I just bought a dpms 308 and already have an Ar 15 and was wondering what the best powder would be to reload for both rifles. I know Varget is a favorite of a lot of folks but its been hard to find. I would like to get an 8# and looking at my manuals it looks like Rl 15, 8208, Tac and Imr 4064 are a few used in both calibers but would like to hear others experiences. Thanks
Which Powder for both Ar-15 and Ar 10 reloading?
- Thread starter Rogerl830
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Varget. Not highest fps but works well. RL15 works well in each also. I get my best velocity with rl15 in my hunting load for 308. It pushes 150 ttsx out of bolt gun at 2940 fps. About 150 better than my varget loads.
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[email protected]
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BLC-2 and H335 works good in both calibers and they meters great if you are throwing the charges with a powder measure.
mahansm
Member
Grab a couple manuals, figure out what bullet weights you want in both calibers, and then see what powders have data for both. Win 748 meters extremely well and will work nicely with lighter bullets in both calibers. Other candidates include 4895 (both Hodgdon and IMR), Varget, CFE223, TAC, and several others.
You've happened upon a pair of calibers that have very similar requirements for burn rate and are both flexible enough to use a fairly broad range of powders. Good luck.
You've happened upon a pair of calibers that have very similar requirements for burn rate and are both flexible enough to use a fairly broad range of powders. Good luck.
Goju
Member
I would say to try Tac and see how that works for you...Seems to have decent availability lately too.
berettaprofessor
Member
Benchmark, CFE223 have both been okay for me. For that matter, so has Trail Boss if you want a mouse load.
Sunray
Member
"...would like to get an 8#..." Not until you have a load. As mentioned, pick the bullet first.
ColoradoShooter77
Member
IMR-8208 is a tad fast for heavier .308 rounds like 168 grain. For both calibers, H-4895 is great, as is IMR-4895. Tac would also work well.
IMR-8208 will work fine, it just runs higher pressures for same velocity in 168 grain .308 loads.....60,000 psi.
IMR-8208 will work fine, it just runs higher pressures for same velocity in 168 grain .308 loads.....60,000 psi.
I have shot IMR 4895 in the M1a and the AR15 with excellent results. I think any of the 4895 series, that is IMR 4895, H4895 or AA2495 will produce excellent results on target, and that the pressure curves will be appropriate for either actions.
It is my considered opinion, that for gas gun, you want powders that are faster, than slower. Slower powders cause extraction issues during the residual blowback period. My lots of Varget, are on the slow side, great for a bolt rifle, a little iffy for a 308 gas gun. Lots of people use Varget in the AR15 so it is an outstanding powder for that action.
It is my considered opinion, that for gas gun, you want powders that are faster, than slower. Slower powders cause extraction issues during the residual blowback period. My lots of Varget, are on the slow side, great for a bolt rifle, a little iffy for a 308 gas gun. Lots of people use Varget in the AR15 so it is an outstanding powder for that action.
Dudedog
Contributing Member
I had good results with BLC(2) in .223. Meters great. I have never used it in .308 but I have heard it works well for that round also.
ColoradoShooter77
Member
BLC(2) is a great powder for both .223 and .308. Several years ago I loaded some .308 with BLC and it did a good job. Its a tad dirty, but not bad.
Any medium ball powder will work. i.e. BLC-2, H335, H332, Win748, there are more.
I'd go with an extruded powder like IMR4895 if loading for AR15 and AR10 or H4895. I have used my Dillon 550b with IMR4895 with success. Also, I have used RL-15 and H4895 with success in that press.
Personally I try to use BLC-2 in most of my rifle medium rifle applications like 30-30, 303 Brit, and .223/5.56. It just works, and simplifies the bench the same way IMR4895 would for you.
I'd go with an extruded powder like IMR4895 if loading for AR15 and AR10 or H4895. I have used my Dillon 550b with IMR4895 with success. Also, I have used RL-15 and H4895 with success in that press.
Personally I try to use BLC-2 in most of my rifle medium rifle applications like 30-30, 303 Brit, and .223/5.56. It just works, and simplifies the bench the same way IMR4895 would for you.
Gravedigger56
Member
I've had great results with IMR 4895. Soft recoil as well.
Alliant Reloading
Member
Since nobody else has mentioned it yet, let me plug one of our fairly new powders for this application - AR-Comp(R).
