Coated bullet problem?

They will be safe to shoot.

Do the bullets fall through or just need minimal pushing to get through? If they fall through you’ll have a hard time getting optimal accuracy. If they don’t fall through but only require a slight tap to make it through you should be just fine.

Either way they are complete safe.

I'm going to come out and say it...Missouri 44 projectiles in 18 hardness lead my super redhawk like crazy. Yes, they shoot...but they also lead. I've loaded them light, I've loaded them up 1600 fps scorchers...doesn't matter, leading.

Now, their 12 hardness projectiles? Perfectly fine, zero leading.

I believe the huge majority of factory cast projectiles for the .44 are too hard and too small. So they rarely allow the gun to demonstrate best accuracy, and they often lead unneccesarily. They are, however, perfectly safe.

In my opinion, if a handloader wants top results with cast, he either needs to buy from a manufacturer that allows the consumer to specify diameter and hardness, or cast his own.

.38 Special said:

I believe the huge majority of factory cast projectiles for the .44 are too hard and too small. So they rarely allow the gun to demonstrate best accuracy, and they often lead unneccesarily. They are, however, perfectly safe.

In my opinion, if a handloader wants top results with cast, he either needs to buy from a manufacturer that allows the consumer to specify diameter and hardness, or cast his own.

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You are 100% correct. This is just a guess, but I think the issue is that most mass-production companies do not want to use a gas check. It adds cost and steps, so most just go right to making their projectiles hard as a rock. 18 seems to be the magic number for many makers and for many guns, this is way too hard for the projectile to expand enough in the barrel to eliminate leading. 12 hardness is fine for my SRH, diameter doesn't matter as much. Take the exact same projectile, same diameter, up the hardness from 12 to 18 and you're in leading-town. I very foolishly bought some 38 DEWC's from Oregon Trail a while back...they were 21 hardness! The leaded up my gun to an insane amount. Knowing what I know now, why anyone would make a 38 projectile to 21 hardness is WAY beyond me. They now took the hardness down to 12 on those...

Like I said earlier, I've pushed Missouri, Hi-tek coated "Elmer K" to a whopping 1600+ fps...and they still lead. I can't push them any harder. Taking them down to lower fps (1000-1200) makes the leading even worse.

Measure the bullets. If they are .430" then you will probable be OK. Most revolver throats run .431" or larger, and with coated bullets you should be OK. If you are using nekkid cast bullets I'd suggest a bit larger, the same diameter as the throats. When you get a chance slug/measure the throats slug the barrel. Mainly to know your gun better and making sure the throats are larger than the groove diameter of the barrel. "Normally", 44 Mag. revolvers are "supposed" to have .430"-.431" throats and .429" groove diameter, but measure to make sure. I have 3, 44 Magnum revolvers all have 429"-.4295" groove diameter and .431" throats (S&W 629, Ruger Super Blackhawk, Dan Wesson 44H)...

Posts above about commercial casters using too hard alloy and too hard lube are largely correct (one exception I've found when purchasing cast is Bear Tooth Bullets). Newer lead bullet users think "harder is better" and want "hard cast", so the commercial casters have given them what they want; hard (too hard) cast bullets. Also harder bullets (BHN 18+) and hard lubes survive shipping better. One reason the only time I purchase cast is when I'm researching a new to me bullet before I purchase a mold. My hand gun bullets are normally 11-12 BHN with a very few using Lyman #2 at 15 BHN and for my rifle bullets...

Typetwelve said:

You are 100% correct. This is just a guess, but I think the issue is that most mass-production companies do not want to use a gas check. It adds cost and steps, so most just go right to making their projectiles hard as a rock. 18 seems to be the magic number for many makers and for many guns, this is way too hard for the projectile to expand enough in the barrel to eliminate leading. 12 hardness is fine for my SRH, diameter doesn't matter as much. Take the exact same projectile, same diameter, up the hardness from 12 to 18 and you're in leading-town. I very foolishly bought some 38 DEWC's from Oregon Trail a while back...they were 21 hardness! The leaded up my gun to an insane amount. Knowing what I know now, why anyone would make a 38 projectile to 21 hardness is WAY beyond me. They now took the hardness down to 12 on those...

