What's the attraction to cheap rifles

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I’ll be honest, I don’t understand the appeal of cheap firearms. Give me a Ruger No. 1 over a NEF Handi Rifle. Give me Winchester M70 over a Ruger American. Give me a Larue or Falkor over a Diamondback or DPMS. I’d rather spend the money and feel the quality. I’d rather buy a used Remington 700 or Model Seven than a new Ruger American or Savage 110 if I need a beater rifle. That said, I use all my rifles and I don’t abuse them, but there’s very few I would cry about if they happened to get dinged or scratched.
 
South Prairie Jim said:
As the title says , I'm trying to understand what it is that draws people to these cheap rifles , are they going into the safe with the good rifles?
Are they going to be handed down after we're gone ?
Is it just that we are looking for a project ?
If money is an issue why not save a little longer for a quality rifle?
J
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I've got a beautiful Henry Big Boy brass .357 carbine that I'm always afraid I'll scratch so I don't shoot it much but do like to look at it. I also have a Rossi .44 carbine in blue -- that cost half of what the Henry cost -- that I absolutely love shooting and just don't worry about scratching it up. That's the beauty of a "cheap" firearm, seems to me....
 
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marksman13 said:
Give me a Ruger No. 1 over a NEF Handi Rifle. Give me Winchester M70 over a Ruger American. Give me a Larue or Falkor over a Diamondback or DPMS.
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I think for most firearms enthusiasts, they'd agree with you on pretty much all of those, if money were not part of the equation.

Speaking for myself, I'd love to have an upgrade of every rifle that I own. But, I simply don't have the expendable income. Could I have bought 2 nicer rifles for the cost of the 4-5 that I have? Sure, but then I'd probably only have a 22 rifle and once centerfire rifle, albeit very nice ones. I'd rather have my bases covered with less expensive, but still quality rifles than spend more and settle for a jack of all trades, master of none caliber for my centerfire rifle. I've purchased what I believe to be the best options to cover MY needs on MY budget.

It's kind of like cars, really. I currently drive a Saturn Aura. It's not flashy, its not fast, its not expensive, but its reliable and its paid off. Would I love to be driving a new sports car? Absolutely. But do I need one? Nope.
 
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entropy said:
South Prairie Jim, you must hate my $29 Savage Axis II:

View attachment 963731
Shoots like this:

View attachment 963738

50 yards. I've shot better grouping guns, but this is more than accurate enough for my uses, though I plan on putting it in a Boyd's stock, and topping it with better glass. The Bushnell 3-9 it came with works, obviously, but between the stock and better scope I hope to tighten it up an bit, and for $29 for the gun, I will be able to afford to.
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I have no experience with a Savage Axis 11 , so I really can't comment on your rifle except that if you like it then that's fine.
 
theotherwaldo said:
To me, most of the fun that comes from using any device comes from the process of learning how to get the best out of that device.
Learning its quirks, its limitations, where it works with or against you,
It is at least as challenging to get passable results from a mediocre device as it is to excel with an excellent device.
I like challenges... .
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Passable results , hmm ill have to think about that
 
South Prairie Jim said:
I have no experience with a Savage Axis 11 , so I really can't comment on your rifle except that if you like it then that's fine.
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Its an Axis II (2). Its the Savage Axis with the upgrade of an Accutrigger.

The Axis is a (relatively) rough but functional and accurate rifle IMO. Mine has honestly impressed me so far, bolt is FAR smoother than it has a right to be at its price, though that is not a characteristic that is universal among Axises/Axes/whatever the plural is.
 
Me and the dog were out on a hunt/hike twice in the last week in pouring down rain.

"It's not the thing,it's what you do with it"

Heck,we have woods here that are so pretty and figured they'll practically make your eyes bleed. Have been in the wood biz for 50 years. I love cheap plastic factory stocks.... they sure don't spend much time in the safe.

Good luck with your shooting.
 
BigBL87 said:
Its an Axis II (2). Its the Savage Axis with the upgrade of an Accutrigger.

