.22 pistol in your defensive battery of guns...

Great Scot said:

Candidly, he lives in the suburbs, and if he used his .22 to stop a home burglary, the neighbors would hear the shots, and local police would be there immediately.

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Police departments are being defunded. Police are on notice that everything they do will be held against them. Doing something can get you prosecuted -- but standing by and watching is okay. Police in some cities don't respond to rape anymore.

Yes one may envision the 22RF in defensive applications, but I do not suffer those illusions. My EDC is a 9X19mm and I do not do the weapon rotation concept either. Are there applications for 22RF yes if one employs the WAG principle unless one is involved in military and or paramilitary applications which in my seventh decade is not going to happen. If for some reason the 9X19mm is functionally problematic the backup is a 38Spl snub nose revolver.

My philosophy is: Of the concealable pistols one owns, carry what would be preferred in hand if you had to defend yourself.
Location nor time of day are factors in "preferred in hand" - nowhere would a 380 pocket gun be preferred rather than a Glock 19.
Choosing to carry a 22 - no thanks, nope.


Disclaimers:
Limited by work attire is a factor, pocket 380 may be "best one can do" in work clothes; thank God that doesn't apply to me anymore.
If not limited by work attire, it is not hard to conceal a 9mm. (Can't =/= won't ... unable to conceal and unwilling are not the same)
Given the availability of pocket size 380's (LCP/P3AT) carrying a 22 for SD in work attire would be a giant nope.
If it (a 22) is all you have or all the recoil one can tolerate, my sympathy.

Bought this Woodsman Sport Target going on 55 years ago.

There are several reasons why someone might own "only a .22." It could have been gifted to them, bequeathed to them, or was a first-gun purchase for reasons other than (and, yes, including) defense. It's also possible that they may own something bigger as well, but cannot practically carry it given their personal circumstances.

Then, when the owner starts feeling the desire to arm, they have the rather smart idea to go ahead with what they have rather than waiting until they can find another gun, ammunition for it, the funds for both, and some practice time.

There are people here on the Almighty Board that will tell someone to wait six months or more if that's what it takes to purchase the "right" gun, and go unarmed until they do, but these same people won't walk out the front door tomorrow unarmed.

I find it rather easy to carry a Commander-type 1911, provided I have a long-enough shirt (I do not carry IWB), but I accept that there are those who will not. If someone who does not owns one, and also owns a Beretta Bobcat, I won't disparage her for carrying the .22 on her person instead.

After hip surgery all I could carry was a 22 for 6 weeks. Granted it was a 22 magnum revolver, not 22 LR, but I didn't feel at risk.
As I healed the 1911 came back as a EDC.

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CDW4ME said:

My philosophy is: Of the concealable pistols one owns, carry what would be preferred in hand if you had to defend yourself.
Location nor time of day are factors in "preferred in hand" - nowhere would a 380 pocket gun be preferred rather than a Glock 19.
Choosing to carry a 22 - no thanks, nope.
View attachment 934026

Disclaimers:
Limited by work attire is a factor, pocket 380 may be "best one can do" in work clothes; thank God that doesn't apply to me anymore.
If not limited by work attire, it is not hard to conceal a 9mm. (Can't =/= won't ... unable to conceal and unwilling are not the same)
Given the availability of pocket size 380's (LCP/P3AT) carrying a 22 for SD in work attire would be a giant nope.
If it (a 22) is all you have or all the recoil one can tolerate, my sympathy.

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Been there and wanted an autoloading rifle with a bore of at least .30".

Sure, I've been carrying pocket guns of .32, .380, and .38 Special for many years, and sometimes a .45 ACP in colder weather when I can hide the gun and holster better.

But, my first pocket gun 2.5 decades ago was a Beretta Bobcat. I was making maybe double minimum wage at the time and I came across the Beretta in a pawn shop for half of retail pricing. My other options that day were something like a Jennings or Phoenix or Bryco.

Ammo cost associated with practice and plinking time were considerations as well.

