Where did the 7.62x25 Surplus Ammo Go?

[xr1200]

I posted SB and $15.99 a box, but for the comparison I used the same american made economy ammo by winchester. Informing and educating ppl is not insulting them, I have experience handling disassembling, shooting 2 of these current M57 so know exactly what I am talking about.

 

[shotgunjoel]

xr1200, just stop fighting this fight, no one is agreeing to you. Go shoot your 9mm and feel superior to all of us idiots.

 

[451 Detonics]

this one at least doesn't misfire and groups about 4 inches at 20 yrds. and it will hit POA at 15 yrds. but at 20-25 yrds. it is way off

This sentence makes little sense to me. If the gun shoots to point of aim at 15 yards what happens between 15 and 20 yards? I know the bullet doesn't start turning left (or right). A gun that shoots to POA at 15 yards will not be "way off" just because the distance increases 5 yards. The shooter may cause the impact to shift greatly but the bullet itself is launched in a straight line. Now if the sight aren't exactly on then yes the bullet will drift but at 5 yards we are talking a drift on less than an inch...not "way off".

 

[Weevil]

I think I'm starting to see why xr1200's friend's and relatives don't pay much attention to what he has to say.

 

[Fastcast]

I have experience handling disassembling, shooting 2 of these current M57 so know exactly what I am talking about.

Guess that makes you thee expert now.....For the record I don't own the M57 or TT33 because I didn't much care for them either but that has nothing to do with the subject of this thread, anymore than your assertion that all these pistols will become paperweights because the cheap, out of spec surplus may dry up.

People like different things and for different reasons, deal with it. Your opinion is just that.

I bought my CZ52 because I liked the unusual engineering and the hot rod 7.62x25 round.....Not because I could buy cheap surplus.

MY CZ pictured with S&B, long before any surplus concerns.

 

[rogertc1]

I horded over 7000 rounds when 7.62X25 was cheap in the tuna cans. reason it is no more is because of all the guns that came out in it. Like the AR-15 upper, PSP-43C Pistol and the Coalfire Sterling Pistol. I have the last two plus a Tok &CZ52.

 

[shotgunjoel]

I horded over 7000 rounds when 7.62X25 was cheap in the tuna cans. reason it is no more is because of all the guns that came out in it. Like the AR-15 upper, PSP-43C Pistol and the Coalfire Sterling Pistol. I have the last two plus a Tok &CZ52.

Well that's our answer, Roger has it all.

 

[woad_yurt]

Although I bought quite a few spam cans when they were cheap, I'd have still gotten Toks or CZ 52s even if the surplus ammo wasn't available. They are some stormin' handguns. I'm glad I did get it cheap, though, because I recently traded for a PPSh with 4 35 round mags. It's one cool, cool thing.

For the guy who says Toks are no good because his brother's Tok came with hand-ground parts:
Don't dump on a whole line of anything because someone you know bought one which had been butchered by some clown. If anyone's got a Tok that jams, fix it!

 

[mgmorden]

Meh - I own both a CZ-52 and a Yugo M57 Tokarev. Neither have ever seen surplus ammo (at least since I owned them ). I might buy a crate if they come in again, but having to buy commercial ammo hasn't stopped me so far - won't stop me in the future. Personally in the past I avoided the surplus stuff just because it was corrosive and I didn't want the increased cleaning labor.

 

[xr1200]

If I owned one of these guns, I would sell it off and the ammo, while there still is a demand and guns available for it. Eventually you will what you have is the same situation as the 30 cal luger.

I'm sure that you will have wolf and other european manufacturers, sell some cheap ball ammo for around $15 a box for a few yrs.

But what will eventually happen is that demand for the cartridge drop off year after year and you will find that only a few specialty companies will make the round and then it may get has high as 30 cal luger at $50 + a box.

Ammunition manufactures will only produce ammo if there is large enough demand for it.

There have been a lot of good cartridges produced over the years that are now out of production, like the 41 AE, 5mm remington etc. Your always better off sticking with established rounds like the 9mm , 380, 45 etc, than any of these odd ball rounds.

As for quality and accuracy I would like to see some of these 7.62 x 25 advocates actually post a quick YOUTUBE or even a proven online range report that shows these tokarevs will shoot decent groups and point of aim at 25 yrds. The truth is they don't exist, all you will find is some guy posting pics of blasting all over a man size target at close range. So if they are such great guns, show us the proof, I've fired 2 of the latest examples and they would either misfire or not hit POA or group well.

The best thing anyone can do with one of these pistols and ammo right now is sell it off while the demand is high for the ammo and gun and capitalize on the shortages and make a good profit on the ammo.

