When police take your gun....

[wildman5759]

Not to seem cruel here, but how can a PD give you fair market value for something not made anymore? A 98% Colt Python, not made anymore. How far out of their way will they go to find one like yours? Then return yours, scratched to hell with electro pencil, will they give you monies to send it to Colt and have it refinished? No, didn't think so. Do you now see why folks raise such questions about PD's doing their jobs, not ruining items that don't belong to them? Or is it because most PD's don't pay them enough monies that they can afford revolvers like they screw up? Born at night, but not last night!

It is the VALUE. They cannot buy you a new firearm. :banghead: The way most departments do this is to bluebook it, or, as when the item can't be bluebooked, they search online for firearms that are as like as possible that have been sold recently. The money is issued by check by the department. As far as the refinishing, it's possible that you can be reimbursed for it, and every attempt should be done to do so if that is what you wish. Don't expect to be reimbursed for the refinishing AND have the FMV paid for the item as well. That would just be stupid. We have reimbursed people for car paint jobs that were damaged by tow companies, then had the towing company reimburse us. In the case of most evidence however, it is solely the departments responsibility for the care of that item. I'm sorry, I don't know what to tell you...that is the reason many departments no longer put permanent marks on any type of evidence. I really don't care when you were born. Who brought pay into the conversation and what the hell does it have to do with evidence collection? Did you have something damaged and failed to follow through on getting compensated for what some idiot in an evidence locker did to it?

 

[wannabeagunsmith]

BTW, I just thought I would add that I am not "anti-cop" or anything I just wanted to know. Thanks for the answers!

 

[wildman5759]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you, mlj or everyone was anti-cop. It's just the 'All those *$&% no good coppers do this and that and ruin our lives' bid that gets old after a while. We do care about citizens and their property. Think about it this way. My wife and 5 kids are citizens and I wouldn't want them treated inappropriately, so why would I do it to someone else.

Someone further up the thread asked for LEO input, I'm just stating what SOP is in these parts, as well as my experiences throughout the state. Thought I'd offer some insight into the behind the scenes. Maybe a few other LEO's here will have other processes? I'm sure there's at least one LEO here that works for a department that gouges frames.....

We have our flaws and our share of jackbutts as well.

 

[HorseSoldier]

In either of the OP's scenarios, the firearm becomes evidence until either the investigating/prosecuting agency decides there isn't a case there to pursue or until things are adjudicated in court.

In a self-defense shooting, return shouldn't be too delayed -- in terms of the legal system and evidence, which will still probably be long enough (months) to make any law abiding citizen irate.

If a stolen firearm is used in some sort of crime that goes to trial, do yourself a favor and buy a replacement. Between trial and possible relevance in any subsequent appeals, you may or may not even remember owning the gun by the time it's returnable.

 

[Viper]

I can relate personal experiences in Georgia of what happens after a firearms theft. In August 2010, I had five pistols stolen. Four were current production models and although expensive, could be replaced. One was a perfect mint 1996 German build nickle P220 and could not. As luck would have it, the SIG was recovered in a traffic stop in October. Although it was not used in a crime, the perp was charged with several felonies and arrested. It took eight months to convince the Gwinnett DA that the physical presence of the gun was not necessary to make their case and for them to release it to me.

The second incident took place in February, 2011. Ten pistols were stolen including 2 SIGS, 2 HK's, a Kahr, 2 SA 1911's, and 3 3rd gen S&W's. I found out by accident three months later [No one notified me] that the Kahr had been recovered by the Auburn, GA PD. When I called the PD, no record could be found. Fortunately, the County DA, was a close friend of a friend, and he located the pistol. I got it back one month later.

Surprisingly, Both recovered guns were in good shape, if somewhat dirty.

 

[wildman5759]

Spot on HorseSoldier.

Viper, were the rest ever recovered? Usually the thieves will sell the guns within hours of stealing them. I've seen Garands and 1911s sold for $30 and a crack rock.

If you had to use them in a self defense situation as the OP described, do you think the DA would've turned them out more promptly? Assuming it was ruled a good shoot?

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

As someone pointed out, it could be a REAL GOOD excuse to buy another gun!

 

[Viper]

Spot on HorseSoldier.

Viper, were the rest ever recovered? Usually the thieves will sell the guns within hours of stealing them. I've seen Garands and 1911s sold for $30 and a crack rock.

If you had to use them in a self defense situation as the OP described, do you think the DA would've turned them out more promptly? Assuming it was ruled a good shoot?

No, of the fifteen stolen, only the SIG and Kahr were ever recovered to my knowledge. The guy who was arrested with the SIG, said he bought it on the street for $100. Quite a bargain, I'd say.

In the case of a self defense shoot, I doubt that I would ever see the gun again, except maybe at my trial, good shoot or no.

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

Not returning stolen firearms to their rightful owner in South Florida? What else don't they return? Your wife's engagement ring? Sounds like some corrective legislation is in order.
I think a call to the local DA's or State Attorney's office is in order, and if they aren't too cooperative, a session with an attorney well versed in the state's firearms laws.

