WTH: We are our own worst enemy.

[TanklessPro]

This post maybe get locked or deleted, but I have to say this.

I have been reading another post about needing Glenn Beck or not. Some of the comments are unbelievable. WHAT ARE WE THINKING?
I'm sick and tired of people claiming to support RKBA in one breath and then complaining about people that support RKBA. We talk about crazy Uncle Ted, Rush is in it for the money, the NRA and GOA make fools of them selves, Beck is a right wing nut, Alex Jones is insane, and on and on and on.
What are you nuts thinking??????:banghead:
How can you continue to vote in Democrats( and yes I said Democrats because your guy says he supports RKBA but supports nominees for SCOTUS that are clearly antis) and bash the people standing up for RKBA in the public forum.
Again, what are you nuts thinking???? :banghead::banghead:
What do you want in someone that stand for RKBA????
When will you learn that what you are doing is hurting the thing that you claim to be so passionate about????

Sorry for the rant, I think it need to be said.

 

[TCB in TN]

I agree with your frustration. The ideals our nation was founded on are libertarian. I see many people in our nation (on both the left and right, but more voting left) who are intent on forcing everyone else to think and do as they think and do.

Don't get me wrong I think my way, and my ideas are right, and best, but if you want to be wrong then you should be allowed to be, up until you infringe upon the actual rights ( not feelings, emotions, etc) of others.

That said when I hear a pro gun person who votes for an anti gun candidate then it does get frustrating. We should at least try to live our ideals, and voting for pro-freedom candidates will in the long run benefit all. Those who sacrifice freedom for security deserve (and will soon) have neither. (Wish I had been the one to say that )

 

[rugerdude]

......What if I told you that there are other issues besides the RKBA, and that some people who are firearms enthusiasts believe that other issues are just as important, perhaps even more?

Also, I would recommend a quick edit of the original post. There is an issue here with some merit that could be discussed reasonably, however beginning it with a post like that does nothing but contribute emotion to a group that prides itself on logical reasoning.

 

[doc2rn]

+1 to rugerdude

What do you want in someone that stand for RKBA

what you are doing is hurting the thing that you claim to be so passionate about

Both are great topics of conversation, minus the emotion.

 

[josiewales]

.What if I told you that there are other issues besides the RKBA, and that some people who are firearms enthusiasts believe that other issues are just as important, perhaps even more?

My thoughts exactly, but I do understand the OP's frustration to a certain extent. I quit supporting the NAGR because in every email, newsletter, or letter they had something VERY negative to say about the NRA and GOA.

 

[oldbear]

WTH: We are our own worst enemy.

Sadly all to often we are. To many folks go out of their way to argue and insult anti-gun folks, when there is no need to do so. Why bother to try and change the mind of someone who will not listen to reason?

The folks we need to make every effort to impress is the great mid ground, the people who don't have strong feelings about firearms one way or another. We need to get these folks to understand that those of us who enjoy the shooting sports are sane and normal folks. Not mouth breathing fools as we are so often made out to be.

 

[Solo]

I would like to see more people who are capable of offering scholarly and intellectual discourse on the precedent for the 2nd amendment, historical context of its adoption, Constitutionality of different gun laws, and ideological justification for its current existence, along with evidence for claims such as "more guns, less crime".

 

[wgaynor]

I agree with the OP. Sadly though, when we become so passionate about what we believe in, others tune us out as radicals. But hey, that's ok. This Country was founded by such crazy radicals as you, I , Rush, Crazy Uncle Ted, and Glenn Beck. Stay strong, keep your eye on the goal, and keep your powder dry.

 

[Potatohead]

Guys,
all i was wondering was does Glen Beck rally more of our folks to the cause, or more of the other sides folks to the cause? Asking that doesnt make me any less a proponent of the second amendment than you does it?

 

[Potatohead]

I would like to see more people who are capable of offering scholarly and intellectual discourse on the precedent for the 2nd amendment, historical context of its adoption, Constitutionality of different gun laws, and ideological justification for its current existence, along with evidence for claims such as "more guns, less crime

Amen Solo....thanks for translating that to some of these folks...GEEZ

 

[SuperNaut]

How can you continue to vote in Democrats( and yes I said Democrats because your guy says he supports RKBA but supports nominees for SCOTUS that are clearly antis) and bash the people standing up for RKBA in the public forum.

Stuff like this is more divisive than anything. So many assumptions, so much binary thinking, too little time or patience to address.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Stuff like this is more divisive than anything.

You tell him.

 

[76shuvlinoff]

I do not wish to be a single issue voter but in times like these that is a path I am considering.

How much does being able to bear arms mean to you?


.

 

[kwguy]

OP, I understand your frustration, and agree with you.

 

[TanklessPro]

I stand by what I said and always will.

Unfortunately to many of us will continue with our same habits and wonder why we are having to keep fighting for 2A. Eventually, God fearing, when we lose our rights, then what will you do?

Too many of us complain about others, yet really do nothing ourselves but complain on forum.

Sorry for being" divisive" but this need to be said. How do you support people that don't support you??? With all the media out there you can't find someone to agree with????

 

[TCB in TN]

I would like to see more people who are capable of offering scholarly and intellectual discourse on the precedent for the 2nd amendment
historical context of its adoption,

There is plenty of that about, but honestly what precedent was needed for the 2nd amendment? Acknowledging the right of a human to protect him/herself from all attacks (whether you believe it God given or just a basic human right), just makes sense. To what end do you want to see the precedent?