 

[amd6547]

My Romanian tokarev is my backpacking and emergency backup pistol. I have a sealed spam can of ammo which I will be saving...all shooting I do with it will be with whatever box of ammo I happen to find at the gunshow.
I have no problem shooting tight groups at 25yds...and I also have no trouble hitting rocks and things at 100yds...the round is very flat shooting, and the sights seem to be set up for POA at that range. A bad guy in the open with xr1200's attitude would be in serious jeopardy if I felt it necessary to drop into a field position and launch some 7.62x25 at him.
BTW, if anyone has any of these worthless 30 lugars xr1200 keeps hypothesizing about, I would be glad to give them a good home.

 

[xr1200]

Most 30 cal lugers either PO8 or Browning HP 30 cal or Broom handle 30 cal are usually restricted to pure collectors or safe queens, some pll shoot them occassionally but not many.

This is why a shooter grade PO8 in 9mm is everyones choice.

I agree the yugo 57 you might be able to hit boulders or the side of cliff with one at 100 yrds.

 

[OldMac]

I have a Romanian, Polish, and Yugo. All have good accuracy equal to my 9mm Glock and the Yugo is better. Reloading is important for hollow points. There is still enough fmj for target practice for a long time in the future.

 

[mgmorden]

xr1200: I've already successfully made 7.62x25 ammo out of cut down .223 brass loaded with .30 carbine bullets. Trust me - my guns won't ever stop shooting so long as I have a mind to keep shooting them.

You seem to have some awful vendetta against people enjoying shooting their guns.

 

[CornCod]

I bought my CZ-52 because it was an interesting service pistol. It really came into its own, however, during the great ammo shortage of 2008-2009. With all the shortages and high ammo prices, 7.62X25mm was the cheapest centerfire option available. The practice enabled me to easily qualify with my corrections agency for those two years. If the surplus dries up, I will certainly shoot it less. I am already shooting the CZ less because of all the cheap Tula commercial 9mm flooding the country.

 

[Snowdog]

Also yugo 57 pistol is not really even accurate enough to make them an enjoyable range toy. My brother has one that misfires all the time and the point of impact is about 2 ft high and 4" to the left at 25 yrds. It will shoot a 4 inch group though, so if you can 't adjust the point of aim what good is it.

Both my M57s are quite accurate. They make for absolutely enjoyable range toys. Heck, I've even purchase dies and have rolled some of my own, with excellent results (perfectly mushroomed 85gr JSP into Play-Doh and wet pack.

XR1200, if you live near me, I will be more than happy to invite you next time I take my M57s out if you'd like to give the M57 another chance. You are welcome to choose from my surplus stash (Polish, Yugoslavian and Romanian). I believe if you take me up on this offer, you will encounter two M57s that may very well change your opinion concerning the accuracy of these excellent surplus pistols. From what I've read from others who also own the M57, my experience with the M57 is the norm.

Also, I have about 600 rounds between the two of them without one single malfunction. This says a lot not only for the pistol, but for foreign surplus ammunition as well. I'm not saying there aren't any dogs out there, but most reports I've heard of the Yugo M57 reflect my own.

 

[shotgunjoel]

xr1200, nobody is listening to you anymore.

As for quality and accuracy I would like to see some of these 7.62 x 25 advocates actually post a quick YOUTUBE or even a proven online range report that shows these tokarevs will shoot decent groups and point of aim at 25 yrds. The truth is they don't exist, all you will find is some guy posting pics of blasting all over a man size target at close range. So if they are such great guns, show us the proof, I've fired 2 of the latest examples and they would either misfire or not hit POA or group well.

If you want proof of people's claims of accuracy, then I want proof of your issues with the guns. PM me the links to the youtube videos.

 

[xr1200]

Shotgunjoel - Youtube videos or reliable range reports showing POA shot and placement and groups at 25 yrds. don't exist.

Only tests or videos you see are printed statements on forums, no targets or verifing range etc, just a lot of wild shooting.

Try and find one from a verifiable reputable source, showing group and distances, they simply don't exist.

So you claim to know of them , well then lets see it !

 

[Fastcast]

Hey xr1200.....The only thing wild around here are your claims. Like Joe said lets see your own videos sport or some other reputable sources videos of malfunctioning Toks all over or off paper.

Put up or shut up big shot, balls in your court, you started the argument, as usual. I'm sure this thread will get shut down shortly so hurry up please!

xr1200's - MO.....Come into thread, act like a know it all, spews nonsense and insults others choices which are not pertinent to the original topic just to piss people off, thinks everyone should own the same pistol in 9mm of course. The cookie cutter world according to xr1200.

 

[PabloJ]

As long as people keep hoarding ammo one thing is sure to happen the price will keep rising.

 

[woad_yurt]

xr1200:

I was wondering why you're so bent on trashing this pistol so I did a search of your posts to see if it was this particular gun that got you so fired up or if if it was part of a general pattern of behavior. Anyway....

