Who Do I Send My10mm 1911 To Make It Run?

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Maybe it will be the effect of the light but it seems to me that the ramp has a concavity. Of course the bullet goes straight against it. Furthermore, I would expect to see a minimum of rounded edges all around the chamber inlet and I would expect the barrel hood to have a small bevel in the lower edge and perhaps a small rounding in the upper one in order to facilitate the rise of the barrel hood along the breech face. It all seems a little too straight to me to work smoothly.
 
Mot45acp said:
Since I couldn't find a 10mm VBOB anywhere, I had a local smith build me a 10mm bobtail commander. This guy is highly regarded in my area. Four months and $3500 later, he delivers me a beautiful 1911 built to my specs. Love at first sight.

Until I shot it, or tried to shoot it. Rounds dead ending into the feed ramp. Not nose diving, just feeding straight into ramp. Ramp is smooth and looks good. Both Sig FMJ and HP, Underwood FMJ and HP. It appeared that the mags were sitting too low. Toying with the idea of a mag catch with higher shelf. Or if there is a mag that holds the rounds higher.

So I take it back with ammo. He says the mags are out of spec. These include the MecGars, he provided, the DW factory and the Tripp Cobras. He adjusts the lips and sends me on my way.

Now none of the mags function in this gun or my Specialist 10mm. I get premature slide lock, rounds FTF on the top of the barrel hood. I think I'm going to trash the mags he mucked with and get more.

Also I can feel the slide slamming back. I believe the gun is under sprung. He told me it has an 18# recoil spring, and a 22# main spring. This seems light to me for a 4.25" 10mm, but I am no gun smith. It does have the flat firing pin stop as per my request.

Question is, should I get different springs? If so which weights would you recommend? Or should i send it off to someone? If so who? I put reliability as my number 1 priority.

I won't name him as I am not looking to trash this gun smith, but it seems to me that this project was above his head.
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I hope they make it right . Caspian is top quality parts . Tripp Cobra mags are top quality as well . I’m going to guess feed ramp problems . Looks rough in the picture . Not polished and sharp edges as already mentioned . I had many bad experiences with gunsmiths and then I just started doing everything myself . Tripp , Bar Sto and Brownells were a wealth of information and were always happy to answer my questions . So I always try to spend as much money as possible with them . It’s a beautiful 1911 in an awesome caliber . Please let us know how it turns out .
 
Mark_Mark said:
it’s also obvious that your a high dollar buyer, and a gentleman. That’s a rare buyers most gunshop die for. They better roll out the red carpet for you, offer you tea with milk and english biscuits every time you show your face in their establishment.
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Haha, no I'm just a guy who's worked on both sides of the counter. I'm not a high roller, but I actually am a customer. Not someone who comes in, wastes 30 min of their time, then loudly proclaim "I CAN GET IT ON THE INTERNET FOR CHEAPER'"

It was in my wedding vows that I get 2 unquestioned gun purchases per month as long as all bills are paid.
 
Mot45acp said:
Haha, no I'm just a guy who's worked on both sides of the counter. I'm not a high roller, but I actually am a customer. Not someone who comes in, wastes 30 min of their time, then loudly proclaim "I CAN GET IT ON THE INTERNET FOR CHEAPER'"

It was in my wedding vows that I get 2 unquestioned gun purchases per month as long as all bills are paid.
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2 Guns a Month!!!!

Let me know if you ever get a divorce, I got YA! ;)
 
Mot45acp said:
I just took it back. The owner of the store that the smith operates out of is pissed that it left his shop like that.

I explained to him that I don't care about "new" or pretty. I'd rather they shoot the crap outta it and have it work.

The reason I'm not raising hell is I have a long history with these folks, I didn't really want to throw a relationship that was built over the last decade away. I get first call when something new or interesting shows up, before they even put it out.

