What's the heaviest caliber that a brick wall will stop?

Status
Not open for further replies.

davek

Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2004
Messages
188
Location
Memphis, TN
...or would it have to be heavy at all?

I'm not talking heavy duty brick or cinder blocks. I'm talking about plain old brick used to build plane old brick houses. If someone were shooting at my house and I were inside, how safe would I be from rounds penetrating the brick on the outside, and then the sheet rock on the inside?

Thanks
 
There are a lot of factors to consider -- including bullet construction, angle of impact, and so on. However, virtually any centerfire rifle will penetrate a brick wall. Some may not ALWAYS penetrate, but if a few shots are fired into the same area, they'll start coming through.
 
IIRC, Force= Mass X Acceleration.
In theory, almost any projectile will penetrate almost anything if it is traveling fast enough. In the real world, as Mr. Humphrey pointed out, a lot of other factors come into play. Sounds like a fun project for someone who has a private range and the know-how to lay bricks.
 
Single layer brick isn't going to stop much for long. Like concrete blocks, if they aren't reinforced with something a child can bust 'em with a hammer.
 
I shot 2" thick square bricks with a .223 and a .30-06 at 50 yards. Both punched straight through. Ammo was Federal M193 55gr. ball and Korean M2 .30-06 ball.
 
hollow cinder blocks are even weaker... but they sure are fun to shoot.... i don't know of a common centerfire rifle round that wouldn't bust right through... and sheet rock??? well just hope the bullets hit the studs...
 
Loose blocks, bricks

The results of shooting loose bricks, blocks, etc, will have nothing to do with shooting the same materials that are part of a wall.

It will be necessary to chew your way thru.
 
full power handgun calibers will break a cinder block that is part of a wall.

I have shot at portions of cinder block walls before with a standard 9mm as well as a .45 and .38special. All bullets were FMJ though. The bullets didn't always get through, but they usually broke one side (sometimes both) of a block. I'd say two or three hits to penetrate fully.

If the block is filled with concrete, a handgun round won't make it through.
 
Darn fine question. Any builders out there? I wonder how "thick" a brick wall is.

Best brick wall I've seen? Fort Point which is beneath the Golden Gate Bridge. Withstood the '06 and '89 earthquakes.
 
I did some concrete construction when I lived in Florida.
A cinder block wall is 8" thick. Each wall is 2" with an open space of 4". Obviously, these measurements are not precise, but they are very close. The matierial is brittle which is why they tend to crack and break with a heavy impact (like a gunshot)

The support joints (thicker portions) are 12" thick and usually have concrete poured in them. Depending on codes in various areas, there may be steel (rebar) running up through the wall.
 
Unfilled cells on a CBU concrete block wall will break with a hammer.

Concrete is hard and brittle. Brick is soft and brittle.

You gotta fill the cells with concrete and reinforce them with rebar to get any real benefit. Brick I'm sure you need to layer.
 
I happened to run across the FMF marksmanship manual today. There was a table that listed adequate thicknesses of cover from small arms fire. On the low end was concrete at 7 inches thick and on the high end was timber, I think at about 40 inches. Just another data point.


Dave
 
From my younger days, when I had more time to do these types of things:

1. 7mm Rem Mag, penetrated the double brick wall of an old fireplace at 200 yards.

2. 9mm, w/ 115 JHP reliably penetrated both webs of an extra thick cinder block from a position about 45 feet away. 125 FMJ sometimes went through both webs, sometimes the bullet turned sideways and did not go through the second web.

3. .38 Spl. w/ 158 LSWC sometimes went through both webs of a cinder block, sometimes did not.

4. 357 magnum w/ 146 SWJHP went through both webs of an extra thick cinder block at 75 yards (a full W296 load!)
 
Thanks for all the great responses, but let me clarify a little.

When ever I try to imagine some kind of rioters or zombie hoard assaulting my home, I always imagine myself setting up a firing position at the bay window type thing in my dining room facing the front. It's not really a bay window, but three walls making a semi-circle with windows in it. kinda like a copula, and the walls are brick. I was just wondering when to just duck and hope that the walls would absorb the damage, and when I should tuck tail and run. Like if I just saw some hand guns, could I count on the walls to protect me, but if I saw someone break out a FAL or something I should fall back to a fetal position or something.
 
In either case you should have multiple firing points. They start suppressing your bay window, penetrative or not, and you won't be able to engage anyway.

