What's the general consensur here regarding tasers for self defense?

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Habeed

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What's the general consensus here regarding tasers for self defense?

Tasers can do some amazing things. I've seen videos where a single shot takes down a martial arts instructor who states afterwords that the weapon was more incapacitating than shrapnel from a grenade.

For self defense, they seem like they might be a pretty darn good option.

Pros
NEARLY nonlethal. Taser claims 800,000 people have been zapped, and even the most vocal detractors of the taser are claiming that maybe 100-200 people have died with taser shocks as a contributing factor

Singe hit incapacitates. That is NOT the case with pistol rounds, unless you hit a very small target area. Taser claims that the taser has a higher effectiveness rate than handguns for stopping a target. I'll buy that : it's possible to fight on if you've been shot with a handgun in most places on your body, it's totally impossible if your muscles are paralyzed by a taser.

Tactics : if you are threatened, you can simply draw and fire with the taser. You have absolutely no need to wait to see if your attacker backs off like you would if you flash a firearm. Most taser models have a laser sight.

Taser makes a model that resembles an electric shaver. Because it doesn't resemble a gun, I think you're less likely to be shot by the police.

At the moment, in most states you can bring a taser anywhere and everywhere without repercussions. It isn't a firearm, it doesn't need a license, worst that can happen is you're asked to leave.

No risk of permanent injury in the event of an accidental discharge, no increased risk of suicide, no chance of killing an innocent person in the dark, no chance of someone taking the taser from you and killing you using it, little chance of your kids dying because they find your taser and play with it. In short, none of the downsides of firearms.

Cons :
One shot for the currently available civilian taser. This is a big problem if you're facing multiple attackers, or if you miss.

You cannot fire through cover such as walls and doors to hit your attacker. Then again, you also don't have to worry about backstops...

Limited range for the current civilian taser : 15 feet. On the other hand, if you fire in self defense from farther than 15 feet with a firearm, it's going to be harder to justify the shooting.

Poor intimidation factor. Thugs will know that the yellow plastic toy with laser sight you are pointing isn't as dangerous as a firearm.

It's theoretically possible to make conductive clothing that would make the wearer completely invulnerable to tasers. Much better protection that a bulletproof vest could ever be. At the moment though, such clothing is completely unavailable on the civilian market unless you want to wear tinfoil.



Right now, it seems to me that a taser would be a good intermediate choice for those who don't feel comfortable with a concealed handgun.

However, the new taser XREP shotgun rounds seems to me like it would allow for an ideal home defense load. You'd load a 12 gauge such that the first 3-4 shots are XREP rounds : plenty for taking on multiple home invaders. The last 3-4 shots or the reload would be conventional slug or buckshot rounds. Unfortunately, the XREP is not available to civilians yet.

The taser X3 would also solve many of the problems with the taser I mentioned above : you get 3 shots, and it has a "warning arc" mode that you can use to let thugs know what the weapon you are pointing at them will do.
 
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Tactics : if you are threatened, you can simply draw and fire with the taser. You have absolutely no need to wait to see if your attacker backs off like you would if you flash a firearm. Most taser models have a laser sight.

Ya might want to rethink that one laddie. If you run around poppin people with tasers bedause they look at you funny, you're going to be a guest of the state at the grey bar hotel. In many places, you are going to need a CCW to carry one. In some places, you can't possess one at all.

I'm also not aware of any "need to see if my attacker backs off" if I "flash a firearm". If I feel the need to use a firearm, the only "flash" they are going to see is the round going off.
 
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I wonder what would happen if an attacker had a gun pointed at you when you shock him with a Taser? If his muscles contracted wouldn't this cause the gun to go off while pointed at you?
 
It depends on the state, I should have made that clear. In a few states, such as Illinois and New York, a taser is treated similarly to a firearm.

What is really lame is the states with the most draconian gun control laws tend to apply similar restrictions to the taser. It's quite obvious that the state government wants everyone to be totally disarmed and helpless in the face of criminals who are bigger and stronger.

But in some states, a taser isn't considered a firearm or even mentioned in the laws, so that you can pretty much do what you want with it. In places with a no weapons policy, you could be thrown out if your taser were found, but not criminally charged.