I'm giving them another chance to make it right. If not I will send it off with the lesson learned of not having them build me anything again, and call it good.
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I am glad you took it back, that is the most uncraftmanship piece of crap I have ever seen, I would not be surprised if a BB or a 22lr would have ftf's. It is very obvious that this gunsmith has no pride in his work and would greatly advice you never do business with him again, he is unscrupulous and still blamed it on the magazines.
@Skylerbone thanks for the assist.
 
ms6852 said:
I am glad you took it back, that is the most uncraftmanship piece of crap I have ever seen, I would not be surprised if a BB or a 22lr would have ftf's. It is very obvious that this gunsmith has no pride in his work and would greatly advice you never do business with him again, he is unscrupulous and still blamed it on the magazines.
@Skylerbone thanks for the assist.
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Glad you brought it up actually as I was staring too hard at the pic and had to amend my own post to note the ramped barrel. We both should have guessed it would be, given the caliber but I think the idea of a heartbroken fellow member with a broke pistol had everyone’s mind a bit scrambled.

I did once see pics from a famous gunsmith who would blend the traditional frame/barrel ramps together. Was mortifying to many who saw the proudly displayed pics though he claimed his builds were completely reliable.

If I could pick someone from THR to put eyes on this, @BBBBill or @tarosean would both have a better understanding of the 1911 IMO. Maybe something obvious we all missed.
 
ontarget said:
As I see it, you paid that smith a lot of money to build you a gun. You should NOT be expected to accept a nonfunctional gun.
If it's over his head, it should be on him to sub contact the work to someone who can handle it, ON HIS DIME.
As a contractor myself, if I get in over my head, it's on me to find a way to provide my customer with a satisfactory job AT THE QUOTED PRICE, even if I screwed up my quote.
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I agree. Go back to the "gunsmith" and demand what you paid for - a working firearm. All you have now is a pistol shaped object. If he cannot get it to work then demand your money back.
Don’t be afraid to resort to small claims court if necessary.
 
Mot45acp said:
Parts were mirror polished pre nitride, I saw them when I did final check before they sent parts out to nitride. They are still smooth as glass
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People that have been through similar things are just trying to be helpful . Regardless the feeding problem can be resolved . Just please let us know what fixes it so others can learn from it . Usually it’s more than one thing . I doubt if it will be your last custom pistol .
 
Haven't read previous posts. A weak/undersprung recoil spring will cause feeding issues. A overly tight extractor will cause feeding issues especially with a weak recoil spring. Premature slide lock is caused by the bullet tip hitting the slide lock. It needs to have the inner edge reduced to clear what ever cartridge your using. Rare but your slide lock may be linked to your feed issue if the cartridge are being held up by the slide lock.
 
earplug said:
Haven't read previous posts. A weak/undersprung recoil spring will cause feeding issues. A overly tight extractor will cause feeding issues especially with a weak recoil spring. Premature slide lock is caused by the bullet tip hitting the slide lock. It needs to have the inner edge reduced to clear what ever cartridge your using. Rare but your slide lock may be linked to your feed issue if the cartridge are being held up by the slide lock.
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The failure to feed happens before the rim engages the extractor
 
Mot45acp said:
Parts were mirror polished pre nitride, I saw them when I did final check before they sent parts out to nitride. They are still smooth as glass
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Unfortunately the fact that the surfaces are smooth as glass doesn't help much if the geometry of the surfaces is wrong or messed up. As has been said, it is likely to be a sum of problems such as a too stiff extractor or too sharp edges in the side walls of the breech face where the rim of the case must slide up or the surface of the breech face not properly finished. Of course if the fault were exclusively the magazine release button, it would be much easier to solve.

Please keep us updated as I believe it will be interesting for all who are participating in the discussion to know what the problem was.
 
Mot45acp said:
Since I couldn't find a 10mm VBOB anywhere, I had a local smith build me a 10mm bobtail commander. This guy is highly regarded in my area. Four months and $3500 later, he delivers me a beautiful 1911 built to my specs. Love at first sight.

Until I shot it, or tried to shoot it. Rounds dead ending into the feed ramp. Not nose diving, just feeding straight into ramp. Ramp is smooth and looks good. Both Sig FMJ and HP, Underwood FMJ and HP. It appeared that the mags were sitting too low. Toying with the idea of a mag catch with higher shelf. Or if there is a mag that holds the rounds higher.

