Which 9mm WWB JHP is better, 115 gr. or 147 gr.?

[kerank]

I've read (and agree, it's logical) that you should put around 250 rounds of your chosen SD ammo through your gun to be sure it will feed and fire reliably, and your gun "likes" it.

I'm relatively new to semi-autos, and have managed to get to the range 3 times/month since I bought my Glock 19 (3 months ago). The gun shop sold me a box of 20 Federal Self Defense rounds, and I've read nothing but good things about them. However, at $19.00 per 20, it will take me a while to be able to afford to put 250 rounds of this stuff down range. I figured I would at least try to identify some cheaper stuff that works (WWB JHP) until I have the time/money to test the expensive stuff. Plus, both of these rounds are readily available at my local Acadamy and/or Walmart, so it can't hurt to have a "back-up" ammo preference. I can afford to put 250 rounds through my gun in one or two range visits at these prices.

All that, to ask this.... For home defense (mostly) and carry (rarely), which WWB JHP bullet weight is preferable 115, 147?....does one of these bullets perform better?....is there another alternative in this price range ($12.00 per 50)?

Thanks.

 

[jrpeterman]

Check out the UMC Remington 100 rd. packs, 115 gr., JHP, for $ 14. 87 + tax at Wally World. The Remington JHP have been getting good reviews. It's definitely hotter than WWB. My personal preference is the 115 gr. over the 147 gr. for more penetration as a defensive round.

 

[wally]

YMMV but I'm generally happy with the expensive carry ammo if it works for the following simple test. Shoot 200-300 rounds of the cheap stuff. Then if I can shoot the box of expensive ammo without failures in a dirty gun I'll carry it after cleaning the gun.

I periodically shoot my carry/defense guns at the range as a verification that sitting at the ready for a few months/years hasn't caused any issues. IMHO this is the best way to gain real confidence in your entire gun-ammo-lube-storage-carry system. It helps insure fresh ammo in the gun and doesn't add a large expense up front.

Only once have I had a gun fail these periodic checks after passing the initial checks. It was a FEG RP9K (truck gun) that I mistakingly thought had a 15 round mag (it held 15 and worked at fine the range, but later I learned they had been designed for 14 rounds) and after sitting unused for many months I had a feed failure when I went to shoot the mag empty. I replaced the springs and followers and the gun has passed four more of these tests in the interveaning three years (loaded 14+1 instead of 15+1), although the lack of confidence meant it sat in the safe instead of where I might need it as time went by. I hid a different gun in the truck.

My point is that shooting 300 rounds of this expensive ammo at the range in a week or month would do nothing to prevent the problem which ultimately was operator error from over loading the magazine and took time to manifest. These mags were ultimately rendered defective by my error as they wouldn't feed the cheap stuff afterwards. I guess this experience might lead some support to the guys who suggest loading mags to minus one capacity -- carrying a 14-round mag as 13+1.

--wally.

Edit: I think he's got it bakwards on penetration. The 147 gr 9mm ammo was designed to increase penetration after some high profile failures of adaquate penetration with 115 gr JHP.
Not all 9mm guns can feed these reliably so if you go for the 147gr maybe a little extra testing is in order. My story above involved 147 gr 9mm Hydrashok.

 

[Ken Rainey]

The WWB 147 JHP has gotten some good reviews. The heavier bullet will penetrate better. If I didn't have my 147 Ranger Ts I'd have no problem using the WWB 147 JHP or even the 147 FMJ. Adequate penetration with proper shot placement is what is necessary for defense. Expansion of hollowpoint ammo is a benefit if it still penetrates adequately but expansion is not a guaranteed thing. In the end, picking the one that functions perfectly and that you shoot the best will be most important.