As for a lower threshold to draw : yes, it is there. No you can't be zapping just anyone, but there's a lot of situations where you are not actually sure that a person is attacking you...maybe they are just walking up behind you at night because they are in a big hurry to get to their car. Etc. If you were to kill them with your handgun and it's not clear it's self defense, you're going to prison. If you taser them, then the odds are ridiculously better in your favor, since the 'victim' is alive and unharmed.
 
I've seen far to many videos of people being tasered and simply pulling the electrodes out of their skin like it was nothing. Drugs and alcohol can make people almost invincible. This can happen with gunshots but I don't think someone is going to keep going after a .357 JHP rips through their brain or heart. Either way, what are you going to do after you taser the bad guy? Run away? Tackle him and tie him up? Once you run out of juice or stop shocking the BG they are going to be able to fight back. I've been hit with a stun gun (on purpose) and it was incredibly painful and debilitating, but once my friend stopped shocking me I was fine and could have easily attacked him almost immediately, I was sober. You also mentioned this, but if you miss your target you are pretty much screwed, as my understanding most tasers are basically a one shot deal. If I miss the first shot with a gun I've got another one ready to go, not to mention the BG would be more likely to run away when you miss him with a bullet as opposed to a taser. I wouldn't trust one to protect myself.

As far as the legal ramifications of using a taser on an innocent person that you thought was going to attack you. I would say the odds are ridiculously not in your favor if the person survives the taser and wasn't trying to attack you. Now it is your word versus theirs. If they have never committed a crime and the evidence is weak showing they were trying to attack you, not only have you opened yourself up to criminal charges you will more than likely be looking at a civil suit.
 
Ever try to taze someone wearing heavy clothing? If a small caliber round has trouble penetrating heavy clothing like leather, your chances with a tazer are dramatically reduced. That was the disadvantage of the hand held tazers, you needed to contact bare skin.

If I'm in a situation where I need to use a weapon, I would much rather be able to draw a gun. Say I fire my ONLY round with the tazer and it misses or doesn't contact the skin, Great! Now I've got a very hostile BG, that probably has a weapon, and now knows I tried to attack him. I can't imagine that ends well...
 
Tasers can be used in some situations a firearm can't (escalation of Force) and the civilian ones are set for a timed stun giving you the chance to put it down and leave before the BG recovers. If you leave your taser make a police report and Taser will replace it at no cost to you. However sometimes the 2nd barb misses and it will not work and you will not have time to reload & now he is really mad and closer. There are Pro's and Cons.
 
SFB has it right....a drunk, drugged, or properly aggrivated person can do incredible things.

I used to work as a bouncer, and I've seen drunks shatter a hand in a fight (missed guy on wall, hit concrete wall full force) without the slightest slowdown. I've also seen a guy that made PeeWee Herman look tough lay out a guy about as big as an NFL linebacker.....with one punch.

NEVER understimate the power of drugs, liquor or rage in a person. Honestly, a taser may be sufficient, but I'm not trusting my life or the life of those I love to it.
 
They have their place. However, they don't replace firearms.

A few things to point out:

You can't simply tazer someone for being behind you. You will be in trouble in both civil and criminal court.

You can't take a weapon into a place with posted no weapons signs. You are trespassing, and they can press charges, though it is probably unlikely.

People do not get hit with tazers and just keep going because they are high or drunk or whatever. The tazer overwhelms the nervous system, so it is not a simple issue of whether the person can deal with the pain.

People do, however, get hit, but one or both barbs don't make contact properly, and they are able to rip them out and keep going.

The range is limited. The number of shots are limited. Your liability is more limited than with a gun. It is easier to use than a gun. You make your choice.
 
I was going to add to that : if both electrodes hit and the taser is actively shocking, it is not possible to resist. Both electrodes can hit nearly anywhere on the body, and it takes very thick clothing to insulate against the shock (the taser electronics increase the voltage if there is more resistance in order to deliver a constant amount of energy to the target) If only one electrode hits, and the other falls upon moist ground, that is often enough.

Still, the one shot limit is the primary problem : the new multishot taser was just released and may reduce that problem. It gives you 3 shots, and if that doesn't work you still have a potent melee weapon that is better than a knife. Taser is thinking about making a civilian version of the multishot taser.

Ultimately I think this technology can be further developed to the point that electroshock weapons are superior in nearly all circumstances to handguns, both in stopping power and of course in avoiding the problems of firearms.

