guns when they see 'em~!
 
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