Like I said earlier, I've pushed Missouri, Hi-tek coated "Elmer K" to a whopping 1600+ fps...and they still lead. I can't push them any harder. Taking them down to lower fps (1000-1200) makes the leading even worse.

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I may be a cynic, but I suspect that rock-hard cast bullets exist primarily so that they don't get dinged up during shipping. I can't see any reason for 18+ BHN in handguns, outside of extremely specialized cartridges producing rifle velocities. Like you, I have found that properly fitted and lubed bullets of 16-1 (which is about 11 BHN) are excellent to at least 1200 FPS. 21 BHN wadcutters are just silly. I get best results from the Hornady dry lubed 148 HBWC, which as far as I can tell are either pure lead or very close to it. I've never found anything more accurate for the typical .38 Special.

A pound of polymer coating from Harbor Freight and a $20 toaster oven from Walmart is a good investment -- coat your bullets again and see how they shoot.

Argh! Even Vern has turned to the dark side!

I use the 200, 240, and 300gr 18BHN MBC coated bullets as primary fodder for my M629 with very little to no leading. I push 'em hard, really hard, and also load 'em cat sneeze soft with much satisfaction. Never have measured the chambers. Oh yeah, I use their 300 and 325gr 18BHN MBC coated bullets as primary fodder for my 460V also with great satisfaction. Talk about pushing a projectile hard.

Wing Rider said:

I just received my first shipment of coated cast bullets for my 44 mag. I have never loaded cast before. I know there is another thread going right now about cast 44 bullets. The bullets I got was the 44 smasher 240 RNFP from MBC. They measure .430 as advertised. I have not determined the diameter of the throat and forcing cone on my SRH but when I got the bullets today, I can push the bullet through the cylinder with no effort at all. So I believe they are too small. Are these safe to load and shoot or do I have 500 small paper weights? I know I should have slugged the gun first, my fault.

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A slight resistance is what is recommended dropping a bullet into the cylinder and through the cylinder bore as mentioned above. Bullet to bore diameter is more important also mentioned above.
The best solution is to run a few test rounds at your intended velocity and do accuracy and leading checks.

Smiles,

Wing Rider said:

Thanks to everyone for your comments. I thought I had done the right research before ordering but appears maybe not. What concerned me was that I also bought a batch of MBC bullets for my GP-100 357 mag and those bullets did not drop through the cylinder like the 44 mag did. I was just concerned that upon firing that there would be excessive gas blowby in the cylinder. Again thanks for the info. I will try them and go from there.

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One of my more valuable tools is a set of pin gauges. I paid hundreds of dollars for a complete set, but I have been accused of letting this revolver hobby get slightly out of hand. A more reasonable fellow can easily find a handful of gauges online for perhaps $20. A .44 man might do well with .429 through .432, in .001 increments. Hopefully, slugging his barrel will show that the bore is around .001 smaller than his throats, or at least show that fire lapping or throat honing can create that circumstance. Then he can order a bullet (from someplace like Montana Bullet Works) sized to .001 larger than his throats, and in a hardness of no more than 12 to 14 BHN, and hopefully with a large portion of soft lube. This would almost guarantee ideal results.

Really awful would be needing a dowel to drive it through the chamber throats and then having the same bullet dropping free into the forcing cone...

I buy the 12 BHN MBC bullets and load them in .38-.357, .44S-M and .45C revolvers and lever guns and seem to avoid the leading issues you’re having. I don’t go for screaming velocities, so this may also be a factor.

The 18 BHN bullets are really hard, and the bases MBC casts often have a bevel, so it’s a double-whammy for gas blow by.

Good luck finding the right balance .

Stay safe.