S&W Governor? Gimmick or Good Idea?

Cornhusker77 said:

I kinda like the looks of it, but then I like oddball stuff.

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Well then, if you like oddball stuff this might be the 410 you can also like...

I reload .410, .45colt, and .45acp,........never say never.

MartinS said:

Governor/Judge threads are some of the most irresistible tests for tolerance yet devised by man.

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That and Scout rifle threads.

ArchAngelCD said:

Well then, if you like oddball stuff this might be the 410 you can also like...

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I actually have one of those but with an 11 inch barrel.
It's a hand killer for sure

It sure is a hand killer. The shot bounces off the backer board and hits me too lol...

Well when you need more penetration from a shot shell? You could just make some "Cut Shells". That has worked for over 100 years.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...8D0F09DAE8D6205F2DA18D0F09DAE8D6205&FORM=VIRE

joneb said:

If I had worry about snakes and Australian funnel web spiders, I would want one even more if it were a smooth bore.
Does anyone know the velocity of 000 buck from a short barrel?

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Supposedly, the federal 000 loads (the ones intended for the Judge) do about 800 to 850 fps from a 3" Judge. This load has the tightest pattern of just about all the choices which make sense because all the pellets are in a straight line and rifling may actually help them. But the federal load patterns better than all the other 000 choices.

I think the revolving .410s are sort of living on the whole "more is better" thing. I mean .45ACP shot has been around a LONG time. Before WWII Thompson advertised such for riot control from special magazines in their SMGs and During WWII there were issued "survival" rounds for the .45ACP pistols. Some where in my junk I have both a paper capsule cartridge or two where there is a paper mache capsule that makes the .45 shot cartridge about the size of a normal FMJ cartridge and I have a round or two of the WWII type where the brass is longer though stepped down to headspace sort of like on a bottle neck cartridge though not so pronounced. This last type Nonte gave instructions on making in one of his books from .308 or .30-06 and such. For a bit in the late '80s and early 90's there were a couple of brands of shot cartridges available commercially for the .45ACP. At one point Lyman offered a die for making cut down .30-06 base cartridges into crimped bulleted shaped shot shells for the .45 ACP.

In the 1980's a friend that also liked .45 Colt and I made up some Nonte suggested loads for that with a gas check, a load of shot and an inverted gas check with a little crimp. We played with shot size a bit all the way up to #6. Regretably we did not take notes.....though I may have some #8 or #9 loaded shells stashed some where.

Speer made their commercial shot loads a while ago and about the time the loaded rounds came out Speer offered the capsules empty for your own ideas. We played with the .38/.357 capsules a bit again getting up to #6 shot. Same friend also made some loads with a single #4 Buck and as many #8 or 9 shot as he could get in to take up the space. Fun but ...really... a waste of shot and powder.

When I was a kid I meet a man that had a .410 made back before NFA '34. About the size of a TC contender but honestly more stream lined and not so cluttered. This was in the 1960's and I have no idea if he had a tax stamp or not and did not know to ask at the time. I just thought it was neat he had a pistol that fired the same ammo as the shot gun I was carrying at the time. Imagine my upset when I learned I could not have one until I was at least another 11 years older (longer than I had been alive yet, then) and fingerprinted and taxed!

Nonte also printed plans for a modification of the 1917 S&W revolver to add a decive to the barrel to negate the effect of rifling on the shot. It was supposedly alright with BATF at the time though it did negate the ability to fire solid bullets while the thing was attached. I believe it was much like the TC tube that did the same thing for them with their .410 and .44 Magnum Hot Shot barrels.

I have oft thought well thought out shotloads in a Muzzle loading single shot pistol might be fun to play with. also, given the "non firearm" status in much of the US of BP C&B revolvers, wondered about the legality of a smooth bore 1860 Colt or Remington NMA.

Shot, over,

-kBob

Taurus has copied S&W revolvers for years, nice to finally see them steal an idea.

I have shot a couple but they are just not for me.

I have dabbled with shot loads for "normal" length cylinders. These hold over 1/2oz of shot and use .410 wads.

jmorris,

You have special dies or are you doing the carefully set .44 mag die trick?