So, the Beretta got the call for many years for carrying away from the house.

HisSoldier said:

[QUOTEYes the rimfire is not as reliable as centerfire but good ammo helps alleviate that. Plus the 22lr has a little more power than most .25 auto ammunition.]

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Not necessarily so, .22 LR for pistol velocity is normally fired from a 6" barrel, shoot the .25 ACP from the same length barrel and there is little difference. You can find .22 LR in many different loadings that out power the .25 ACP BUT if you reload you can easily reach and exceed their power. The .22 LR's case is very thin, while the .25 ACP's case is almost twice as thick.
In shooting factory .25 ACP I have been seeing 750 FPS (2" barrel) more commonly than what JMB expected, which was 850. I've gotten those tiny 35 gr. HP's up well past 1000 FPS without showing any signs of battering , though a long diet of them might shorten the life of my Astra cubs.
Another handgun I'd consider as a backup is the Ranger II in .22 mag, with the little speed loaders. For the record I carry a .380 plastic auto because it hard to even feel it on my person, even though it's also inadequate.[/QUOTE]

.380 inadequate? Why carry it as you have a mentality that is negative to begin with. I am fairly proficient with my M&P .380 EZ PC with quality HP, 8 in the Mag and one in the chamber and one spare Mag. At 80 years young I sometimes carry my M&P Shield 9mm but I have trouble racking the slide at times so the .380 is my usual choice. I lately have carried my new Colt Cobra. I am most accurate with it but round count is low(I do carry 2 speed loaders with me). My point is carry what you are comfortable with, carry extra ammo and BELIEVE in what you carry. If you think it MIGHT not work, do not carry it. Sorry for my rand.
Semper Fi
paul

Vern Humphrey said:

Police departments are being defunded. Police are on notice that everything they do will be held against them. Doing something can get you prosecuted -- but standing by and watching is okay. Police in some cities don't respond to rape anymore.

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Source?

dbluefish said:

Source?

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The nightly news

I have 2 NAA revolvers on my body no matter what else I’m carrying and a Phoenix arms 22 is always in my tackle box.
Remember the point is have a gun. Practice with what you carry.

Yes,I have several 22Lr firearms as a part of my defense equipment.
I live in a small condo. Never have had a problem here while I have lived here. But there are stories of a few lowlifes that rented when the place opened up. Should SHTF one of my concerns at home would be over penetration. Why would I choose a 22 over my 357 or my 380? The ratio of shots per caliber rimfire to centerfire is easily 100+RF to 1CF. I get enough CF practice to remain quite efficient but it by no means compares to the shooting drills and frequency the range time of the RF. Okay, I realize that a one shot stop is likely not going to happen with a RF. So the training drill is to "keep shooting"... with the mindset that the threat will stop, pause, or flee, allowing you get to safety. Another advantage is accuracy due to the frequency of use. I do not feel under gunned by any means.
Tools of choice:
S&W pistol, 4 1/2" barrel W/ open sights, 12 rnd mags.
Ruger Charger 10" barrel W/ arm brace, red dot, 25 rnd mags
Note: My centerfire guns are my primary CCW in most situations.

So my 71 year old petite mother wanted to get a gun for her house for the first time. She is 110 soaking wet and had shoulder surgery last year. Gun shopping was quite the adventure and I'm pretty sure they have her picture up at one store with a note saying, "Do not let handle guns". Long story short she doesn't have to strength to rack a slide in anything other than a 22 and can't handle the DA pull on a revolver. After some embarrassment I had her try the Taurus tx22 that I have in my safe. Lo and behold we found one she can properly manipulate and handle. So for her the 22 will do. I know I don't want to get hit with 16 rounds of 22.

Well there is this...

"And say what you will. I've never met a soul willing to pursue at a high rate of speed in near pitch black conditions. And while I've seen plenty of spare tires on vehicles I don't recall too many spare headlights.