 

[gudel]

the JHP wwb that I bought in 9mm, always in 147gr. I don't think I've seen the wwb JHP 115gr ones. looks like the local walmart doesn't stock the 115gr

 

[chaim]

The 147gr will give better penatration. The 115gr will give more velocity and thus more reliable expansion. In the past I have liked to split the difference with 9mm and go with the 125gr for better penatration than 115gr and more reliable expansion than 147gr. I saw it as the best of both worlds. Some recent research on the net (don't remember the URLs I looked at though) of some ammo tests has me wondering if I'm actually going with the worst of both worlds. I'm switching over to the 147gr when I replace my current crop of 125gr Gold Dots for when I use 9mm for defense.

As for the 200 round minimum, that is a good idea, but if you can't afford it I think you'd be better off with fewer testing rounds of premium ammo. The budget ammo sometimes won't be as consistent as the premium stuff, you will have more ftf, fte, and variations in velocity. The premium stuff will also usually expand more reliably. So, you might be better off practicing with a couple hundred FMJ and the budget JHP to be sure it is reliable, then go with at least 2 or 3 boxes of your chosen self-defense load to be sure it is 100%. Not as good a test as 200-300 rounds of your chosen self-defense load, but enough to have some idea it will work, a lot cheaper, and probably better than using the cheaper stuff for defense (especially in 9mm where ammo selection is more important than in the bigger calibers- there is a pretty large performance difference between the more effective and less effective 9mm loadings, much bigger than the difference between the better and less effective .40 or .45s).

 

[rde]

I prefer the 147 grain WWB myself. Not because of ballistic tables or anything like that. Simply because all of my 9mm handguns (9 of them) shoot the WWB 147 gr JHP very accurately with perfect reliability. Other weights and other brands..there seems to be some deviation (some like this better than that, etc.)...but they all seem to like the 147gr.

 

[ShelbyV8]

I carry 147 wwb JHP in 4" and 115 in shorter barrels.

 

[GoBrush]

All of the reading I have done says that the 115 grain is better. There is a trade off between the mass of a heavier bullet and volocity, and 115 grain in 9mm seems to be the correct choice.

Regarding defense ammo I shot Federal Hydro Shoks for years and it is a great load. New bullet technology though has brought the Speer Gold Dot. This is a bonded bullet which means the copper jacket is bonded to the lead bullet and the bullet maintains its mass much better. This is particularly helpful when and if you ever needed to shoot through something like a car windshield. With other loads the jacket begins to come off of the bullet and breaks up a bit.

Good Luck

 

[kerank]

back from the range..

Just got back from the range. PUt 150 rounds of WWB JHP 147 and 150 rounds of WWB JHP 115. Niether had a glitch. Gotta love my Glock 19.

One thing I don't like about the G19....the more I shoot, the more I want to shoot. Ran out of ammo far to early today!!

 

[obiwan1]

I don't understand the deal on the 147gr bullets. They were origionally developed for SEALS to use in suppressed weapons. They weren't supposed to expand at all, just be subsonic out of an MP5SD.

 

[jonnyc]

Me and my Hi-Powers love 124 grain, JHP and FMJ.

 

[Trebor]

I do NOT reccomend the Winchester White Box JHP's for defensive use for a couple different reasons. The first is that the quality control on the WWB is not as high as the QC done on the premimium defensive ammo loads. There is a greater chance you'll have a bad round when you can least afford it. This can be mitigated somewhat by carefully inspecting every single round before you load your magazines.

The second reason is that the premimium defensive loads will generally use powders that reduce the muzzle flash. The WWB stuff does not use these more expensive powders. Lower muzzle flash is good for shooting in low light conditions. The hollow point bullet design is not the latest technology either.

I understand about cost being a concern. You can really reduce the cost of your ammo by buying on-line. Do a little research ahead of time and pick two or three potentional defensive loads in your caliber. Then look for those loads on-line. You can get significent cost savings that way. Check out ammoman.com, Midway and Brownells and Natchez. One place I've had good luck with is Florida Bullet. Do a search for the URL (maybe floridabullet.com ?)

Seriously, avoid the WWB for self defense if at all possible. It's still probably better than ball ammo though.