So I take it back with ammo. He says the mags are out of spec. These include the MecGars, he provided, the DW factory and the Tripp Cobras. He adjusts the lips and sends me on my way.

Now none of the mags function in this gun or my Specialist 10mm. I get premature slide lock, rounds FTF on the top of the barrel hood. I think I'm going to trash the mags he mucked with and get more.

Also I can feel the slide slamming back. I believe the gun is under sprung. He told me it has an 18# recoil spring, and a 22# main spring. This seems light to me for a 4.25" 10mm, but I am no gun smith. It does have the flat firing pin stop as per my request.

Question is, should I get different springs? If so which weights would you recommend? Or should i send it off to someone? If so who? I put reliability as my number 1 priority.

I won't name him as I am not looking to trash this gun smith, but it seems to me that this project was above his head.
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Without reading any of the other comments, if this were my situation, I'd take the pistol back to him, ask that he make it reliable, and show proof afterwards it works properly before you accept it again. If he cannot or will not make good on it, name him on the forums and in your local area as an unreliable gunsmith. Negative publicity is about all you have as a recourse, it is doubtful you'll get any of your money back. To be fair to him, tell him beforehand you will give extremely negative reviews of his work.
 
Skylerbone said:
Glad you brought it up actually as I was staring too hard at the pic and had to amend my own post to note the ramped barrel. We both should have guessed it would be, given the caliber but I think the idea of a heartbroken fellow member with a broke pistol had everyone’s mind a bit scrambled.
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Happens to the best of us. Difficult to see the obvious at times.
 
The feed ramp, barrel throat, bullet profile, and the magazine are the only things that will affect feed.

Realize that if the extractor has not yet engaged the round, then all that has happened in the feed cycle is the disco rail stripping the round from the magazine.

Most commonly, when a slide and frame are fitted, there is vertical geometry to consider. The higher the slide is in relation to the frame, the higher it impacts the top round in the magazine. As these strikes become more and more off center, they will tend to force the round bullet down where it crashes against the feed ramp.

The solution is of course to lower the slide, but that isn’t easy or cheap. So the more common fix is to get the magazine to sit higher within the frame and relative to the disconnector rail. Thus the EGW Higher Catch solution.

Now the magazine itself will affect feed in several possible ways. Where the mag cutout is positioned can make a difference in how high it sits. The follower, if it tends to tilt can affect alignment and encourage nosedive. The feed lips determine the release point including early (possible uncontrolled loose round) or late (not allowing the round to position under the extractor before making ramp contact. Given the brands and varied known working magazines of the OP, I feel we can eliminate some of the above possibilities.

Now we don’t have an angle measurement of the barrel ramp itself but as this is a ramped barrel, well, it comes from the factory predetermined. I should not think that an experienced gunsmith would have removed enough material in the wrong places to radically alter that angle. Possible, seen pictures of such horrors, but not most likely scenario IMO.

All of that leads back to magazine positioning and the potential for this to be a very inexpensive fix to a rather common problem. As good as Caspian’s reputation is, there are still wide variations f rom time to time that must be accounted for. Bob Rodgers posts class project updates for each of his classes and I recall his mentioning making dimensional adjustments ahead of his students’ arrival to save critical time.

It truly sucks when something new and expensive does not function correctly. It does happen, some smiths are better versed in handling issues, and I hope this one can get it right. I am also of the camp that is thankful the OP is handling the situation as a hiccup rather than a catastrophe. I can count on 1 finger the number of times I chose to yell or threaten legal action in such instances and zero were the times it helped.

Best wishes for a positive outcome.
 
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Atavar said:
Still, if I paid $3500 for a pistol I would demand it was right when it was put in to my hands. For that money it should feed everything from wad cutters to spire tips perfectly, and print 50 yard cloverleafs.
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Of course, as should any $1,500 1911, but they aren’t all 100% out of the box. Demands won’t ever bring that percent up to perfect and so a calm, methodical approach that begins with giving the smith an opportunity seems reasonable.
 
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