The Axis is a (relatively) rough but functional and accurate rifle IMO. Mine has honestly impressed me so far, bolt is FAR smoother than it has a right to be at its price, though that is not a characteristic that is universal among Axises/Axes/whatever the plural is.
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Mucho Axis
 
BigBL87 said:
Its an Axis II (2). Its the Savage Axis with the upgrade of an Accutrigger.

The Axis is a (relatively) rough but functional and accurate rifle IMO. Mine has honestly impressed me so far, bolt is FAR smoother than it has a right to be at its price, though that is not a characteristic that is universal among Axises/Axes/whatever the plural is.
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Savage seems to screw up and turn out some amazingly smooth bolts from time to time. On average they tend to be a bit balkier, and wobblier than other guns, or at least that been my experience over about 6 of them. I tend to shy away from savage rifles simply because of the feel of the actions is a little less refined than other guns in their price range. Accuracy is usually fantastic, and they MOSTLY function well.
I havent had any of the most recent rifles tho, so that may have changed again in the last year or two, for better or worse.
 
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South Prairie Jim said:
In reverse where do you draw the line in the sand ?
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That's the big question. To ME, below $300 is cheap for a rifle but there are lots of "budget" rifles that sell for more than that.

To me, one of the funny things about the "buy a better rifle" thing is oftentimes on here or other forums, the refrain regardless of the rifle in question will be "well if you can afford X, why not save a little more and buy Y." Doesn't matter the price/rifle you're starting with, you'll typically see multiple people say basically that.
 
LoonWulf said:
Savage seems to screw up, and turn out some amazingly smooth bolts from time to time. On average they tend to be a bit balkier, and wobblier than other guns, or at least that been my experience over about 6 of them. I tend to shy away from savage rifles simply because of the feel of the actions is a little less refined than other guns in their price range. Accuracy is usually fantastic, and they MOSTLY function well.
I havent had any of the most recent rifles tho, so that may have changed again in the last year or two, for better or worse.
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Ya, my new Axis really surprised me. The bolt isn't as smooth as my Vanguard, but it honestly isn't far off. I was shocked. My brother-in-law fondled the rifle at time he stopped by and he was equally surprised.
 
The Savage rifle i own ( model 12 BVSS started life as a 308) then progressed into the rifle in my Avatar but as pointed out Savage actions are a liability in the end.
 
As a gun trader I hope to get good value. Fit and finish, aesthetics, and function. I have traded 2 & 3 guns to buy one. I have/ had low end and moderate priced rifles. @Poper said in post #62 that the Weatherby Mark V is expensive. For many it is, I can't argue that. For some it is their low end rifle. Most hunters can get by with a low price rifle that offers the best value.
One part of the equation is the value of the scope that is mounted on the rifle. I like Leopolds, the low end scopes fit well on similarly priced rifles. As you go up in rifle price you can go up with scope quality .

I currently have four rifles a Weatherby Mark V and three Savage Axis (Walmart clearance rifles).
I have as much invested in the scope on the Weatherby as I do in all three Savage rifles with scopes.
The Savage rifles are fun to shoot and offer acceptable hunting accuracy. I have not had any problems with the rifles, but haven't shot or owned them very long.
The Weatherby is twenty years old killed many, many deer and will be the last rifle I would get rid of. The fit and finish is excellent. Function is extremely reliable and accuracy is very good.

The hunting accuracy of the Savage compared to the Weatherby is a wash. The other qualities is the true difference.

I have owned rifles from most of the major manufacturers and would not say any were junk. Some shot better than others. I didn't like the controls on a few and that is why they left me. Others I wish I still owned (hind sight is 20/20).

I would never tell someone that they should wait to buy a rifle of they don't have one. The second rifle, wait and buy a rifle that fits you well and covers your needs. The third rifle is when you refine your wants.

Safe shooting!
 
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Im curious about that Axis ignition issue myself. Im wondering if the "washer" ....typing that got me thinking and a quick google search ...found this page.
https://deshind.com/2020/03/24/new-bolt-lift-kit/
Id bet that right there would fix most of the light strike issues, as well as improve bolt lift. On my personal gun id probably go back to a single piece firing pin spring

Also as note, if the dudes right then the 110 series is getting axis like firing pin. If there IS a design issue we should start hearing about it more frequently.
 
