Would like to hear from LEOs - pistol & load is issued by your department

[whatnickname]

Quite a bit is written and said about the selection of handguns and ammunition by law enforcement agencies. I would like to conduct an impromptu survey with the LEOs out there. There is no need to identify your department or agency. However I would like to know if you work for a local, state or federal agency. With this in mind, I would like responses to the following questions:

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19)

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point)

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition?

4) Do you feel your deaparment's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why?

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?

6) Your gender?

 

[Warp]

A message forum, or at least sub section of a forum, aimed at LEO's would be the place to try this survey, IMO.

Also, very few LEO's know the selection criteria their department uses for duty ammunition.

My local LEA issues Glock 17's and, last I knew, Winchester Ranger Talon 147gr (RA9T), and they have found it effective. A nearby agency is well known for having a great track record with Federal 9BPLE (115gr +P+) in the past as well. Some good choices out there.

 

[Winkman822]

A message forum, or at least sub section of a forum, aimed at LEO's would be the place to try this survey, IMO.

Also, very few LEO's know the selection criteria their department uses for duty ammunition.

My local LEA issues Glock 17's and, last I knew, Winchester Ranger Talon 147gr (RA9T), and they have found it effective. A nearby agency is well known for having a great track record with Federal 9BPLE (115gr +P+) in the past as well. Some good choices out there.

I'm not an LEO, but I agree that there are probably few officers at the street level (i.e. not admin bean counter types) that would know the selection criteria for the weapon and ammunition type. That said, I know the following of my local agencies:

State Department of Corrections - Sig Sauer P229 DAK .357 SIG
State Police - Sig Sauer P229 DAK .357 SIG
State Probation and Parole - Smith & Wesson M&P .40
City Police (city I work in) - Smith & Wesson M&P .40
City Police (city I live in) - Sig Sauer P229 DAK .357 SIG
University Police (I live in a college town) - Sig Sauer P229 DAK .357 SIG
Capitol Police (in charge of State Buildings and the Courthouses) - Glock 22
County Police (my county) - Smith & Wesson M&P .40
Attorney General's Office Special Investigators - Glock 27

I have no idea what ammunition they carry.

For what it's worth, I live in Delaware. Work in Wilmington and live in Newark.

 

[herrwalther]

Not a LEO but I know plenty. Well over 75% of my friends are either military or law enforcement in some capacity. A buddy of mine is a patrol officer in a major metro area. His department allows a list of carry firearms that you can choose from if the department has it or you can buy it yourself to carry. Standard issue in the department is M&P 9mm full size. He personally opted for a Glock 21 which is on the approved handgun list. This department issues Federal HST for duty ammunition.

For what it is worth, I like departments that allow some officer input and personal preference. Not everyone is going to like the standard issue firearm. And those with previous weapon experience will know what they like and don't.

 

[DLam]

I work for a small town in SC. PD is 7 officers all male. They run glocks in 45acp. (I am not in the PD)

 

[c1ogden]

1. Sig P226 .40 cal

2. I retired a few years ago but at the time it was 165 gr Gold Dot

3. Unfortunately the choice was made by the bosses, not the firearms experts.

4. Effective yes, but not the best choice for all involved. We switched from revolvers to 9mm Sig P226 pistols in 1988 and to .40cal Sig P226 pistols about 2001. The Sig DA/SA action was a problem for many officers with the DA first shot and it took several years for some officers to learn to launch the 12 pound first round without also touching off an inadvertent 4 pound second round. The size of the grip and long reach to the trigger were also a problem for many officers. Out of 18 officers we had 3 "problem shooters", officers who would fail qualification about 50% of the time, requiring frequent retraining. We switched to .40 cal because, at the time, that was the "in" thing to do. I advised against it, warning that it would exacerbate the "problem shooter" situation. I was ignored and we suddenly had 5 problem shooters and the most common complaint I heard during qualifications was "I wish I had my 9 back".