 

[Panzercat]

Choose a ugly gun as your SD gun, they won't want to keep it then.

People laugh, but that's exactly the reason I have a hi-point. Keep it a few years for evidence. I won't mind.

 

[Bubbles]

Y'all are also assuming that a LE agency's policy is to return the gun to its last lawful owner (assuming it was stolen or used in a SD incident), when the sad reality is that a lot of jurisdictions will destroy seized firearms once they're no longer needed as evidence.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

I actually have a gun that was stolen in California, later run though NICS (at my request by a local sheriff's office in Ohio), and was found to be part of that burglary. Before my sheriff's office wanted to take possession of the gun, they checked with the agency in CA, and was told the case was closed, they did not want the gun, and that insurance had paid out on it, and that the insurance company did not want it either. I had bought it at a gunshow, and was prepared to surrender it if necessary, or go back trace (buyer to seller to buyer, etc) to see how it got to Ohio, etc. The matter was dropped, and I just kept the gun. I hope they "cleared" it on the computer. I have never asked to run it again.

 

[Seanpcola]

A close friend of mine had a Witness 1911 .45 ACP stolen in a home burglary last year. He mourned the loss, bought a new one and about 7 months later got a call from the Mobile, AL PD saying that they had recovered his baby. Went straight down there, a little paperwork and he was back home (actually at the range) the same day. I'm still a little amazed over that.

 

[Viper]

People laugh, but that's exactly the reason I have a hi-point. Keep it a few years for evidence. I won't mind.

I'm not laughing. My car gun is a HP C9. I never even think of it when I total my collection. I paid $99 at a show years ago, so if it gets away from me, no big loss.

I do the same with my carry pistol. More than half the time I carry my cheapest active gun, a Kahr CW40. It's been 100% and I actually shoot it quite well, so I'm not giving up anything.

 

[franconialocal]

In 2007 my friend and FTO (Field Training Officer) Cpl. N. Bruce McKay was killed in the line of duty by way of homicide (shot). We have yet to see his duty sidearm return from the State Police Crime Lab, and we have no indication when this may happen.

 

[jonmerritt]

The evil gun has tasted blood, it must be locked up, for it will crave more human blood and kill to get it.

 

[hso]

Stolen property is usually returned to the lawful owner, but remember you should have proof it was your (insurance/purchase records).

This is one reason it is important to report theft of a firearm.

I received a call one evening from a friend who had a revolver stolen unbeknownst to her. A sheriff's deputy was asking her to identify it and she couldn't tell him anything about it except is was "black", but she knew I was familiar with it having shot many times with her husband. I identified everything about it short of the serial number and the deputy signed it over to her.

 

[Shadow 7D]

REALLY depends were you are, there are stories of guns being returned the NEXT day, balistis unit fired their shots, Forensics was done with, it was cleaned, and the Owner called and the gun returned...

Others, years of around and around with the DA's office and the PD until a NEW attorney is assigned and they are trying to clear out back logged property, the OP in that one was told that the first DA could have released the gun after the forensics was done and pictures taken, that IT wasn't really required for the trial and DEFIANTLY not for an appeal. Think about it, supposedly, if that was the cause, any piece of evidence (say a car) would be required to be stored unit the Felon was either acquitted or until they completed their sentence, because they COULD appeal, and hence the DA would have to keep ALL the evidence for basically EVER.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

Common sense is not always common when it comes to law enforcement and the return of private property............

 

[788Ham]

No Wildman,
I didn't have something returned from a PD locker messed up. You seem to have taken this question personally, wasn't meant that way, but since you posted as you did, this is why it was asked. Calm down, no one, especially me accused you of doing anything like this. I never thought they'd pay for fixing the frame if etched, and I wasn't trying to double dip, as well as buy a new one, which can't be done since no longer made. Chill !

 

[PBR Streetgang]

I know for a fact that some counties in NJ require you to apply for another handgun purchase permit before they will return the firearm that is rightfully yours. God Forbid if you don't have a original receipt for it also. Grand pops LC Smith side by side is going to the furnace if you don't have any documentation that it was passed down as a family hierloom....

 

[Texas Knight]

Wildman, thank you for this knowledge, and thank you for what you do. I for one do not think that the cops are out to get us in any situation. At least in Texas cops treat gun owners especially CHL holders are treated very well. Once again thank you for protecting our streets.

 

[orionengnr]

Wildman--
We need more LEOs of your caliber. Thank you for your service to your community and to the Constitution.

Viper--
Two separate firearm thefts? Sounds as if someone needs to invest in a safe...

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

Y'all are also assuming that a LE agency's policy is to return the gun to its last lawful owner (assuming it was stolen or used in a SD incident), when the sad reality is that a lot of jurisdictions will destroy seized firearms once they're no longer needed as evidence.

I find it hard to believe that PDs will take people's property and destroy it like that.

 

[mgkdrgn]

Well ... they will. Or sell it at auction. Happens every single day.