What message would it say to your would be aggressors walking down the street if a shot rang out, then another and still another as street lights systematically were shot out. A man (or woman) willing to not only embrace a fight but, to deliberately do it in the dark will give pause to most anyone."

http://straightforwardinacrookedworld.blogspot.com/2012/10/dark-arts-for-good-guys-22-lr-pistol.html

The article was written, published at least, in 2013. Even then, I suspect that vehicle headlights were hard to shoot out with a 22 fired from a Walther PPK, or the Beretta featured here, unless if you were up close and maybe cracked the plastic, or whatever it may be made of. I guess you'd have to shoot the headlights out before the chase began. Maybe he's talking about shooting the headlights out while being chased at "high rate of speed" in a moving vehicle with a snub nosed pistol.

If anything, these days and even back in 2013, streetlights are tougher than headlights. I don't think a 22 would harm a streetlight much. Especially not from a sub 3" barrel. But then I haven't done much "systematic" shooting of streetlights. So I figure the author of the article, Agent Double Oh What?, knows more than I do about that.

I have .22 pistols but I also have more suitable weapons for SD---a .22 will work in a pinch if that's all you have--just don't expect consistent results

That post made me feel like I traveled back to the mid-90s and read it in Soldier of Fortune before the gas station cashier asked me to buy it or get out.

Fun reading in a Walter Mitty kind of way, but not applicable to a typical CCW type.

Great Scot said:

Some folks have taken issue with the tenor of the article. I agree that it’s over the top, particularly when he discusses shooting out tires and lights.

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I may have disagreed with the article more if he was a baritone or a soprano, a fine Irish tenor does not bother me. But how he sings is not the point man!

I've been told often that 9mm is the way to go because no matter where a person goes in the world there is plenty of 9mm and 22 available. Well this weekend I was off to a wedding in Douglas City, Ca. 240 miles north of me. I forgot and left 2 boxes of ammo at home and so lacking. (I normally carry two extra boxes of ammo with me when I go to weddings) 9mm I stopped on the way to get some. Stopped in Vacaville, Williams, Redding, etc.. Stopped in one sporting goods store and 4 gun shops. No 9mm. Not a box of anything. All sold out. If I was in Italy, Kenya or Thailand I could of got some 9mm according to conventional wisdom but in Bluegum none was to be had either.

I asked if they had any 22. Sure one fella in Bend said. The price was right all I had to do was pay $9.00 and sing Dave Alvin's "King of California". Good song for his baritone. So I got a box of that. I had no 22 gun with me though. So maybe the point of this thread is correct.

I have a LCR22WMR that I've carried on occasion and have felt adequately armed.

A bit from Paul Harrell.

I have a little Beretta model 70S I've carried a few times, It conceals easy and is small/light enough to easily conceal when wearing shorts/tshirt while mowing. If I have to run out to get gas for the mower or something, I'll take it with me. Its extremely reliable, as accurate as some of my full sized .22LR target guns, and handles easily and reliably for me. Don't care to depend on a .22 for defense, but in daylight hours around here, I'd be willing to take a chance if necessary.

Great Scot said:

http://straightforwardinacrookedworld.blogspot.com/2012/10/dark-arts-for-good-guys-22-lr-pistol.html

Good article about touchy subject. For clarification, I don’t know the history, training, or veracity of the claims made by this author. However, some of the insight and perspectives he provides is compelling. Now that we have the Ruger LCP .22, I think this article is even more relevant.

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So the main thrust of the article is this: If you are an International Man of Mystery (who can't really talk about all the stuff you've done, but will give advice to other such operators on the internet), and you find yourself in a situation where you have bad people chasing you in the dark and you need to pop tires, shatter headlights, then shoot out all the street lights on a dark stretch of road, and then shoot a bad guy multiple times right between the eyes, and the only gun and ammo available by law is a .22 pocket gun with no more than 200 rounds of .22, then a .22 is what you should carry.

I'm seeing shades of Gecko45 in that article. Nice little fantasy read there.