An unusual reloading setup? Single stage for sizing/decapping, RCBS Auto Prime, Dillon 5 stage to finish

I deprime and resize on a Lee single stage. The reasons I do that are….

1. Keeps the mess on the Lee. The Lee is very easy to clean.

1.1. After depriming and sizing I tumble but do not clean the primer pocket with a hand tool.

Then back to the Lee Single stage to…

2. Prime. The Safety Prime is FAST to load and runs pretty much flawlessly. I don’t like the tube primer feed mechanism on the Redding T7.

3. Then I move to a Redding T7 and bell, drop powder, seat a bullet by hand and with a Lee FCD crimp separately.

I get the pop corn first

I think that I could size/decap a whole lot of brass in an evening and throw it in the ultrasonic cleaner, and the next evening prime it all. Then it would be ready to go for the progressive.

Don't forget the step to dry the brass.

I don't know how much brass you're thinking of processing, or how many rounds you are thinking of reloading each month, but if it's going to be a lot you may want to consider one of the wet tumblers over an ultrasonic. I don't wet tumble, but my understanding is some of the wet tumblers can do 500+ pieces of brass at a time.

Other than that, if your budget allows it your plan sounds good to me. There really is no right way for everybody, you have to find what works for you.

chris

Mike P Wagner said:

One option is to go with ... or a Lee 6 station press (I forget the name)

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You must not drink beer ... It's "Six Pack Pro" or Pro 6000 kit.

Mike P Wagner said:

I don't think a 5 station press is what I want.

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6 station press will do all the functions you desire. (And SPP/Pro 6000 comes with stepped "M" style powder through expander not mentioned in your steps 1-5)

Mike P Wagner said:

The other option I have thought of is a single stage press for sizing/decapping and an RCSB Auto Priming Tool, followed by a 5 station press set up ... ultrasonically clean the primer pockets after decapping before priming.

Station 1: Expand/Powder Charge
Station 2: Powder Check (DAA Magnetic Powder Check, RCBS Powder Cop, or something like that)
Station 3: Bullet Feed
Station 4: Bullet Seating
Station 5: Bullet Crimping

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If you want to deprime to clean primer pockets and bench prime separately, Deluxe APP press not only will deprime cases fast, but has primer pocket swage kit to remove military crimps and will also prime fast too - https://www.titanreloading.com/product/lee-deluxe-app/

Primer swage kit - https://www.titanreloading.com/product/lee-app-primer-swage-kit/

Then you can choose your choice of progressive press for reloading with cleaned/sized/primed cases.

Mike P Wagner said:

I am thinking about re-loading

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Mike P Wagner said:

The problem I had with a dry tumbler was that if I tumbled before decapping, the primer pocket never got cleaned out. If I tumbled after decapping, little bits of media ended up in the primer pocket.

Does this same issue happen with wet tumbling?

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Your first statement made it sound like you haven't reloaded before, and your second statement tells me you have. So you have some experience and have a good idea what you want.

As I said above, I don't wet tumble. My reloading buddy does wet tumble sometimes, as well as using a dry tumbler and an ultrasonic. The wet tumbler will clean the pockets if you deprime first and use pins or chips. If you deprime first, you may get a pin stuck in the pocket but obviously won't have any walnut or corn media in the flash hole. Hope that helps.

chris

Mike P Wagner said:

I am trying to figure out how to assess the quality of the Lee Six Pack/6000 ... growing up, Lee had a reputation mostly for affordability. My dad reloaded ... RCBS ... single stage press in the early 60s

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Newest generation of Lee Precision presses in 2024 is nothing like your dad's experience.

This is coming from a USPSA match shooter who has shot over a million pistol/rifle rounds past 30 years NOT counting 22LR (Spent over $166,000 on reloading components/equipment) and was trained to reload on Dillon 550. Also had RCBS RS5 single stage that was PIF to an elderly hunter and went through around 20 presses during my life.

After going from Dillon 450 with plans to retire with Dillon 650/case feeder and Dillon 550 (I had around 15 presses just before retirement), unexpected medical issues with my parents required liquidation of over 90% of my shooting/reloading stuff and I narrowed my reloading press choices down to Dillon 550 and Lee ABLP for small footprint reloading for pistol and rifle reloading.