Have to worry about that long range head shot from any weapon.
 
Well, there's brick, and then there's brick.

Modern high-quality brick like Acme is high fired, and is very nearly a ceramic-- it actually rings if you strike it while it hangs from a string. But get you one of those old Chicago antique bricks or an old adobe brick, and hit it with something, and it'll go "thud." Well, the newer brick is a more stable building product, and has an excellent strength-to-weight ratio, and has much better insulating properties (except possibly for the adobe bricks, which can have straw in 'em), but they're mighty brittle, compared to those other lower-fired bricks. And brittle doesn't keep the bullets out. Brittleness is determined by the amount of grog (dried clay in the mix), sand, and heat applied to the brick. (I confess that I'm not a builder-- I hang out with ceramics sculptors, one of whom uses green brick as her medium of choice.)


Also to take into consideration is what kind of sheathing is laid behind the brick. Some can use 3/8" plywood. Some require 5/8" plywood. I've seen buildings where the sheathing was 3/4" CDX plywood, which is really strong and heavy stuff. Very common now for sheathing is that pressboard/fiberboard stuff. They claim it's as strong as plywood, but I'll tell you that I can drive a nail through that pressboard a lot easier than I can drive a nail through the same thickness of plywood, which is relevant to our ability to stop a bullet. Then there's the insulation (if any), and whether they put that new Tyvek stuff around the house. Oh, I know it's just a polymer paper layer, but you ever try to tear the stuff? It's amazingly strong. A bullet that's deformed itself by passing through a brick veneer is going to notice that Tyvek as it enters the sheathing. If you were lucky, the bullet might hit one of the numerous little steel brick ties, which hold the brick veneer to the sheathing. It would be unlikely. These are just narrow corrogated steel (usually galvanized) strips of sheet metal, but they're better than the 1" of airspace between the brick and the sheathing for holding that bullet away, I guess. ;)

Beyond that, there's some 2X4 wood studs in there that might or might be hit. They're edge-on to the direction of the shot, so they'll provide some decent cover. Unfortunately they're not more commonly encountered than every 16", and can be found farther apart. :( Then there's whatever kind of insulation was inside the interior wall (fiberglass, blown-in stuff-- it's not going to do much), and then your interior wall, which for most of us is usually gypsum board (drywall), and doesn't do much to stop bullets.

There's an amazing variety of compositions in an exterior wall.
http://www.blueprintforsafety.org/GIFS/05.gif
http://www.buildingscience.com/housesthatwork/hothumid/images/houston_profile.jpg

And if the bullet hits the mortar, than you're dealing with the question of how rich the mortar was mixed in proportion to sand, and how heavy a hand was used in applying the mortar before the brick was set on top of it.
 
the quanity of hits, is another consideration..for a wall. best fire point...if you have one...is the crawl space under your home... Arc-Lite
 
A wall that has one layer of brick, backed up by plywood or gypsum sheathing and wood studs, is not a "brick wall." It's a wood frame wall with a brick veneer. It won't stop much in the way of bullets. Typically, the bricks are "nominally" 4 inches thick, but actually measure about 3-5/8 inches. Some are solid, while some have hollow cores.

A true "brick wall" would consist of at LEAST three layers ("wythes") of 3-5/8" brick, for a total nominal thickness of 12 inches. That would be enough to stop pretty much any handgun round, and at least a few rounds from almost any rifle out there. Continued hits to the same part of the wall, however, could break the bond between bricks and mortar and literally knock the bricks out of the wall.

These days, it's very rare to find a solid brick wall. Most "masonry" walls have a 6" or 8" concrete block backup wythe, a 1" to 2" air space, and a single wythe of brick veneer.
 
Concrete block comes in three widths, actually. 4," 8," and 12." Almost all block construction will be filled, as it increases strenth, and concrete block walls are generally load bearing.

I saw a house that was getting a true brick veneer. It was tiles, about an inch thick, that were nailed to the backing. No mortar, and not brick. I thought it was rediculous. Some houses will have a synthetic fieldstone veneer. This is a very lightweight concrete moulded to look like fieldstone when mortared to the backing. I think they use plastic as the main filler, and I would trust it less than a single wythe of brick.

During my masonry class, we never did a three wythe wall. The thickest we did was two, or one backed by block.

some stuff on 5.56mm If you look around, you can find stuff on other calibers.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top