For instance, there could be a handgun sized version of the taser that fires XREP shotgun shells and has a 5-8 shot magazine capacity.
 
Check Local Laws

Check local laws. I wanted to get a taser as a non-lethal (nearly) alternative to a gun because I do not want to shoot and kill anyone. I just want to defend myself. I only want to use my gun as a LAST RESORT. However, liberal bleeding heart types have BANNED tasers for use outside your home in Texas. I have a CCW permit but I am not allowed to carry a taser. The antis want to make you totally helpless and dependent on the state for everything so that they will have totalitarian power over you. It is a LIE that they want to ban guns because they are deadly because they have banned tasers, which are not deadly. The TRUTH is that they want to strip you of your human rights so that they can lord over you like you're a slave/serf.

If it were legal, I think the perfect carry set-up would be a taser duct taped to a tactical flashlight in the left pocket and a gun in the right pocket. That way, not every self-defense situation will end up in deadly force. You use the tactical light to blind/disorient them and issue a warning if threatened with bodily harm. If this is not working, use the taser. If the taser fails, then use the gun as a last resort. I train with a mild caliber weapon that I can easily fire with one hand (G19). I've dedicated my life to saving lives, so I only want to take a life, even in self defense, only if it is absolutely necessary. lifting the ban on tasers in Texas would save lives.

I would use a taser only in circumstances where I would be justified with using deadly force. For example, if someone comes at me with a knife or there is an armed robbery, but the BG was not aiming the gun at anyone (there are cases where a BG just lifts his shirt for a second to show a holstered weapon before demanding money), I would use a taser over a gun in these circumstances to save the life of the attacker (ALL life is sacred, we are ALL God's children). However, if I see the BG has an unholstered gun, then I'm gonna do some shootin'.
 
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The focused energy weapons should be out before long, maybe we can all go to them?;)

Seriously-
The issue I see with less than lethal weapons is that people, police included, seem more eager to use them. I think the moral concern of the lethal weapon helps to make a person think more before using it. I think I have seen a few times on "Cops" when a guy was tased because he didn't comply fast enough in the officer's opinion.

On the other hand, it may cause criminals to become bolder. Think about this, if the criminal knows he has a chance to get you to fire a taser and you may miss, he now has an unarmed victim and if he does get hit he knows he is likely not going to die. Maybe criminals will act as a team, one approaches and gets you to fire the taser on them, now his partner finishes the job with an unarmed victim. Both know they are not likely to get killed with a taser.

Criminals have not been persuaded to stop attempting crime by threat of lethal force by an armed citizen. I suspect criminals would be more comfortable with everyone carrying non-lethal weapons.

drjoker- I agree with you, no honest person wants to take a life, sometimes the criminal makes that choice for us.
 
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Gunman :

1. A taser is a real weapon that works. It is not science fiction. If you are hit by one and nothing blocks the electricity from reaching your body, you go down 100% of the time. There has never been a person found who can resist the direct electric shock because all human beings use nerves and muscles. The problem with the taser is that it needs some improvement in the delivery mechanism.

2. There already is a multi-shot taser released, and the civilian model is being developed. The criminals would need to be in a team of at least 4 people.
 
I don't want a taser. I want my pistol. That's enough.

A taser is a real weapon that works. It is not science fiction. If you are hit by one and nothing blocks the electricity from reaching your body, you go down 100% of the time. There has never been a person found who can resist the direct electric shock because all human beings use nerves and muscles. The problem with the taser is that it needs some improvement in the delivery mechanism.

Speaking in absolutes sounds very idealistic, and unpersuasive.
 
My firearm can do anything your taser can do, only better.
That is my feeling on tasers.
No, actually, it can't. You show me a video of a handgun putting someone down for 30 seconds, in pain, and then at the end they are perfectly healthy, with no lasting damage, and I'll believe that statement. Until then, it's ridiculous to make that assertion.

Speaking in absolutes sounds very idealistic, and unpersuasive.

It's really not speaking in absolutes. Those words sound absolute, but look at the context. It's like saying "I guarantee that this will work, every single time, as long as nothing goes wrong with it."