5. The Glock I was pushing for in 1988 with Gold Dot or Federal Hydra-Shok or HST ammo.

6. Local

7. Male

 

[BSA1]

) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19)

Glock 22

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point)

165 gr. JHP 40 S&W

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition?

Beats me. I wasn't here when it was selected. A large nearby metro department with 400+ officers issues it to there officers. I think it is a case of monkey see, monkey do.

4) Do you feel your deaparment's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why?

Yes

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?

We don't have "a free choice" so question is pointless.

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?

Local.

6) Your gender?

You're getting a little personal aren't you?

Answered.

 

[WestKentucky]

I am not LEO, but I have good friends who are.

City PD
Glock 19 for patrol, 26 for detectives. There are others approved for use if the officer wants to purchase their own. All ammo used is winchester ranger.
Moving away from sidearms, each patrol car has an 870 with an 18.5" barrel and the shurshot stocks.

County SO
Glock 17 for patrol, 26 or 27 for everybody else (including the gal answering the phone) no other approved duty sidearms for patrol, but if you fall into the everybody else category you are not restricted.
Moving to long guns here, 80% of the SO cars have either an mp5 or an actual m4 in the trunk. The other 20% carry entry tools like doorbusters. One car on duty has a robot with camera, it's fun to play with too. ALL of the SO cars are 2013 or newer chargers or tahoes, and ALL of them are 450 hp or better. They all have nitrous bottles in the trunk, and they do go to driving school to learn to handle the vehicles appropriately. Our SO has a great Sheriff as a leader.

 

[MedWheeler]

I'll follow the trend of non-LEOs answering, and take us back 25 years. Back then, I was a LEO.

The first agency for which I worked issued the .38 caliber S&W M67 revolver. The stainless steel construction was desired to be more resistant to the salty air in the coastal community. The load was the Winchester 95-grain Silvertip HP in a +P charge. I always thought that bullet was too light for LE work, but I don't know when, how, or why it was adopted. I had one instance to use it, to kill a wild hog that was running loose in town. It took three shots at less than eight feet to bring it down but, admittedly, only one shot hit the base of the skull. The others hit the nape of the neck, and the shoulder (I was above the animal, shooting straight down.) Penetration of those two was around eight inches, if I recall correctly.

Backup guns were permitted only by a lack of any policy prohibiting them. There were no written guidelines. Mine was a Charter Arms Undercover 38 loaded with Winchester 110-grain Silvertips, all I could find that was, for liability concerns, close to what the department issued.

I left that agency in 1990, just as it was adopting a rule that individual officers could switch, at their own expense, to 9mm autoloaders that they would themselves provide (I had purchased a S&W M659 for this, but left before following through the process.)

I went to another, larger city PD that issued the Ruger P85 9mm pistol. The load was the Federal Lawman 115-grain JHP. I know nothing about the selection process for either. The Ruger was a fairly new model only a few years earlier, so it was probably about marketing and cost. I didn't train with it, only being required to shoot it for qualification. I did so fine, but never shot it was well as I did revolvers. Officers could choose instead to carry other, self-provided, DA/SA autos in 9mm; the list included S&W, Beretta, and SiG-Sauer models.

Backup guns were authorized, and regulated. Off-duty carry was required while within the city limits. Any gun carried in either capacity had to be either the issued sidearm, any of the other potential duty sidearms, or any of the guns on a short list of approved models in .38 or .380. My Undercover 38 didn't me the cut (only Colt and S&W revolvers did), so I bought the one autoloader that was on the list, a Walther PPK/S. I don't recall if there were any rules on ammo for the .38 and .380 backups. Mine had whatever Silvertips were in .380 back then. Qualification with any firearm was required before it could be carried, whether it be for duty, off-duty, or backup.

I'm a male. We had no female officers in the first, 40-ish-sworn-personnel agency (one had gone out on LD just as I was coming aboard, and never returned.) The second agency had one, and she was not in my platoon, so I didn't know her well at all. That agency had about 100 worn personnel.

