FirearmsEnthusiast
Member
The dog nearly ate the good guy lol.
Why's the Secret Service using the 5.7X28 P90
- Thread starter Dr_2_B
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Double Naught Spy
Sus Venator
Because it looks good on paper and because they haven't been in any real fights with it.
What armor do you think they are going to pierce with it? It certainly won't be going through hard armor. As for soft armor, 9mm rounds of AP ammo can go through soft armor just fine.
A quandary for those people who have to choose which platform to employ: You don't know how well something will perform until you have a long history to study. But you can't have a history to study until you employ the thing for a period of time.
In reference to using rifles, in that video of the SS apprehending the guy who jumped the white house fence, the P90 seemed very handy to the SS agents. I watched the left handed agent keeping the subject's head at gunpoint and I had no doubt that a one-second squeeze of the trigger woulda turned the guy's head into mush.
In reference to using rifles, in that video of the SS apprehending the guy who jumped the white house fence, the P90 seemed very handy to the SS agents. I watched the left handed agent keeping the subject's head at gunpoint and I had no doubt that a one-second squeeze of the trigger woulda turned the guy's head into mush.
I do not know what the exact rationale was but there must be some reason because the C.A.T. guys I have seen typically have M4 style rifles (I'm not sure if they are actually M4s or what the exact configuration is). The C.A.T. guys have a different role than the guys pictured above.
sonier
Member
Yea it had to be the armor piercing capabilities with that round, and the versatility, theres got to be a lot of tight quarters and limited space at lots of different times.
Zerodefect
member
Alot of people here obviously haven't shot one. With an Aimpoint it's a fine weapon. But why would an open carry officer need one? Here's why.
1. Speed. This thing gets onto a suprise popup target faster than any of my other rifles.
2. Rate of Fire. Even the Semi auto Ps90 is easy to use as a bullet hose, and keep on target. Stiff trigger, sure, but you'll never know it when your heart is beating 185bpm. And I can get this thing to hose down targets easy.
3. Small. Simple to fire from improvised positions.
4. Never ending mag
5. More speed. When you need to get from one side of the Whitehouse in a hurry to the other while possiblt engaging threats, this thing is easy to move with.
6. Say what you want about the 5.7x28mm, but i'm still certain I could use it for defense, knowing full well that it is way borderline powerwise.
7. Reliability. Better than an MP5 IME. Mines 100% and it deos get dirty.
This little rifle really opened my skeptical eyes when I borrowed one for a backup at a rifle class. Since I had all that 5.7 ammo, I decided to use it for a few stages. Way easy to control and move with.
1. Speed. This thing gets onto a suprise popup target faster than any of my other rifles.
2. Rate of Fire. Even the Semi auto Ps90 is easy to use as a bullet hose, and keep on target. Stiff trigger, sure, but you'll never know it when your heart is beating 185bpm. And I can get this thing to hose down targets easy.
3. Small. Simple to fire from improvised positions.
4. Never ending mag
5. More speed. When you need to get from one side of the Whitehouse in a hurry to the other while possiblt engaging threats, this thing is easy to move with.
6. Say what you want about the 5.7x28mm, but i'm still certain I could use it for defense, knowing full well that it is way borderline powerwise.
7. Reliability. Better than an MP5 IME. Mines 100% and it deos get dirty.
This little rifle really opened my skeptical eyes when I borrowed one for a backup at a rifle class. Since I had all that 5.7 ammo, I decided to use it for a few stages. Way easy to control and move with.
nwilliams
Member
In the event that the Goa'uld decide to attack the president!
I have a PS90 and I love it, although I'm a huge Stargate fan so it goes without saying that I have an affection for the PS90
I don't really consider it a PDW but more of a fun gun just for plinking. I don't have a real issue with the caliber but it wouldn't be my first choice as a defensive round.
Ignition Override
Member
The owner of a well-known gun shop in a southern Indiana city showed us his personal handgun in this caliber.
HorseSoldier
Member
That picture is one of those semi-rare Hollywood Double-Finger-On-Trigger safety violations -- nicely done . . .
Double Naught Spy
Sus Venator
People have shown the .22 lr to be very useful for defense, knowing it is below borderline powerwise and there are gunshop owners that carry NAA mini revolvers.
Who can argue with a sample of 1?
Still 2 Many Choices!?
Member
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We can speculate as why the use of the P90, but if ANYBODY this side of spec ops(read as: on US soil) can choose what gun to use, it would be the SS! Penetration, over penetration, concusion/blast, concealabilty, mag capacity, range, and armor penetration are all aspects that the P90 excel in. I honostly can't think of another firearm that surpases the P90 in half those categories.
Anything 5.56, suffers from the blast of the shortened barrels, a weakened effect on targets, capacity, as well as concealabilty issues.