Thankfully, wife and I didn't had to sell our retirement property to move in with our parents in another state but all the gun stuff were already sold/gifted/PIF and I had to restart my reloading setup again after 30 years but this time with unlimited budget - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...st-set-up-with-unlimited-budget.912629/page-3

Mike P Wagner said:

watched ... YouTube videos about the Lee 6 stage press, and they say nothing but good things.

So maybe that’s all history.

I am somewhat skeptical that someone can make a press of the same quality as a Hornady LnL AP or a Dillon XL-750 or an RCBS Pro Chucker 5 for half the price.

But I am definitely keeping an eye on a Lee 6000/Six Pack.

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I was looking at Dillon 750 with case feeder for replacement of 650 with case feeder and curious about Frankford Arsenal X-10 press but it was delayed to market for over a year during which time Lee Precision released Six Pack Pro/Pro 6000 kit. Long story short, I signed up to buy pre/early production model, became a beta/production tester for Lee Precision and ABLP was PIF to my sister/BIL who moved to Texas and I am quite happy with SPP/Pro 6000 kit over Dillon 750 now that I have worked with Lee Precision to resolve all the identified issues from early production release - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-21#post-12890123

Lee Precision even fixed all the issues with humble 3 station Pro 1000 that I used to load USPSA match rounds on several dedicated to caliber set ups - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/new-2023-gen3-lee-pro-1000-unboxing.916672/

As life-long fan of Dillon presses, I have nothing against them but if you are planning to load multiple calibers on one progressive press, SPP/Pro 6000 kit offers much easier and faster caliber changes.

Two presses will do what you want. A single sage to deprime/resize, then wet tumble and dry. I use the Lee bench primer to prime and then another trip through the single to flare if I’m loading cast. All my loading is done on a single stage, and I store my brass primed until I decide to load it. You can flare if necessary, drop powder, seat, then crimp, and viola, it’s a new baby round.
You didn’t mention if you are loading pistol or rifle, but if rifle you will have to check the length, possibly trim, then chamfer and debur. Depending on the caliber, you may also have to swage the primer pockets in order to get the new primer in.

I believe on the Dillon 750 (I love mine) the powder measure has to be in position 2.

For depriming there is always the Harvey hand deprimer. I have a turret press next to my Dillon with a lee universal decap die and a spent primer tube fitted but I've just used the Harvey for the past couple years.

Primarily for handgun ammunition reloading. Rifle reloading is a variation.

I use a Hornady L-N~L press for my resizing, de-priming, and case mouth expanding. I then tumble clean the cases and put them aside for a future loading session.

For loading, I may use the Hornady, A Dillon SDB (45 ACP, 9x19, and 380 ACP), or an RCBS Pro2000 (460 S&W, 300 BO). I load some cartridges on a Dillon BL550 but I did not check my records. I do load something north of 30 cartridges.

I find different presses work better with different cartridges. The Hornady works well with most cartridges but other presses work better with particular cartridges.

With 45 ACP, 9x19, and 380 ACP, I never change the load I have three SDB’s set up for each cartridge so easy peasy for getting started with a reloading run.

The nice thing about reloading is you can think outside the box and create a process that works for you.

Be d*** those that think you are not reloading properly if you don’t reload from fired case to loaded case.

There are more ways to skin this cat.

Mike P Wagner said:

Frankford Arsenal X-10, which seems like it checks all of my boxes.

... looks like the X-10 is the choice for me.

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I was curious about FA X-10 as well when I was looking for replacement for Dillon 650 with case feeder. But having been spoiled by Dillon's toolhead swap (I had caliber conversions with separate powder measures), more and more I was interested in X-10's caliber change process (But that became moot as X-10 became vaporware for a year). With Six Pack Pro, caliber change is quick and easy as dies are simply spun off and on with breech lock bushings, pre-set Auto Drum is swapped out and shellplate changed (There's no need to change priming pin from small to large, just swap out of small/large primer slider guides) within a few minutes.

Here's caliber conversion from .308 to 9mm on FA X-10 ... Ummm ... not for me.

Mike P Wagner said:

But now that I awake, it looks like the X-10 is the choice for me.

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You can still process 2x on a progressive - the first is to deprime and/or size, then tumble and then have at it again to stuff those rounds full. Wet tumbling with pins will clean everything and no they don’t stick in the primer pockets.
I prime on the progressive - either LNL or RL1100 and haven’t found the priming step to be an issue. Is there an occasional hangup? Count on it. A piece of flotsam or jetsam inevitably will mess up anything.

