Who needs a paintball gun ...

[Dave P]

... when ya got tomatoes:

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Tomato-Throwing Man Shot To Death
Police Say 10 People Were Throwing Tomatoes At Cars

POSTED: 5:22 p.m. EDT September 2, 2003

MILLERSBURG, Ohio -- The Holmes County Sheriff's Office said someone fatally shot a man for throwing tomatoes at his car.

Steven Keim, 23, was hit with several shotgun blasts about 11:30 p.m. Monday. The man, from Apple Creek in neighboring Wayne County, was declared dead at a hospital early this morning.

Authorities said about 10 people ages 15 to 23 were throwing tomatoes and firing paintball guns at passing cars from a corn field on state Route 241 near Mount Hope.

Members of the group told deputies that the driver of a luxury car stopped when a tomato hit it and threatened that he would shoot if it happened again. The driver then turned around, passed the group and was struck again with tomatoes.

Deputies said the car returned about a half hour later, and the driver got out with a shotgun and started shooting.

***************
I imagine we won't see the shooter again for a long time!

 

[jsalcedo]

I'ts really hard for me to feel sorry for "young adults" who fire paintball guns at unsuspecting victims. The tomato throwing is vandalism.

Did the person deserve to die?

Maybe..maybe not. He was at least given once chance to live.

If I was warned to stop vandalizing and firing a paintball gun in an unsafe manner under threat of being shot by a real gun... you bet I'd quit.

This incident falls under the Darwin catagory.

 

[OF]

Uhhhh, I beg to differ...this falls under the 'premeditated murder' category. I don't care how badly they 'vandalized' your car, you don't get to kill people over it. Period.

Was it stupid? Yes. Do you get to kill people for being stupid? No. I sincerely hope the shooter gets to spend the rest of his life in prison.

- Gabe

 

[jsalcedo]

GRD:

What if someone was driving with their window open and got smacked in the side of the head with a paintball going 300+FPS?

What if a Tomato totally obscured the windshield of a car and caused
a motorist to wreck possibly killing someone?

These vandals were engaging in potentially deadly behavior and were given a chance to stop.

If a cop was being attacked with paintball guns do you think he would use deadly force if the attackers failed to heed his warnings?

 

[TallPine]

We need more tomato control laws

Do you know that you can just walk into a store and buy them without even a background check?

You can thank the powerful NTA (National Tomato Association) for that

Do it for the children!

 

[Ridgeway]

As the driver of what I consider to be a rather nice car that I take extreme pride in- I can certainly understand the driver's reaction. Though, IMO he should have immediatly notifed the police to have them arrested instead of going home for a shotgun.
The shooter will definitly be spending alot of time in prison, but I do hope that the "kids" get their fair share of punishment!
I would personally really hate to be cruising down the road in my roadster w/the top down and get pelted with paintballs potentially going well over 300 FPS and also being shot @ a rate of 20 per/sec...

 

[OF]

Deadly force for being attacked by a tomato. You have got to be kidding.

What if a Tomato totally obscured the windshield of a car and caused a motorist to wreck possibly killing someone?

What if a pretty woman was flashing passer-by on the side of the road, would you go home get your shotgun and kill her for it? I am having a hard time taking you seriously on this.

If a cop was being attacked with paintball guns do you think he would use deadly force if the attackers failed to heed his warnings?

Uhhhh...no. Deadly force is absolutely NOT justified to stop people from shooting paintballs at you. The fact that you think it is is cause for some concern, actually.

The guy in the incident told the kids to stop throwing fruit and paintballs at cars, drove home and got his gun, came back and murdered one of them. Somehow you think this is acceptable behavior. In this country we lock people up for murder, some of them we even kill.

If you carry a gun, or even own a gun, you should spend some serious time looking into deadly force laws as your current understanding is a little...disconcerting.

- Gabe

 

[longtom4570]

Were do i sign up for the NTA and do the allow for concealed carry

 

[OF]

I can certainly understand the driver's reaction.

What?! Getting mad I can understand. Getting foaming mad, I can understand. Yelling and screaming I can understand. Grabbing one of the little ingrates by his ear and yelling I can understand. Calling the cops I can understand.Going home, getting a shotgun, returning to the scene and MURDERING SOMEONE I absolutely cannot understand. It is sad. Beyond sad, it's disgusting.

May he rot in hell.

- Gabe

 

[Destructo6]

I certainly wouldn't say that the driver's final reaction, that is premeditated murder, was in any way warranted in that situation.

However, the tomato tossers (in every definition of the word) opened the can of worms on their own volition and deserve little sympathy.

 

[synoptic]

Uhhhh...no. Deadly force is absolutely NOT justified to stop people from shooting paintballs at you. The fact that you think it is is cause for some concern, actually.

Actually, paintballs can cause "Grave bodily harm" and if they are shooting them at you then the threat is imminent and you can shoot back. In fact, in Texas you are even allowed to respond to a punch with deadly force because the punch could be aimed at your throat, eye socket, etc... The same would apply to a paintball. But, that wasn't quite the situation here. His car was hit with a tomato, he left the scene, when he returned he was the aggressor. He should have called the cops and let them handle this. He gives us a bad name and gives the liberals more ammo against us. Hope he gets punished.

 

[spacemanspiff]

DEMISE in the other closed dupe thread said:

...may have killed someone whose only "crime" was being there.

i'd be willing to bet that if law enforcement had come upon the tomato throwers and paintball shooters they would have charged them with perhaps 'disturbing the peace' or 'wreckless endangerment'.

 

[Sportcat]

Can we merge this with the other "tomato/shooter" thread, please?