Anything in a pistol caliber doesn't suffer as much of the power loss of the short barrel, but still has concealabilty issues, less capacity, no armor penetration(without special AP ammo), less range, and is more possible to have over penetration issues.
The P90 is the best balance and combination, or hybrid of the Sub-gun, and assault rifle(aka PDW) in production for sub 200m combat(atleast on paper). The P90 has the highest capacity, least muzzle blast, flatest trajectory, retains it's energy for armor penetration, and is probably the easiest to conceal. Seems like common sense. Oh yeah, the 5.7 cartridge was designed and optimized for short barrels, so doesn't suffer the draw backs of hacking up true assault rifles like the M4 commandos and such.
YMMV.
Still 2 Many Choices!?
Anything 5.56, suffers from the blast of the shortened barrels, a weakened effect on targets, capacity, as well as concealabilty issues.
Anything in a pistol caliber doesn't suffer as much of the power loss of the short barrel, but still has concealabilty issues, less capacity, no armor penetration(without special AP ammo), less range, and is more possible to have over penetration issues.
The P90 is the best balance and combination, or hybrid of the Sub-gun, and assault rifle(aka PDW) in production for sub 200m combat(atleast on paper). The P90 has the highest capacity, least muzzle blast, flatest trajectory, retains it's energy for armor penetration, and is probably the easiest to conceal. Seems like common sense. Oh yeah, the 5.7 cartridge was designed and optimized for short barrels, so doesn't suffer the draw backs of hacking up true assault rifles like the M4 commandos and such.
YMMV.
Still 2 Many Choices!?
MTMilitiaman
Member
I'm guessing the Secret Service uses them because they are unreliable and look cool with their sunglasses... [/sarcasm]
nwilliams
Member
Nope, I do remember this scene from the show I just can't remember the episode.
Carter
Member
His fingers are on the trigger because they are about to be attacked.
I'm a huge stargate fan as well....
Carter
Member
He's Teal'c okay. He makes Shaft look like a pansy. But yes, hollywood is a little fast and loose with safety, but hey, its TV. Don't be so serious.
And if my memory serves me correctly...the enemies were moving through the woods hidden and he didn't know where to point yet, and his team mates were around him, so he didn't point them upwards.
And last time I checked...being surrounded by alien forces on an alien planet by people who want to wipe out your race counts as a high stress situation where safety rules may not be followed as strictly as at the range. But I guess we will never know in our life time.
I don't think any war movie nor tv show, no matter how accurate, follows the trigger rule.
And if my memory serves me correctly...the enemies were moving through the woods hidden and he didn't know where to point yet, and his team mates were around him, so he didn't point them upwards.
And last time I checked...being surrounded by alien forces on an alien planet by people who want to wipe out your race counts as a high stress situation where safety rules may not be followed as strictly as at the range. But I guess we will never know in our life time.
I don't think any war movie nor tv show, no matter how accurate, follows the trigger rule.
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Sebastian the Ibis
Member
How do they shoot one handed?
I wonder if they use them because they can be aimed and shot one handed, while the other is calling back up or pushing people out of the way.
I wonder if they use them because they can be aimed and shot one handed, while the other is calling back up or pushing people out of the way.
Shawn Dodson
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Jacksonville Sheriff's Office experience with 5.7x28mm involved the FN P90 PDW. In one incident a deputy crawled on the hood of a car and fired through the windshield at a suspect inside, landing multiple hits. The entire time the suspect was reportedly screaming "Stop shooting me! Stop shooting me!" He wasn't incapacitated by the hits and survived his wounds. After several shootings in which 5.7 failed JSO SWAT dumped it.
LAPD SWAT tried 5.7 and dumped it. Miami PD SWAT tried 5.7 and dumped it.
LAPD SWAT tried 5.7 and dumped it. Miami PD SWAT tried 5.7 and dumped it.
Carter
Member
One of my college profs used to say that all the time..He was about as close to socialist as you could get and not get jumped by "corn fed rednecks" in class.
I think the 5.7 gets a bad wrap cause its not a "one hit stopper", but what round really is in pistol size unless you get lucky (excluding the enormous revolver rounds and .50). Its made for one purpose, replacing the m9 for people behind the front lines. It also delivers a heck of a lot of lead on target really friggin fast. Remember the stories of a tommy gun "cutting people in half"? I think the 5.7 has the potential to come near that result. Also, if it used soft point round and fmj "dutch loaded" (I think thats the right term), it'd probably be good on armored and soft targets. But that might cause a feed issue, unknown to me.
Just remember, lots of ammo, virtually no recoil, fast rate of fire means a lot of bullets in one target. No matter what the size of the round is, the sheer mass of that much lead would do a lot of damage.
And from the looks of it, reliability of the original models has been resolved.
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