AR-Comp is outstanding in both 223Rem and 308Win. It was originally designed for the M118LR application, and it delivers best in class efficiency, accuracy and temperature stability there. It also excels in 223Rem, up through 77gr or so. It ended up a little faster burning than Reloder(R) 15 and Varget, so it is very close to 4895 burn speed wise. At it's burn speed it doesn't deliver the absolute highest velocities, but you can do just fine at good pressures. If higher velocities are needed, you can go to the Reloder 15 speed offerings, or Power Pro(TM) 2000MR. The accuracy on AR-Comp is outstanding though (typically), which is usually more important than 30-50 additional ft/sec.
AR-Comp is not a spherical powder, but a stick powder the same basic size as Reloder 15, so it meters OK. It does also contain decoppering additives.
Shoot well,
Paul
AR-Comp is outstanding in both 223Rem and 308Win. It was originally designed for the M118LR application, and it delivers best in class efficiency, accuracy and temperature stability there. It also excels in 223Rem, up through 77gr or so. It ended up a little faster burning than Reloder(R) 15 and Varget, so it is very close to 4895 burn speed wise. At it's burn speed it doesn't deliver the absolute highest velocities, but you can do just fine at good pressures. If higher velocities are needed, you can go to the Reloder 15 speed offerings, or Power Pro(TM) 2000MR. The accuracy on AR-Comp is outstanding though (typically), which is usually more important than 30-50 additional ft/sec.
AR-Comp is not a spherical powder, but a stick powder the same basic size as Reloder 15, so it meters OK. It does also contain decoppering additives.
Shoot well,
Paul
J_McLeod
Member
With limited testing in about among several others, 8208 has given the best accuracy I've seen from 168gr bullets so far. Right now it's my top choice of powder for both cartridges.
ColoradoShooter77
Member
J Mcleod, I've been loading my .223 rounds with IMR-8208.....stellar results, really like it!
Ball/spherical powders have never been popular with folks getting best accuracy/scores in competition events in semiauto rifles. Best example I know of is when Winchester took over Lake City Army Ammo Plant and used their ball powders in M118 7.62 match ammo. Some top ranked competitors said that ammo should be used in shotguns as it shot patterns much like they do.
Same thing when several of us former Palma Team members developed the first loads for Sierra's new 155-gr. Palma bullet back in 1991. Ball powders metered the most uniform and had very uniform peak pressures and muzzle velocities. But long range test groups were the biggest. Only thing we could figure out was the ball powder slammed the bullet too hard into the rifling deforming and unbalancing it.
Metered charges of IMR4895 had a 3/10ths grain spread compared to the 1/10th grain spread of ball powders. That IMR powder shot bullets well under 1 MOA at 800 yards and beyond. Tested at 600 from a machine rest, it shot under 3 inches for 20 shots of ammo randomly selected as produced by two Dillon 1050 progressives. Not too shabby with new unprepped cases with bullet runout up to .003".
IMR4895 was the powder service teams first used in .223 Rem ammo fired in M16's their first year they were allowed in DCM matches. It's been a good one to use since then.
IMR4064 has proved one of the best powders for heavier bullets in both the .308 and .223 rounds. Many a match won and record set with it. Some of the other stick powders of like speeds are also pretty good such as N140. Charge weight spreads of 2/10ths grain do just fine; don't waste time weighing them to the nth degree of zero spread.
Same thing when several of us former Palma Team members developed the first loads for Sierra's new 155-gr. Palma bullet back in 1991. Ball powders metered the most uniform and had very uniform peak pressures and muzzle velocities. But long range test groups were the biggest. Only thing we could figure out was the ball powder slammed the bullet too hard into the rifling deforming and unbalancing it.
Metered charges of IMR4895 had a 3/10ths grain spread compared to the 1/10th grain spread of ball powders. That IMR powder shot bullets well under 1 MOA at 800 yards and beyond. Tested at 600 from a machine rest, it shot under 3 inches for 20 shots of ammo randomly selected as produced by two Dillon 1050 progressives. Not too shabby with new unprepped cases with bullet runout up to .003".
IMR4895 was the powder service teams first used in .223 Rem ammo fired in M16's their first year they were allowed in DCM matches. It's been a good one to use since then.
IMR4064 has proved one of the best powders for heavier bullets in both the .308 and .223 rounds. Many a match won and record set with it. Some of the other stick powders of like speeds are also pretty good such as N140. Charge weight spreads of 2/10ths grain do just fine; don't waste time weighing them to the nth degree of zero spread.
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