 

[Potatohead]

Being able to bear arms means a whole lot to me..but what im worried about is fence sitters...and i can tell you that i 100% believe that most fence sitters probably think that Glenn Beck is a TOTAL nutbag...thats what im sayin...do we need to jump up and down for everyone public person that supports the 2A? Charles Manson? he probably supports it..these folks represent us and our views, how does that look (to the fence sitters mainly-forget about the other side for a minute) is all im asking????

 

[Fremmer]

Yeah it does seem that some are almost...disappointed that Obama gun control failed. And we don't want people to speak out because it was defeated, so we can be more "moderate" and "nice" and if we would just be "sensible" and compromise.....

???

 

[Ryanxia]

I say even if they're crazy and on our side, bring em on, rather have the Nuge on our side than on the other. And like it's been stated, not every pro 2A can be perfect but at least organizations like the NRA are trying. When I refer to the NRA I don't refer to it as 'them' but rather WE. Because the NRA is made up of US, 4 million plus Americans. WE give the NRA life, WE make it possible for a voice to speak out against tyranny.

We all came together after Sandy Hook to defeat the opportunists that came crawling out of the woodwork to claim our Rights, hopefully we can all remember that and put our petty differences aside in pursuit of this just cause.

 

[wgaynor]

Seems like many people on here want us to remain silent like good little peasants.

 

[Frank Ettin]

...What do you want in someone that stand for RKBA????...

People who are intelligent, well spoken, who communicate in an even and measured manner, who have a solid understanding of the facts and of history, for example: Barry Snell; Dr. Benjamin Carson; Thomas Sowell, Gary Kleck; David Kople; Don Kates; Stephen Halbrook; Joyce Lee Malcolm; and their ilk.

Too many in the RKBA community seem to miss the reality that many people who don't own guns don't understand us, are afraid of us and will look to the government to allay their fears. That is where gun control laws come from. And the more they fear us the more readily they will vote for politicians who promise to enact gun control laws.

Make no mistake that the politicians who are proposing and voting for gun control legislation are doing what the people who put them in office want them to do. And unless we can make some headway with public perception, we will continue to see increasing support for more draconian gun control legislation.

So we want people to speak for us, and we will want to be ourselves the sort of people, who, through manners, tone and demeanor belie the common public stereotypes of gun owners and supporters of the RKBA.

 

[SabbathWolf]

I dunno? I kinda see both sides of this.
I mean how many "fence sitters" followed what crazy people like Dianne Frankenstein said?
Quite a few.

You may not always like every single person on your team. But we are still a team.
And that's still better than having these guys be "against" us.

 

[Cosmoline]

Just because I agree with a public figure about the RKBA doesn't mean I won't criticize them for other things. And just because a public figure supports the RKBA, that does not qualify him to be the spokesman for everyone with a firearm.

Plus you need to be aware that the whole of the media--whether considered "mainstream" or not--is based around a small group of monied interests. They are looking to keep ad revenue flowing and sell books. The political issues are purely secondary. So it's always a good idea to remain skeptical and avoid the perils of being a dittohead. You have to take a step back and realize that a particular person may be getting air time BECAUSE they look like a nutcase to most of the country. And that sells tickets to the show.

I am not at all happy with the idea of gun rights being grafted to the far right side of the culture war. Particularly since that's liable to be the losing side. I also don't want the RKBA to be a mere appendix of a corrupt political party. We have to keep playing both sides, and keep both sides on their toes. Nobody should get a pass on this issue because of GOP affiliation or their status as "friend." We recently got to see the dangers of putting too much faith in a few of those "friends" in the Senate.

 

[TanklessPro]

People who are intelligent, well spoken, who communicate in an even and measured manner, who have a solid understanding of the facts and of history, for example: Barry Snell; Dr. Benjamin Carson; Thomas Sowell, Gary Kleck; David Kople; Don Kates; Stephen Halbrook; Joyce Lee Malcolm; and their ilk.

Thanks for the link because without it I have never heard of any of these people before. Maybe my ignorance, but these people do not get airtime in any media that I have seen. So the" fence sitters" will never see them either.

 

[PabloJ]

This post maybe get locked or deleted, but I have to say this.

I have been reading another post about needing Glenn Beck or not. Some of the comments are unbelievable. WHAT ARE WE THINKING?
I'm sick and tired of people claiming to support RKBA in one breath and then complaining about people that support RKBA. We talk about crazy Uncle Ted, Rush is in it for the money, the NRA and GOA make fools of them selves, Beck is a right wing nut, Alex Jones is insane, and on and on and on.
What are you nuts thinking??????:banghead:
How can you continue to vote in Democrats( and yes I said Democrats because your guy says he supports RKBA but supports nominees for SCOTUS that are clearly antis) and bash the people standing up for RKBA in the public forum.
Again, what are you nuts thinking???? :banghead::banghead:
What do you want in someone that stand for RKBA????
When will you learn that what you are doing is hurting the thing that you claim to be so passionate about????

Sorry for the rant, I think it need to be said.

We need to keep recruiting new people into the sports of shooting and hunting and stop relying on bunch of radio "wind bags".