 

[OF]

If paintballs and tomatoes constitute 'grave bodily harm' then I'm the pope. Are we that wussified that getting a tomato splatted on your car is grounds for opening fire? Or even, as some here seem to be able to 'understand' (because they have a nice car, or think that 23 year olds are too old for this kind of nonsense), going home, getting your shotgun and then killing people? I'm stunned.

This guy deserves to hang.

- Gabe

 

[13xx]

what i dont understand is if he was so content on shooting his gun why didnt he just shoot it up in the air or in the ground and try and scare them off rather than open fire on them.

 

[uglymofo]

This guy deserves to hang.

I'll agree with that. But one thing's for sure, there's about nine other guys from that field that'll never tomato another car, and probably none of their future kids will either.

Hey, if you're gonna be stupid, ya gotta be tough.

 

[outfieldjack]

Listen......

Going home and getting a shotgun was wrong.

HOWEVER.... If I am out with my family and someone starts shooting at us with a paintball gun..... your Dang right I am going to take cover and return fire. My brother (Sportcat) and I have been paintball fighting MANY times..... ever wonder WHY they require you to wear a face guard, helmet, etc.... because they are DANGEROUS!

Why do we always say the "response" was wrong when the ORIGINAL action was wrong as well?!?!?! Two wrongs don't make a rigth.... But when you "ambush" cars with tomatos and paintball guns you should expect the worst..... unfortunatly for the "childern of the corn" it happened.

 

[Daniel T]

i'd be willing to bet that if law enforcement had come upon the tomato throwers and paintball shooters they would have charged them with perhaps 'disturbing the peace' or 'wreckless endangerment'.

I'd be willing to bet that as well. I'd also be willing to bet that punishment for those offenses doesn't get you strapped to a gurney and IVs stuck in your arm.

If the standard for "grave bodily harm" is that there could be an off chance of getting an eye put out, then there would probably be a lot of targets. Hey, does that guy over there have a baseball? It could possibly fracture your skull. Get shooting, killer.

 

[Sportcat]

I agree... guy shouldn't have shot for tomatos, but being pelted with paintballs will get you shot.

You might blind me, but you'll be plant food.

 

[spacemanspiff]

the tomato throwers and paintball shooters WERE in fact commiting crimes, and they were endangering the safety of those they were pranking. if there was a driver like my mother she'd likely swerve off the road and into a ditch, possibly being killed in the crash. or worse yet, swerve into another vehicle.

yeah, thats the product of 'kids just having fun'.
maybe i wouldnt open fire if i knew it was just rotten tomatos and paintballs. but you can be damn sure i'd deliver a filled to the brim can of whoopass.

the amish arent supposed to fight back, right?

 

[Sportcat]

the amish arent supposed to fight back, right?

Wonder if they're related to the French?

 

[Dionysusigma]

Aren't the Amish German?

Hell, if I came under attack like that, what's the first thing to do? ASESS THE SITUATION. ONLY if they are actually using real guns, use yours. If it is just tomatoes and paintballs, head to Wal-Mart, get yourself a painball gun (if you don't have one already) and pop them back. Throw a few tomatoes of your own. If you've got a Class 3, use flashbangs

Honestly, though. Call the police. There are times for self-defense and times to let the LEO's do their job.

 

[Daniel T]

You might blind me, but you'll be plant food.

And you'll be Bubba's pretty little plaything when you go to jail for murder.

 

[Sportcat]

So I'm not allowed to defend myself against someone who is intentionally shooting me with a device which is known to maim and severly injure people?

I'm going do whatever it takes to protect myself and my family. If that means retreat, Iwill. If that means taking someone's life, I will!

I'll take my chances in the courts.

 

[Vitamin G]

I frequent both the Paintball and Firearms message boards. I've been an avid paintball player since 1996. I've been competing in paintball tournaments since 1998.

If you think a paintball flying at 300fps (the LEGAL limit for competition) cannot do serious bodily harm, you're wrong.

Keep in mind that 300fps is the LEGAL limit for paintballs in competitions. Most paintball guns rely on springs to achieve the force of hitting the valve to allow gas to go through the gun, to launch the paintball. Some guns can hit up to 400fps. Most of them can be found at Wal-Mart, K-mart, and the like.

IN ADDITION to this, bear in mind that paintballers usually wear multiple layers of clothing, and facemasks to protect their eyes.

As if this wasn't enough... What if I told you that my electropneumatic paintball gun was EASILY capable of firing upwards of 15+ balls PER SECOND with very good accuracy up to about 35-40 yards.... AND my paintball gun can hold 200 balls before i'd have to reload. Oh, and "reloading" it takes about 3 seconds. Its the equivalent to opening some tupperwear, dumping something in, and closing it. If you're good, you can reload WHILE shooting, and never miss a beat.

We've all heard the stories about some little girl who lost her eye when she was shot in a paintball drive by. That was ONE paintball from a $100 gun from wal-mart. I can't say for sure, but its a good certainty that it was probably traveling between 290 and 320fps. Thats about as fast as that particular gun can shoot without splitting the balls open.

Imagine being shot by even FIVE of them per second....

Me personally? I'd throw my left hand over my eyes, spread my fingers far enough to see, and return fire. I personally feel (and would risk) that a jury or judge would be convinced.

If anyone likes.... I can probably rummage through the hard drive for some welts I got from tournaments from LEGAL speed limits, with 2 layers of clothing on.
Edit... Found it... 300fps at about 5 foot range. Its what they call "Bunkering"
http://pbnation.com/attachment.php?s=&postid=523514