Why is there still a cachet to the term "Pre-Ban?"

[Rugerlvr]

I don't understand this, and I'm hoping someone will educate me. I've been looking at stuff on gunbroker.com and other places, and there are still sellers out there calling Hi-Cap mags "Pre-Ban" like there's some special cachet about them. I don't get it. Are they just trying to fleece the rubes who think there's still some ban on? I mean you can go to cheaperthandirt.com or any other supplier and get these things new since the sunset...

What am I missing?

 

[Dave Markowitz]

Some states, e.g., New York, still have their own AWBs. So for NY residents, pre-ban still has significance.

 

[redranger1]

maybe its habit? i dont really know but i agree that its pointless.

 

[Rugerlvr]

Some states, e.g., New York, still have their own AWBs. So for NY residents, pre-ban still has significance.

Hmm, that's possible. I even saw something in this year's Cabela's shooting catalog about a high-cap Mini-14 mag about "These are grandfathered in" or something. I just wonder how often they check the copy in those things..

Makes me glad I live in one of the most gun-friendly states around. Now if I can just get off my ass and go get my CC permit...

 

[ravencon]

In Massachusetts one can legally buy a pre-ban AR-15, for example, with all the naughty "assault rifle" features whereas a new AR-15 with those features may not be legally sold/purchased.

So, the designation "pre-ban" has very meaningful significance here.

 

[Dbl0Kevin]

What I don't understand is how do they tell in states such as NY that a hi-cap magazine is pre or post ban since they are now unmarked?

 

[ravencon]

What I don't understand is how do they tell in states such as NY that a hi-cap magazine is pre or post ban since they are now unmarked?

I've heard rumors that some people do in fact buy hi-cap magazines and illegally bring them into their "no new hi-cap magazines" jurisdiction. Imagine that!

 

[rellascout]

What I don't understand is how do they tell in states such as NY that a hi-cap magazine is pre or post ban since they are now unmarked?

All STANDARD capacity mags that where manufactured during the ban state that they are for LEO/Military use only. So in a state like CA or NY these mags are obvious.

Mags that are being currently manufactured STANDARD cap mags no not have this marking but it would not be hard to determine their date of manufacture. In those states if you are caught with STANDARD cap mags the burden of proof is on you to prove that they are preban.

 

[Zen21Tao]

In addition to geographic significance there can also be a nastalgia element. I would imagine that there are some people that want to own something that existed prior to, and subsequently endured, the federal AWBan.

I also think that there is a desirability in some to own something that is marked for Gov/LEO use only.

In addition there could be a laziness where some dealers just haven't changed the sales ads they ran prior to the AWB. You see this sometimes in shotgun news.

 

[DMK]

Partially because some people paid buku bucks for their magazines or firearms "with all the evil features" during the dark years and now just can't let it go.

 

[Czar]

In those states if you are caught with STANDARD cap mags the burden of proof is on you to prove that they are preban.

I thought burden of proof was on the accuser.

Glad I live in Colorado and don't have to worry about such sillyness... Now I'm going to go put my my CZ-75 on my ankle with it's standard compact capacity magazine and go out for dinner. And yes, my CCW is in my wallet!

 

[AJAX22]

in California, we avoid the LEO mags like the plague, you get caught with one, there's no saying 'oh officer, but I had that before the ban' its do not pass go time.

I look forward to the day when I can proudly carry around LEO mags, (when we get rid of all the bans) but that day is far distant.

 

[American_Pit_Bull]

Guess it is the same as people referring to Standard Capacity mags as "hi-capacity"

After the sunset there are two types of mags. Standard and neutered.

 

[ArmandTanzarian]

I don't get it.

Nor should you. There is nothing to get, except that they're hoping for unknowledgeable suckers out there who may *think* (be duped into thinking) that there's something to being "pre-ban". Pure tomfoolery.

 

[Creeping Incrementalism]

in California, we avoid the LEO mags like the plague, you get caught with one, there's no saying 'oh officer, but I had that before the ban' its do not pass go time.

It's legal to use parts from magazines made after the ban as replacements for magazines you had before, so there is a very legitimate reason why you might have "LEO only" mags.

 

[Kramer Krazy]

I believe the biggest issue is people using the term incorrectly. A "pre-ban" AK-47 would be prior to 1989. A "pre-ban" MAK-90 is 1990-1994. A "pre-ban" hi-cap mag would have been made before the ban went into effect in 1994. Now, everything that was made after 1994 and is labeled as "pre-ban" is actually a "pre-ban configuration", "LE Only", or actually a "post-ban"..... at least this is the way I view it.

 

[Vitamin G]

I enjoy openly mocking dealers at the gun shows trying to sell a $2000 "Pre-ban!" AR-15 thats bone stock. Usually i get some responce like "Well thats what I paid for it".
Yeah well, I'm sure people with tons of Enron stock are wishing they could sell it for what they paid for it. Thats the market for you.

 

[Limeyfellow]

For foreign military arms there is the 1989 ban that preban refers too. This was a limited form of the AWB and only applied to importation of firearms with certain features such as pistol grip, bayonets, detachable magazines, grenade launcher and so on. The only way they are allowed to come into the country then is when they have been classified as curio and relics.

Thats where preban status still applies that it allows you to change the firearm if it was imported before this date. Its even worse with the 2005 ban on foreign military weapon's recievers and barrels into the country.

Then you have states that have adopted the AWB into state law and so still apply in these specific places.

 

[gopguy]

The application with magazines means little in most states. With guns the term actually still makes sense, especially in the states afflicted with hopolophobic liberals. A lot of the firearms prohibited from importation in 1989 either will never come back or if they do it is only with aftermarket American parts that sometimes work.....sometimes not. Anyone who has had a problematic Century Cetme or copy of the HK 91 will know what I mean. That is just one example. I would be hard pressed to name anything being made now that matches the quality of the originals that were banned in 1989 from import. With the Colt AR15 the term still matters. Colt will not make a preban configuration AR 15 style rifle. What they offer now still is without bayonet lug or collapsable stock. good example here.

http://www.coltsmfg.com/cmci/MTM4.asp

With companies like Bushmaster,Eagle, and their AR rifles it matters only in the states allowing pre 1994 guns. Armalite, the original company making the AR 180 matters in the 60s&70s matters in those states the new AR180 is a different animal.....their new AR10 too. If you have handled an original you know what I mean... Any of this recent stuff is not allowed in those states that adopted the Clinton ban. I can go on and on about this........silly and stupid that we ever had a ban. in 1989 or in 1994:banghead: The optomist who said

I look forward to the day when I can proudly carry around LEO mags, (when we get rid of all the bans) but that day is far distant.

I hope it happens in our lifetimes......but I would not bet on it. I suspect if we don't fight them on this now we will lose more ground......especially if the Democrats pick up seats in Congress.

 

[AndyC]

Its even worse with the 2005 ban on foreign military weapon's recievers and barrels into the country.

My apologies for the hijack, but would someone please explain what that is? There's still some sort of ban on *cough* assault rifles?

 

[Diomed]

AndyC -

I've tried getting details on this too, from what I have been able to find out (which isn't much and could very well be wrong), all military weapons must be in original configuration. Stripped actions and plain barrels are now prohibited from import.

What folks elsewhere were thinking of doing was sticking the good barrel (for example) that they want on to a junk receiver with various spare parts and stocking it up in order to get it in the country. Whether that actually happens, I dunno.

If anyone has a good, straight answer on this, I'd like to hear it.