 

[Peakbagger46]

I'll play:

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19) Glock 22. Currently moving to all gen 4 guns.

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point) Winchester 180g PDX (bonded I believe)

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition? No idea.

4) Do you feel your deaparment's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why? Absolutely.

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?
I'm happy with what is issued.
6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?
Local.
6) Your gender? Male. Female deputies are issued the glock 23.

 

[jamal28]

Im a civilian but my city pd charlotte mecklenburg pd carries the m&p 40 and our sheriffs dept carries the glock 22 gen 4 both carry the federal hst .40 180gr. Cmpd also issues the remington 870 and only sergeants, swat, and vice can carry the ar15 on duty. NC highway patrol carries the sig 226 in 357 sig with the s&w ar15 as there patrol rifle. SC highway patrol still carries the glock 37 in 45 gap. My former agency gastonia pd also issues the m&p40 with the gold dot 165gr last time i checked.

 

[Jesse H]

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19)

G22. Was issued a Gen 3, but new guys are getting Gen 4's. Have the option of G23 as well. We are talking about moving to G19 and 17's.

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point)

Remington Golden Sabre, bonded

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition?

Unknown

4) Do you feel your deaparment's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why?

Several officer involved shootings say yup. Several deer and hogs I've had to put down also support it.

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?

G17. Same manual of operation, slightly more capacity, but better recoil management and faster follow-up shots. Cheaper ammo could mean more training. May be easier for females and other officers who aren't as skilled to operate.

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?

City PD

6) Your gender?

male

 

[ColtPythonElite]

1.) Glock 22

2.) Hornady Critical Duty 175 gr.

3.) I am sure price was criteria for choosing Glock. I know the great deal on police trade-ins was a reason for going from Gen 3 to Gen 4. Availability lead to us using Hornady. We used Speer for 15 years, but toward the end had difficulty getting it.

4.) The gun and ammo work fine for me. I have carried a Glock 22 for 17 years. No need to switch now.

5.) I wouldn't change guns or ammo. They simply work.

6.) Male

 

[RLHIII]

In a county where I used to live. By law they had to employ a certain percentage of women and minorities. Many were unable to qualify with the standard .45's, Because of this they switched to 9mm. Sad!!

 

[alleycat7002]

Years ago 125 grain SJHP 357 mag what I carried

 

[Ranger Roberts]

I recently left the PD in November to concentrate on my family business. I am still a "reserve" officer of sorts. I am also still in charge of qualifying our officers yearly.

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19)

Glock 22. We switched from the Glock 17 about 2 years ago.

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point)

Federal Premium Hydra Shok JHP 180 gr

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition?

Cost

4) Do you feel your deaparment's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why?

Sure

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?

I'm happy with the selection. I know some of the guys would rather be shooting the Glock 17 because the 40 cal is a little snappy for them.

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?

Local

6) Your gender?

Male. We do have one part time female on the force and I know she would prefer the 9 mm

edit: That last answer was worded wrong. She is a full time female but a part time cop!

 

[IL Guns]

I am sure price was criteria for choosing Glock

That's going to be pretty true in most cases. A very pro LEO and military LGS sells the Gen 4 17,19,26,22,23,27,31,32 and 33FS for $425 OTD to LEOs (active or retired), military (active or retired), firefighters (active) and pretty much any other Glock for $500 or less. ARs (not sure by whom) for $800 BUT dept. pricing is $695. I'm sure the dept. pricing on the Glocks is MUCH cheaper. I am semi tempted to bring in my DD214 but have no use for any of the guns listed. I have M&Ps. I do know that my Counties Sheriffs office gives a stipend for equipment and there is an approved list of sidearms. You will see different deputies with different pistols. A Glock is standard issue though.

