Why?

[Quiet]

Walther also just introduced the PPS, pocket-sized 9x19mm and .40S&W.

Some people like the Glock subcompacts (Model 26 [9x19mm], 27 [.40S&W], 28 [.380ACP], 33 [.357SIG], 39 [.45GAP]) as "pocket guns".

 

[HisSoldier]

"I've often wondered that myself. I'd like to see an alloy frame P3AT."
I'd like to see a steel framed one.

 

[SouthpawShootr]

probably none of them want to get the name that gets associated with the fact that a great % of crimes are committed with such guns... look at how kel-tec and hi-point get blasted in the news...

Really? I'd like to see some hard data to back this up. If you believe what you hear on the news, I've got another one for you......... I'm not intimately familiar with the Hi-Point line, but I've never seen one that could fit into a pocket.

I think most of the major companies feel like they're doing just fine and don't want to spend the R&D money on new designs for what they view as a limited market. Especially when they've got model that will "make do" (S&W chief's special and Centennial series, Glock's subcompacts). Ruger is cultivating a more sportsman like image and hideout designs will likely detract from that but they do have one model that will make do (2" SP101s).

Small autos in major calibers (9mm, .40, etc) are notoriously difficult to get reliable and these days, if it doesn't work 100% out of the box it's going back and the owner will post about it in a negative light on 20 gunboards read by 100,000 potential customers. Anybody see an upside in any of this?

 

[orionengnr]

Glock makes the Models 26 (9mm) and 28 (.380), both easily concealed in a pocket.

Gee, I tried the G-26. Looks like a brick in my pocket.

I have yet to find a double-stack anything that is actually a pocket pistol. That includes the Kel-Tec P-11 I just bought.

And is now for sale...pm me if you want one.

 

[Bobo]

Halo is for Kids said;

I've often wondered that myself. I'd like to see an alloy frame P3AT.

The P-3AT has an aluminum alloy frame.

 

[ABBOBERG]

Hence why go to the expense of more engineers, r and d work, and machine costs to make a product that your main buyer will not purchase, and may stop buying from you based on that pocket gun you just released to a very small consumer demand last month?

I agree. In order for the big manufacturers to take a major caliber pistol and shrink if from 6.5" down to 5.5", it would take a major re-design. So far, all these manufacturers (Glock, Springfield, S&W, H&K, etc.) have been willing to do is take a full-sized gun and chop off the barrel and the grip in several increments. Some have gone to nesting recoil springs to get sub-compacts, but that doesn't take major R&D and re-design.

Just look at Kahr. In order for Kook-Jin "Justin" Moon to break the "size barrier" an entire re-design was required. As a result, several patents came out of the effort. His reward is to sell 5000+ pocket-sized guns per year. I think the big companies have noticed this and are just not interested in this small of a market, especially with many of them selling several hundred thousand guns a year.

I think that another factor that the police and military would not be as interested in pocket-sized guns is the loss of power. These guys often encounter harder targets than consumers. Penetration is key.

If you look at some of the published specs on performance, there is a significant difference between full sized guns and pocket-sized guns.
Based on hundreds of data points found in publications combined with results of my own, I have found that when you compare a full-sized Glock 17 or Beretta 92F (M9) to pocket-sized guns in the same caliber, this is how much energy you lose:

1. Rohrbaugh R9S- 113 ft-lbs
2. Kahr PM9 - 87 ft-lbs
3. Kel-Tec PF9 - 69 ft-lbs

Here are some sub-compacts:

1. Walther PPS - 67 ft-lbs
2. Glock 26 - 47 ft-lbs
3. S&W M&P-C - 54 ft-lbs
4. Springfield XD9-C - 62 ft-lbs

I truly do not believe that police and military ignore pocket guns due to "political correctness". After all, cops do buy back-up guns. However, I believe that since they have space alloted for a full-sized weapon, they want maximum power and capacity for their primary sidearm.

An opportunity that the big gun manufacturers are missing is to shrink-down (not chop off) full sized guns so that they are pocket-sized but still have the same accuracy and power as a full sized gun. But alas, breakthroughs like this are usually left to the small start-ups.......

 

[Halo is for Kids]

The P-3AT has an aluminum alloy frame.

Forgive me my momentary lapse, let me fix my quote:

I'd like to see a "plastic free" P3AT made entirely out of high quality materials: Steel, Aluminum alloy, scandium, etc.

 

[slzy]

the soviets built a PSM as they called it in 5.45x19, or thereabouts,of which i would have liked to have one.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Glock makes the Models 26 (9mm) and 28 (.380), both easily concealed in a pocket.

25 is also .380, and also not importable

curious why a company like S&W doesn't buy Kel-Tec

K-T is not publicly traded yet. If ever. And they're hardly in financial trouble. One of the most successful "young" gun companies in over a century. Only recently did P3 production finally meet demands to where stores can keep one on the shelf for a few days, perhaps a week. K-T is a really neat company. 100% American, all employees are NRA (mandatory), incredibly innovative products, good price, lifetime warranty, and good CS. I own 4 KT's, only my gen 1 P3 had to go back for the mag catch issue. The PLR is one of my favorite firearms. I will be getting an RFB ASAP.

<---------lifetime KT customer (Armalite, too)

As to why comanies like S&W don't do mouse guns? Guess youd have to ask them. I suspect because they do well enough in their niche, and the pocket gun market is pretty well saturated with more affordable units than what they could put out. S&W does have the pocket revolver market.