Grumpy old man...

Texas10mm said:

Maybe I am one, but the constant "what's a good powder", what's the "best powder" threads really rub me the wrong way.

I'm guessing that almost all of these threads are started by new reloaders. People who haven't actually read a reloading manual. They might have one manual...maybe. Most of them are younger people who feel the need for social approval.

1. There are many "good powders" for every application. I've loaded 45 ACP with over 30 different powders. Of that number at least two dozen of them were "good".
2. What is the "best" powder for one person could well be the "worst" powder for another.
3. Buy some manuals. Read them.
4. Compile a list of powders that have data for the bullet you're going to load.
5. Now go and see which of those powders are available. Buy at least three of them.
6. Load up some test loads and see which powders work best for you.

Congratulations, you've answered your question.

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Yup, you are a grumpy old man. We were all new at reloading at one time. Probably before this interwebs thing existed. Imagine never "not" having the internet. . Just be glad there are new people wanting to learn, and help them learn to learn.
I think being shut-ins is making people grumpier. Good answer by the way, minus the grumpy part.

Edit to add: Semper Fi brother

I didn't realize it was mandatory to read all the threads ! I better get started

@Texas10mm

Happy Easter!

yes I tend to agree with you somewhat but for some people they treat this like a search feature and don’t have the time or resources to try 2 dozen powders

I know I have gotten some good info this way and helped me narrow down my search

good day to you sir

I'm reminded of my Dad teaching me many things.

He would say 'Of course I know the answer, but I'm not going to tell you what it is. I will tell you how to find the answer yourself. Then, you'll know this one, and know how to find the next one.'

Hooda Thunkit said:

I'm reminded of my Dad teaching me many things.

He would say 'Of course I know the answer, but I'm not going to tell you what it is. I will tell you how to find the answer yourself. Then, you'll know this one, and know how to find the next one.'

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They say, give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he sits in a boat all day drinking beer.

Or something like that!

Texas10mm said:

I lived the first part of my life without the Internet. Now we have all the knowledge of the world at our fingertips and people would rather ask random strangers instead of finding the answer for themselves.

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That is why you teach them to learn. Something not taught these days, except in some homes. Whenever we are faced with a problem, we can choose to make it better, or we can add to the problem.

Whenever I start to develop a new load, I use three or more sources of reference. Then I take a consensus of what the manuals tell me are the best powders and go from there. With the availability of online manuals/reloading pages that are generally manufacturer specific, you generally don't see the variety of powders listed like in published manuals, especially bullet manufacturer manuals. While, many(the OP included) see the asking of "what's a good powder" as laziness, and sometimes it may be, I see it many times as just looking for another source of reference. Hodgdon is going to list their powders in their web pages, and Alliant is going to list theirs. Their recipes are no different than published loads, so why the insistence on everyone having a library full of manuals? Maybe not everyone wants to try 30 different powders in their .45ACP. Maybe they would like to buy two or three and be done. Maybe taking suggestions from experienced loaders like us and narrowing down the field first makes life simpler for them. Is that a bad thing or is it just a form of paying it forward?

I think were all newbie to reloading, whether young or old and grumpy, the data changes so much over the years, our books are taking up too much space, it's great that our powder suppliers are putting data online, but if your going to experiment...you need grumbling grumpy old guys and new books to guide "Alice thru this Wonderland of data"

Necessity & struggle are the best teachers. Some never struggle and never learn, they just repeatedly regurgitate others knowledge instead of knowing anything for themselves. I understand needing a starting point or what has worked well for generations of shooters but as the OP pointed out what works best for me may be trash for you.

People with inner strength and determination will dig for answers before asking anyone.
People tend to have less inner strength and determination these days. They would rather plug into the “brain” and get a quick answer. After years of getting easy answers, they get lazy. I also grew up without the internet and I believe it made me mentally stronger than some of the kids that just Google everything.

I agree with the OP (and I’m a bit grumpy too) but the Chinese virus has everybody bored and possibly just posting anything they can think of to interact with others.

I sense a little resentment here from folks that "had to learn it on my own" and giving advice to those that ask.There is a difference between "What's everyone's opinion of the best powder for .45 ACP" and "What's the best load recipe for .45 ACP?" Just like there's a difference between "How do I set up my crimp die?" and "What am I doing wrong with my crimp?". Problem on these types of forums is, after a while, there's is no question that has not already been asked. One thing nice about these forums is, you are not required to push the reply button. You do not have to click on the thread, "what powder for .45ACP?" if you do not want to.