 

[trickyasafox]

this might not be an option for you, and im suprised no one suggested it yet (maybe because it's been beaten to death)

but you could make a replica load of your carry ammo if you are a loader. GD, winchester silver tips, all the premium bullets go for no more then 10-11 bucks per hundred in almost any caliber. for 9mm it might be closer to 7 bucks. run a couple of the factory ones over a chrono to get an idea where you need to go, and then cook up a similar load.

there was a post a while back about defensive home brewed loads. if you searched for it maybe some of that info will catch your eye.

 

[S&W 910]

I would never use 147 grain

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_3_48/ai_82551648/pg_2


147-grain: The faddish adoption of the 147-grain subsonic 9mm took more than a decade of street experience to stamp out. Sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't. I saw cases where even the vaunted Black Talon overpenetrated and failed to do the job. The great majority of departments that issued it, including its parent agency, the FBI, have now either gone to .40s, .45s or .357 SIGs, or have gone to a more effective, lighter bullet/higher velocity 9mm round. In good conscience, I cannot recommend any 147-grain subsonic 9mm round for self-defense or police service



115-grain: Federal's 9BP, a 115-grain at 1,160 fps, is the one standard pressure 9mm load that has been around for roughly a quarter century without any horror stories of stopping failures. Every shooting with it that I know of has resulted in a stopped offender, usually with mushroomed bullets lodged in the far side of the body. Last I knew, New Jersey State Police (HK P7M8) and Philadelphia PD (Glock 19s) were still using it with good results.

However, the best results in this grain weight, and indeed in the caliber, have been logged with the Illinois State Police Load. A 115-grain JHP at 1,300 to 1,350 fps, it is available to police from Winchester, Federal and Remington; and to civilians from Pro-Load, Black Hills and others. When you see an autopsy report that indicates the cause of death as "cardiac maceration," and there was only one 9mm round fired, you can be pretty sure it was one of these rounds. When in doubt: Pro-Load Tactical (1st choice) or Federal 9BP 115-grain JHP





http://www.chuckhawks.com/ammo_by_anonymous.htm


Now it is time to impart some crucial information: NEVER use 147 grain ammo in a 9mm pistol! There was a stupid fad for 147 grain hollowpoints a few years ago, and many were suckered into buying these weak, worthless and malfunction-prone rounds. I don't care what you've heard: never use any 9mm hollowpoint heavier than 125 grains. 147 grain hollowpoints often jam in many popular 9mm guns like the Browning Hi-Power, SIG, Beretta 92, S&W and Glock. Ignore the gun magazine hype and stick to what works. If you want to gamble, go to Reno. Don't gamble with your life. 147 grain ammo sucks.


I will now tell you the best 9mm Luger load for self-defense: it is the Cor-Bon 9mm 115 grain +P Jacketed Hollowpoint. This is the most powerful and street-proven manstopper available in this caliber. It is a high velocity (1340 fps) and high pressure round, and more effective than any load restricted to law enforcement use (such as the Federal 9BPLE).



The best standard pressure 9mm load is the Federal 115 grain JHP (9BP). Its effectiveness and accuracy make it the world standard. Buy several boxes. Other excellent standard pressure 9mm loads are the Winchester Silvertip 115 grain (X9MMSHP), and Federal 124 grain Hydra-shok (P9HS1).

 

[AStone]

115 gr +P
124 gr +P JHP
147 gr JHP

I have them all.
At least one of them
is loaded into my 9 on my right side right now.
(Can't remember if this mag is 124 or 147.)

In admittedly limited range sesssions with both
(less than 50 of both; most practice has been with 115's),
I've experienced no problems, but slightly better accuracy with the 147s.
(Not a controlled experiment; could have been that I used them late in the session,
when my technique was tuned a bit more...)

I'll continue to read to see how this story pans out.

Truth, truth, who's got the truth?

Nem

 

[TroyR]

I prefer the 127gr Winchester Ranger T. If not this then the 115gr.