The fact is that if the tazer makes contact and functions properly, it is absolutely guaranteed to put someone down. Under ideal conditions, I'd put money on a tazer putting someone down rather than a handgun. I'd definitely put my money on the handgun if I wanted him to stay down, or if I wanted to put someone down from 10 yards, or if he was wearing particularly heavy clothing, etc.


The fact is that a tazer is a tool. You use it when the situation calls for it. It is not the end all defense weapon any more than any handgun, rifle, or shotgun is. It has a specific purpose, and to that end, it is very good.
 
A taser is a tool. Like any tool, it has applications and limitations. In some individuals who are opposed to taking life for any reason, it fills a need. In some areas (California) it can be carried where firearms can't. For some it improves resolve. Some would hesitate to pull the trigger when the consequences are lethal. I don't expect anyone on this forum would be plagued by that, however, and many wouldn't understand the rationale of those that are.
 
Even if you don't have any moral trouble with taking someone's life who might kill you if you don't kill them first, there's still the legal issue. As has been mentioned on these forums, unless it's at night in your own house and the bad guy has a gun, you are in serious trouble if you shoot someone in self defense and they die. You're going to need a criminal defense lawyer, and it's going to cost at least $20,000.

Even if everything works out in the end, you might be facing a trial for several years. A DA can indict you pretty much no matter what, and in many places you could be waiting for a trial for a year or two or more. Also, you'll have to be able to come up with bail or you'll wait in jail during that time. The whole 1-2 year period you have to go to sleep at night not knowing if you're ultimately going to be sentenced to prison.

There's another thread on this forum where a man was sent to prison for 10 years for a shooting that there is no evidence proving that it WASN'T self defense. (he couldn't prove that it was, and there was evidence suggesting he took an hour to report the shooting, but there was also no evidence of motive for why the shooter would murder a man)

If you taser someone, depending on jurisdiction it may not even be a felony charge. If you shoot someone, it's going to be a flavor of manslaughter or murder that you'll be charged with. And it's gonna be a heck of a lot harder to persuade a jury to send you to prison if the 'victim' was unharmed and subject to no worse an experience than what the cops do to people all the time for talking back or being slow to comply. As far as I know, not a single one of those cops was ever convicted of anything...even the ones we have seen on video abusing people with tasers.
 
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If you taser someone, depending on jurisdiction it may not even be a felony charge.

Show me one place in the United States where assault with a deadly weapon isn't a felony.

Before you tell me that a taser isn't a deadly weapon, refer to your own rough numbers:

100-200 people have died with taser shocks
 
That probably wouldn't be the charge. Taser International denies every single one of those 100-200 deaths. It maintains the position that no-one has died as a result of being shocked by a taser, and has an army of lawyers who voraciously defend the company.

I was saying that even if you assume that Amnesty International is right, it is claiming that 100-200 out of 800,000 people died from taser shocks. I was pointing out that is a ridiculously low death rate.

Anyways, it's moot : cops and DAs are not likely to charge you as long as you shocked someone who looks even slightly shady. It just doesn't have the same appeal as a murder charge had you used a handgun. Just don't go shocking 80 year old grannies with your taser, and 99% of the time you're not going to be arrested, much less charged.
 
Anyways, it's moot : cops and DAs are not likely to charge you as long as you shocked someone who looks even slightly shady. It just doesn't have the same appeal as a murder charge had you used a handgun. Just don't go shocking 80 year old grannies with your taser, and 99% of the time you're not going to be arrested, much less charged.

With all due respect, you are misinformed. About a few things, judging from the several errors in the post above, and your flurry of posts since you joined us. Do stick around, there's much to learn here.
 
I've observed/used the Taser at work and there is no way I would recommend it to people in place of a firearm. The only people that should carry them are people that refuse to carry a firearm or cant due to legal restrictions. Pepperspray would be a much better less lethal tool to carry.
 
You know, a taser AND pepper spray might be a pretty decent combo.

Sure be a lot easier to hit someone with a taser if they are half blind from pepper spray.

If you miss with the taser, you've got more pepper spray in the can. Can also spray it at several people if you have to.

And again, neither a can of pepper spray and the taser C2 which resembles an electric shaver look anything like a gun, reducing the chance that a cop guns you down for having it.
 
Watch how much stuff you start carrying around or pretty soon you'll need a duty belt to haul it all
 
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