Those look VERY nice. I'll bet using the .410 plastic wad columns really reduces the amount of hooks and slices going WAY out into the rough.

What are you using for an over shot wad and how do you get that heavy crimp?

Thanks for sharing this.

-kBob

Thank you, I modified an extra die I had to form them and machined an arbor that pushes down on the over shot card (plastic) while it rolls the crimp over it.

With the wads, they pattern much better than without or even the Speer capsules.

This is a step by step of the process.
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/homemade-45-acp-shotshell-die.747785/

I vote gimmick.
The 'Thunder Five' faded into obscurity.

Here's an interesting video test that someone conducted using Federal Premium Home Defense 000 buck at various distances using the Governor...



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JF very interesting demonstration. Very informative. I have been curious about these pistols. There were many .410 pistols produced before the NFA 1934 regulated short barreled shotguns.

http://www.gunsinternational.com/gu...21-with-original-holster.cfm?gun_id=100773455

JFrame said:

Here's an interesting video test that someone conducted using Federal Premium Home Defense 000 buck at various distances using the Governor...



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The fallacy is using 000 to try to make one big hole. The 45 Colt would be better at that.

Dog Soldier,

Yeeeeezzzzz. Marble Game Getter I first ran across about four years after the .410 singles shot. The model I saw had a different stock, the butt plate portion did not fold. The .44 Game Getter was a .44-40 cartridge loaded with either shot or a round ball. The gun and its holster really appealed to me but again, 14 inch barreled smooth bores were a no-no for 14 year olds. I guess for that matter a 14 inch .22LR was a No-no as well. My only two shots were minute of soup can at 20 feet or so with the upper .22 barrel. Guy claimed it was all papered as I had learned from the earlier experience to ask. He claimed a former owner had taken deer with the RB .44, but I would bet that deer were taken with the .22 as well. A long dead Great Uncle took deer on his property (antlered or not) with .22LR, his son later became a Wildlife Officer, funny I thought. Many moons later saw a Marbles GG just like the one seen at 14 (given locale it may have been that one) and was told it was then considered C&R but I had no C&R license and little spare cash if I had.

I always thought the Marble's GG would have made the perfect biplane flying in 1930's South America adventure survival gun. Sort of Sam Brownish look with the holster strap and Jodpers for trousers of course with small pith helmet for when on the ground.

-kBob

The above video is mine and as you can see the Federal 410 Handgun Load shot nice tight patterns. I shoot mine quite often and like the Governor a lot and think it has multiple uses like home defense or a car gun. Every person I have let shoot mine has gone out and bought one. This is not only a fun revolver to shoot, it's multi caliber capability has made it a big seller for Smith & Wesson.

mag318 said:

The above video is mine and as you can see the Federal 410 Handgun Load shot nice tight patterns. I shoot mine quite often and like the Governor a lot and think it has multiple uses like home defense or a car gun. Every person I have let shoot mine has gone out and bought one. This is not only a fun revolver to shoot, it's multi caliber capability has made it a big seller for Smith & Wesson.

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Glad to see you're on this forum, Sir.

Thank you very much for taking the time and effort to produce that video -- it was quite informative!

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jski said:

I don't believe the Governor accepts 3" shells.

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Sorry, I meant 3" barrel. That was a 2.5" shell velocity. I think the velocity is about the same for the 2.5" and 3" shells.

jmorris,

Thanks for the response and link. Must have been on spring break with the kids when you started that thread in 2014.

Very nice work.

-kBob

Dog Soldier said:

Well when you need more penetration from a shot shell? You could just make some "Cut Shells". That has worked for over 100 years.

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Only if you play real loose and fast with the term "worked" they are horribly inconsistent with regard to accuracy and don't penetrate deep enough for consistent clean kills on medium to large game. I really suspect with the longish shot column of a 410 that they'd be even more inconsistent than a 12g.

jski said:

mag31. what kind of penetration power does this Fed round pack? So far you're just punching holes in paper.

Have you tried: Hornady 410 Critical Defense?

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If you want to do more than wound and discourage a larger target, there should be a few chambers reserved for 45 Colt. Reducing the number of projectiles in the shot load is just trying to make a 45 Colt out of it.