Texas10mm said:

Actually, if you have enough manuals you'll find the data RARELY changes. I can go back almost 50 years and loads haven't changed a bit in many cases.

Now if you're talking about the loads in the Speer "intrepid" manual, yeah they have changed, but they remained pretty constant after that change.

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I have recognized my problem, as I got a new book, I threw the old one away...but...i am a minimalist, and my Bug Out Bag is getting heavy.

When I load a new round or a new bullet in an old round I search my manuals, bullet mfr and powder mfr, I would hope everyone asking for info is doing the same and then using the wisdom of THR members before starting. I like to keep and purchase old manuals to see the loads from 10,20&30yrs back, new reloaders don't always have that capability.

I remember the days when my grandfather and I would go to the local hardware store in the nearest town (20 min drive each way) and get propellant out of two big kegs in the store. One was for handgun/shotgun one was for rifle. Then back on the farm with the paper sack we would work up loads if the keg was different than last time. From this I have a good understanding on working up an unknown propellant. Thank goodness for canister propellants and manuals. It saves resources. Those that ask probably need verification that what they gleaned from all the different resources is somewhat "in the ballpark" and probably lack the experience to make a good call if things are dangerous or not. Those of us with something called experience sometimes look down on them for asking. Not me, I enjoy helping keep other, probably new reloaders safe. Besides what else would we talk about on a reloading forum anyway.

I think that asking questions is the ultimate way to learn. The internet is the king of knowledge - it is all there. I do not think that the OP is crabby, he is just conditioned from a different time. Self approval is infinitely more important than social approval - there is not enough social approval in the universe to fill a self approval shortfall. I use Varget for my .308 loads - it works great - I learned about that powder on this forum.

Yup.....you're Grumpy alright, bet you have gray hair too. (I get grumpy and my hair is gray)

I can see why, with the experience and information available on forums, someone, new to reloading or otherwise might ask advice about preferred powders or bullets. There are plenty of cartridge specific loads available on the net, and cartridge specific books. But it’s a bit much to expect someone to buy $$$$ worth of different manuals and powders to find out for themselves what others already know. This is particularly true if the person is only loading one cartridge. The two I’m loading now have recommended loads in a Lyman manual so old that it lists loads for 45/90. If I start loading .223 again my circa 1980 Hornady manual has it covered. But if I decide to start playing with 6.5 Creedmore I will be in uncharted water. One thing I won’t do is buy several new manuals at an average of over $25 apiece just to get recommended starting loads for one cartridge. I will be on the net.
In my younger days I had Friday nights in the back room of Knight’s Custom Gun Shop. Mention loading for a cartridge and there were always a few that were, or had at one time, loaded the same cartridge. You got unsolicited advice on best bullets, powder, and any other little quirks you might need to know. I can’t see any harm continuing that vein of thought just because the folding chairs in the back room have been replaced by a living room recliner and a smart phone.

I was a grumpy young man, now I'm a grumpy old man, nothing has changed, welcome to the club !

Rembrandt said:

Yup.....you're Grumpy alright, bet you have gray hair too. (I get grumpy and my hair is gray)

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Wish I still had some of my hair. Just a old man.

Flintshooter said:

In my younger days I had Friday nights in the back room of Knight’s Custom Gun Shop. Mention loading for a cartridge and there were always a few that were, or had at one time, loaded the same cartridge. You got unsolicited advice on best bullets, powder, and any other little quirks you might need to know. I can’t see any harm continuing that vein of thought just because the folding chairs in the back room have been replaced by a living room recliner and a smart phone.

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^^^This. I too was fortunate to have "not-so-grumpy" old men at my local Sportsman Club when I first started to reload. They were a very valuable asset to me when I needed mentoring. They never hesitated to give me advice and many times gave me advice I didn't asked for because they could see where I was going with something. Google and the internet is a wealth of information. One reason you don't find encyclopedias and dictionaries in High School Libraries anymore. Don't blame those folks who learned to use the web for referencing, when they use it. Look at companies like Hodgdon, Nosler and others that at one time published load manuals, who now offer the same info on the web.

There are certain powders that have shown to have a trend to be better than others but we all know that any recommendation is just a starting point and really testing is what is going to give you the best answer for your application. I see a lot of people that want to jump to the end of the story with a good result assuming that testing is not going to be required. You cannot jump to the end of the story in this and expect good results.

Reminds me of one of my favorite quotes a mother will give you knowledge a father will make you earn it