 

[waterhouse]

We (city PD) are moving from the M&P .40 to the M&P 9mm. We are currently using Speer Gold Dot but they are in the process of testing 9mm ammo for the new guns. I'm comfortable with whatever they choose.

 

[Spats McGee]

I'm not a LEO, but I work with them a-plenty. I don't know what specific loads they carry, but here's what I do know:

1. State troopers: Glock 21 and (I think) Remington Golden Sabers.
2. County deputies: I have no clue.
3. City (patrol) officers: Glock 22 & Remington Golden Sabers. Other pistols might be approved for detectives and the like, and I'll bet they're all Glocks in .40.

 

[JohnnyBravo]

USAF back in the Middle Ages.

S&W M15 with .38 Special FMJ, then we transitioned to...wait for it...

Beretta M9 loaded with FMJ.

At least we had that penetration thing going for us.

 

[JDR]

USAF back in the Middle Ages.

S&W M15 with .38 Special FMJ, then we transitioned to...wait for it...

Beretta M9 loaded with FMJ.

I was a USAF SP and I carried the S&W M15 with .38 Special FMJ. I got out before the M9. I have my own Model 15 today and I still think it's just about a perfect handgun!

 

[Devonai]

I'm not a [strike]doctor[/strike] LEO but I play one occasionally.

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model?

Beretta M9

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet?

147 gr JHP, various manufacturers (stateside)

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition?

Joint Service Small Arms Program

4) Do you feel your department's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work?

Ayuh

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?

Beretta M9, I've never seen anyone fail to qualify with it and it works fine for the majority of users

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?

USAF

6) Your gender?

Today? (checks drawers) Male
__________________

 

[armoredman]

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19)

Glock 17 and Glock 19, depending on posting.

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point)

124gr Speer Gold Dot.

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition?

Bidding, so price would be a large portion of that criteria. I actually DO happen to know what we paid for them, but I am not allowed to say the price tag. You would weep tears of frustration, is all I will say.

4) Do you feel your department's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why?

There is nothing wrong with the Glock as a duty sidearm, as much as I, personally, dislike them - only for fit/feel/grip angle, still reliable, durable, firearms. One point is that the non safety "safe action" trigger requires a higher degree of training, IMHO, and our training does not quite measure up to the standard I would like to see. I have made my suggestions verbally and in writing to the higher ups.

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why?

CZ P-09/P-07 and Hornaday 135gr +P Critical Duty. Works great for me. Authorized off duty sidearm.

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal?

State.

6) Your gender?

Gender refers to language. My sex, last time I checked, was still male. Gotta double check once in a while - the wife owns multiple sharp instruments.

 

[sgt127]

Texas. Mid sized metro city PD. about 250 Officers. Glock 22. Gold Dot 180 grain.
Perfectly decent issue gun. No personal duty guns. Everybody carries the 22.

 

[Neo-Luddite]

1) Make or brand of handgun issued by your department or agency as well as model? (eg. Glock G19) S&W 64 .38 spl (for 'rank and file') Glock 22 .40 (for parole and tactical units)

2) Brand of ammunition issued as well as weight and configuration of bullet? (eg. 124 grain Speer Gold Dot Hollow Point) Winchester Ranger JHP for both the .38 spl and .40
+ P is specified for the .38 revolver. Weight is (iirc) 110 gr for .38 and 155 for .40 Brand varies from year-to-year and isn't a set requirement (afaik)

3) Criteria used for selection of handgun and ammunition? I know cost is a big factor for both choices.

4) Do you feel your deparment's selection of handgun and ammunition is effective for your work? If not, why? Some officers gripe about the old fashioned wheel gun, but for our purposes it is still well suited for most routine escort duty. Folks needing more firepower are issued the Glock.

5) Given a free choice, what brand of handgun and ammunition would you select and why? Same choice is OK---I carry a S&W 64 as my daily 'commuter' gun.

6) Your agency...Local, State or Federal? state-level corrections

7) Your gender? male