Why do some people do this??

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by AK Hunter, Jun 2, 2021.

  1. AK Hunter

    AK Hunter Member

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    Be carful & double check your brass you pick up from the range.
    I just caught this before I started to prime & had to go back through to check them all.
    It was on .45 auto brass, the cases on the left have had the flash hole opened up way too far. It looks to me that someone was trying to go without putting much powder in the case. Why do you think this was done.

    45-flash-hole.jpg
     
  2. forrest r

    forrest r Member

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    Wax or glue bullets, primer only short range indoor loads.
     
  3. griff383

    griff383 Member

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    Those are factory. I can't remember why but I want to say its the non toxic or win-clean or whatever fancy term. I thought the same thing first time I came across and found a bunch of info on the line when I asked the Google.
     
  4. Dunross

    Dunross Member

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    May have also been for wax-loads to keep the primers from backing out and binding the cylinder.

    I mark my wax-load brass, but some probably do not.
     
  5. .38 Special

    .38 Special Member

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    I have shot a lot of wax through revolvers, but find it annoying in auto pistols. Not only does the slide need to be cycled by hand, but most of the time the rounds won't feed from the magazine, so need to be inserted into the chamber individually.

    So my bet is that those are Winchester's "Super Clean" or similar, which use zinc bullets and lead-free primers, largely in an effort to make indoor shooting a bit less poisonous.
     
  6. forrest r

    forrest r Member

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    Odd not "NT" stamped on them

    The win-clean ammo from ww was an enclosed brass bullet.

    Now everyone calls them tmj's.

    FWIW:
    coated bullets are a form of tmj
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
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  7. AK Hunter

    AK Hunter Member

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    So you are saying it's not someone drilling out the flash holes, it's made that way??
    I agree they need to be marked. I take it that they shouldn't be reloaded in the normal manner? Right?
     
  8. Bazoo

    Bazoo Member

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    Larry Gibson over on the castboolits forum did some testing with 308win if I recall correctly, in which flash holes were drilled with increasingly larger diameters and pressure tested. The result was that pressure went down slightly as the flash hole size increased.

    Of course that being only a single test isn't definitive. And by the nature of pressure variations, it may well have opposite results depending on other variations.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
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  9. .38 Special

    .38 Special Member

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    It has been said for decades that over-large flash holes increase pressure, but I have never come across any objective tests on the subject. For that matter, I have never even come across anyone who has reloaded such cases and then claimed to have experienced increase pressure.

    I have, though, come across several people who have reloaded them with mid-range loads and claimed to experience nothing unusual. Perhaps they are flirting with disaster, but it seems like there would have been some evidence of it.

    Regardless, I don't think I would try it during normal times. These may not qualify, though, and if I felt a real need, I think I would load them up on the lighter side and give them a go.
     
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  10. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    I only pick up my own brass which I have marked. No more hunting and pecking!
     
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  11. AJC1

    AJC1 Member

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    I just ran across two of these this week i planned on posting about. Both have Winchester headstamps. The two I spotted are destined for the recycling bin. Strange this came up at the same time. My flash holes look way to ragged to be factory I hope.
     
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  12. FROGO207

    FROGO207 Member

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    It is possible somebody is using them with wax or glue bullets in moon clips in something that uses 45 ACP.
     
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  13. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    Yep, is why I agree, drilled out for wax, glue, or rubber bullets.
     
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  14. dartor

    dartor Member

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    Win clean with larger flash holes were made about 2001 or so. They were very common then. I've reloaded thousands of the cases with no noticeable difference. I still have some in my 45 Auto stash. I run across one every now and then scroungin' range brass.
     
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  15. Bazoo

    Bazoo Member

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    Federal has some larger holed 45 auto brass out there. Not as large as pictured albeit. I've loaded a mess of them indiscriminately, with full power loads. Course I can't tell the pressure, but my 1911 doesn't balk any.
     
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  16. Palladan44

    Palladan44 Member

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    Good post, never noticed this in any .45s and truth be told never checked for that detail.

    I tumble with primer-in...
    And on the Dillon 550B, de priming and re priming occur almost simultaneously.
    Nice catch
     
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  17. Airborne Falcon
    • Contributing Member

    Airborne Falcon Contributing Member

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    Yeah today they are calling them TPJs ... total polymer jacket.

    TMJ was typically Total Metal (plated) Jacket.
     
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  18. AJC1

    AJC1 Member

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    So is the consensus it's a non issue in 45??? The testing in rifle made a difference on target. My continual drive for uniformity in realoads says for range pickups loosing 2 for peace of mind is ok.
     
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  19. DanK3Pos

    DanK3Pos Member

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    I de-prime on the progressive. I would never see that. Of those with progressive presses, I don't think I'm in the minority, in that regard.

    If I found something like that, I'd just toss it.
     
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  20. Ranger99

    Ranger99 Member

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    JMHO- I don't diddle with range brass
    any more. I've problems a couple of times
    that were a royal pain to put right, and since
    my time is the most valuable thing I have,
    ( I have less every day, and it can't be
    replaced for any amount of money)
    I try not to waste what little I have left
    Any crap brass I come across gets
    smashed flat with a hammer to save
    butt pains for me or anybody else
     
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  21. forrest r

    forrest r Member

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    The other reason to drill the holes larger in the 308w's was if you're using an extremely light load it doesn't lock the action of a bolt action rifle up.
     
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  22. Bcwitt

    Bcwitt Member

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    Winchester made them for certain loads, I'm not sure why. I have loaded them without issues, but i never felt good about it.
     
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  23. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    They have gotten in my mix before, seemingly no issues, after all, the .45 ACP runs pretty low pressures to start with.
     
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  24. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

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    I don't know that I've ever seen factory brass punched out like that, and that includes SP .45ACP brass and the NT brass. I don't usually say 'never' anymore, and particularly with .45ACP brass, which manufacturers seem to be trying to bugger up for some reason. .45ACP used to be one of the easiest rounds to load for, and now you have to put every case under a microscope to make sure it's right.
     
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  25. H&R Glock

    H&R Glock Member

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    Yup= wax bullets, I used to drill mine too. Standard procedure
     
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