There's a few guy's on accurate shooter that work on Savage bolts.
Mine I had a Smith work on. ( $100.00 worth) much improved but I still cannot get 10 rounds on a 1k target before the conditions change.
 
LoonWulf said:
Im curious about that Axis ignition issue myself. Im wondering if the "washer" ....typing that got me thinking and a quick google search ...found this page.
https://deshind.com/2020/03/24/new-bolt-lift-kit/
Id bet that right there would fix most of the light strike issues, as well as improve bolt lift. On my personal gun id probably go back to a single piece firing pin spring

Also as note, if the dudes right then the 110 series is getting axis like firing pin. If there IS a design issue we should start hearing about it more frequently.
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Im told that light strikes and incorrect pin fall adversly effects accuracy
 
South Prairie Jim said:
How's the ignition ?
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Don't know yet, haven't had it out. Just cleaned it and fondled it so far. Illinois weather and COVID haven't been friendly.

South Prairie Jim said:
Most BIL just want your beer
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Ironically enough, he was stopping by to pick up some beer we'd bought for him. :D He works at an ethanol plant and is a big Busch Light guy. We were driving back from Nebraska and found some corn cob looking Busch Light silo cans, so we had to pick some up for him.
 
Have done the bolt ball bearing thing on at least one of the Savages here.... CRS on the others. This is an old flat back stainless LA 116.

It helps a little. Don't know diddly about the new ones but the old flat backs you can easily change the FP protrusion. The reason I know is that above 116 which,had seen some really hot.... slightly over book loads of 4350 and 150g Sierras..... got to where it was having ignition issues. First thing to do was order a new FP spring. It was in that bit of dinking around that I saw where you can change the pin fall.

More towards the OP.... years ago,say before 1980,you couldn't give away a Savage. We used to buy them all day long for a $100 spot. We were changing barrels and dinking with headspace(to match your cheapo factory dies) before anyone knew how accurate they were. Just a well kept secret,and one we'd reinforced with how dang ugly they are.....

There's a list of "reasons" they are so accurate. But back then,if it wasn't walnut and NICELY finished blue.... well,they were bttm feeders and you definitely were on a lower rung. Same now with factory tupperware.... there are reasons they "can" be made into hummers. It has to do with the recoil frequency. But in today's climate... try selling that idea,haha. I love them,and we have a blooming stock duplicator,haha.

Good luck with your shooting.
 
South Prairie Jim said:
Im told that light strikes and incorrect pin fall adversly effects accuracy
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Ive been told the same. Well see if the new firing pin design effects savages vaunted out of the box accuracy.

South Prairie Jim said:
There's a few guy's on accurate shooter that work on Savage bolts.
Mine I had a Smith work on. ( $100.00 worth) much improved but I still cannot get 10 rounds on a 1k target before the conditions change.
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On the .250AI i built i made some effort at getting the bolt lift to be smoother an lighter.
I bored a slight depression in the bolt screw, cut a few coils from the end of the spring and topped it with a body bore dia washer then sandwiched a chromed ball bearing in there coated with moly grease. I also polished all the internals and bore of the bolt
Really made a difference in feel, but you would still twist the gun to get bolt up.
I then adjusted tension and protrusion a bit to get rhe least amount of spring tension that still have reliable ignition.

That gun was smooth and accurate......and when that project was done i traded it for my 10mm lol.
 
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If it performs I dont care about cost or finish too much. A rossi 92 is a cheap lever action but one of the strongest ever made and as accurate as anything else. I also bought CZ550's in 416 rigby and 375H&H 20 years back when they were the cheapest bigbore around( as was the brno 602 before it), Now highly sought after actions for big game cartridge conversions. Bought my brother a zastava M70 in 375 H&H in about 2013, real CRF action, deadly accurate and only a few hundred bucks. You can sometimes find gems at lower price points.
 
Remember just a few years ago before we knew any better and everyone thought a Remington 700 was a quality rifle. Let’s just ponder how batshit insane it is to be soldering on bolt handles on anything made...oh I don’t know since the 1880’s

I would take a Ruger American any day if the week and twice on sundays over any 700 from this century

modern manufacturing and design have made cheap rifles quality rifles. They’re just ugly
 
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