Back in March, you posted the following:

Working on a yugo 57 that my brother got at gander for $200, looks unissued, we fired it and it did shoot point of aim and got 4 shots touching at 10 yrds. But when shot at 25 yrds. groups opened up to wide to really determine there size.

But, in this thread:

Another friend locally bought one in unissued condition and I advised against it, when he brought over the gun to show me it the barrel was actually ground and fit to the bushing with a grinder and a file, this one at least doesn't misfire and groups about 4 inches at 20 yrds. and it will hit POA at 15 yrds. but at 20-25 yrds. it is way off and agian no way to adjust the sights expect for windage.

How does a pistol shoot holes-touching groups at 10 yards and 25 yard groups that are too big to measure? And then, you post about another which allegedly does the same thing (POA at 15 yards but way off at 20.) How is it even possible?

In this thread:

Also yugo 57 pistol is not really even accurate enough to make them an enjoyable range toy.

But, on December 12, you posted:

If you buy the Tokarev get the yugo one as they are probaly the best quality....

Gee whiz guy, what's the deal with the ever evolving stories and the interchangeable gun histories? I raise the BS flag on this stuff. Please, POA at 15 yards but way off at 20???!!! Come on, now....

One last tidbit:

Ammunition manufactures will only produce ammo if there is large enough demand for it.

In addition to PPShs and CZ 52s, I think they made almost 2,000,000 Tokarev pistols....

 

[Tokarevsrule]

I bought a m57 because I wanted a ccw pistol and a range toy. I also had very little to spend. I like the round mainly because of the stoppnig power. I keep it loaded with Wolf HPs. The low cost was just a benefit. I didn't expect it to stay around. I am planning on getting a 9mm barrel as a plinking barrel, and save the 7.62x25 for defense. 9mm is way too weak for defense.


___________________________________________________
Quote; A 9mm is a 45 set to stun!

 

[xr1200]

Hey Fastcast - Can anyone provide one reputable range report with targets and groups no, they don't exist.

If the M57's were as accurate as ppl claim , then there would be examples all over the net.

Look at the well documented SA range officer reports and ruger sr1911 reports out there, there have been a lot more m57's sold in the last 2 yrs. and not one decent review with a range report.

There is only one indoor shooting range report on YOUTUBE that shows the shooter getting a 2 foot group firing off hand at either 15-20 yrds. so I guess you call that good grouping.

As as you ask I can provide nothing to support claims of good grouping they don't exist , but here is a youtube link to a guy shooting the 2 foot groups.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkhXZaaMBOY and it is a romanium tokarev not the yugo m57

So fastcast where are all the good reviews you speak of.

The simple truth is most of these M57's shoot like crap and anyone that owns one doesn't want to embarress themselves by posting actual range results.

 

[JustinJ]

A friend has an M57 that is easy as hell to make center of mass hits with every pull of the trigger at 50 yards. Did we measure groups with a ruler? No but we were assessing practical use. I have one also that neither of us cant hit a damned thing with. His appears unissued and mine loooks like its been to hell. But me and all the others who dont care to take the time to set up a utube video must be lying.

 

[Headless]

My CZ52 is accurate enough to hit tennis balls 8 of 8 @ 25 yards. No, i don't have target pictures to post - because i shoot tennis balls rather than paper targets usually...and when i do shoot paper targets, i don't keep them around just to prove something to some guy on a forum later by posting videos or pics of my last shooting session. Some of the shots would be more like 30-35 yards since the ball rolls away when you hit it. That's good enough for me; i don't expect to be shooting many people @ 200 yards with my pistol anyway, that's why I have a rifle. My CZ52 doesn't need to shoot sub 1MOA groups, neither does my S&W 5906, my S&W 642, etc. etc. etc... in fact, with sight radius of 6-8 inches, I never would expect to shoot that kind of group anyway. A handgun isn't a rifle, don't expect to be able to aim it like one. Tennis ball sized groups @ 30+ yards are quite reasonable for offhand service pistol shooting.

You're free to disbelieve all you want, but your claims of going from 'touching groups' at 10 yards to "too wide to determine their size' at 20yards are indicative of user error rather than the firearm. Unless those bullets are just tumbling around and curving off into infinity, it's just not going to happen in 15yards that your groups go from touching (1/2") to "too big to measure" (18"? 20"?). Believe it or not, alot of people just shoot their guns and don't find there to be much of a point in posting youtube videos with targets just to prove to somebody somewhere (who can't shoot straight) that it's really their inability to shoot causing the problem and not the gun they are shooting. I see guys like you at the range all the time claiming pistol x or rifle Y are just inaccurate guns. Funny how other people shoot them just fine.