Mike P Wagner said:

I am thinking about re-loading and I think I want separate seating and crimping stations, potential for a bullet feed station, and a powder check station of some kind. Since that is 4 stations, I don't think a 5 station press is what I want.

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This is a 650, 5 station press.

Station 1. case feed, size/deprime
Station 2. prime, powder charge/flare.
Station 3. power check
Station 4 bullet feed and seat to depth.
Station 5 crimp.

cfullgraf said:

The nice thing about reloading is you can think outside the box and create a process that works for you.

Be d*** those that think you are not reloading properly if you don’t reload from fired case to loaded case.

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+1

FWIW, I have both a single-stage and a 5-station progressive. In a variation of the comment above, even though I'm running a progressive, I don't use any automation... that is, I seat my own cases, I actuate the powder drop by hand, and I seat the bullet manually before seating... I feel this allows me more control over the process, and particularly the powder drop... I know when I have a bridge, or when the rotor cavity isn't quite right just by the feel, and can take steps to correct it without shutting down the whole shebang.

There are times when I run handgun start to finish... fired case to loaded case, as he mentions above. I don't get all spastic over my primer pockets, or whether or not a nugget of walnut is stuck in the flash hole... it doesn't matter. There are also times when I size and decap separately so I can clean the primer pockets... before they hit the 5-station merry-go-round. It's all about versatility.

I did buy my Hornady 5-station press so I could seat and crimp in a separate step. You can buy a press with more stations than you need, and survive, but you can't add a station to a 4-stop press after you bought it. Think into the future... thinking about what you think you need now, may change once you actually start pulling the handle.

Sometimes I assemble my rifle rounds completely on the single-stage. Sometimes, after all the prep work, I throw them on the progressive and assemble them that way... particularly with a big run of blasting ammo, like 5.56mm or 7.62mm.

I'd raise the single stage decapper/sizer + RCBS Auto Prime combo and get a Lee APP Deluxe - or better still, I'd get TWO...

1) Decap on Lee APP
2) Wash
3) Dry
4) Size on Lee APP
5) Prime on Lee APP

Then move to your 5 station press to charge, check, bullet feed, seat, crimp.

If you didn't want to wash, or you washed and dried with primers in place, then you could:

1) Wash
2) Dry
3) Decap & size on Lee APP
4) Prime on Lee APP

No primer tubes, no individual case handling. Dump them in the case collator at every step and be ripping out a case every 1-2sec, instead of decapping and priming one case every 8-10sec when handling cases individually, plus your primer tube reload time. I have LOATHED single stage decapping for a long time, but I prefer to clean my brass before loading again, and prefer to keep the dirtiest part of the process OFF of my progressive presses, so it has been a necessary evil. But for as cheap as it is, the Lee APP does a great job and I can BURN through decapping cases fast enough now, I wish I'd had this thing for the last 25yrs instead of just the last 3.

I've got 4 centerfire presses (and 2 shotgun)

My normal procedure for rifle:

1. Decap on an old RCBS RockChucker
2. Wet tumble
3. Dry in a repurposed Dehydrator
4. Check PPs with a gauge and sort (so I don't waste any additional time and in the case of .223 range pick-ups sort the crimped primer PPs.
5. Anneal
6. Size on a Redding Ultra Mag using spray lube with the decapping/Expanding stem removed
7. Use a big blue Dillon Vibrator to get lube off
8. Check length, trim if needed then de-burr and chamfer
9. Expand neck using neck expanding mandrel and dry lube, leaving dry lube inside case neck
10. Prime using an RCBS bench primer
11. Load

For .223 and .308 bulk ammo I have just a single sizing die (with decapping/expander stem) on a Dillon 550 tool head that I'll substitute for #6. Thoughts are I only touch the brass once.
7. Use a big blue Dillon Vibrator to get lube off
8. I then run them through a Giraud's Trimmer mounted in a drill press. It's quicker than bothering to measure.
11. I load them on a Dillon 550 minus the sizing die.

Pistol/revolver:

2. Wet tumble
3. Dry in repurposed Dehydrator
11. Load on either the 550 or 650 using all of the functions.

There you go Mike......that's a pretty good picture of the many faces of progressive reloading! They all work. What ever presses you get you will have to learn and learn to like. You will adapt them to you and what works for you.

I will only add this to what I said in the other thread: For "me", I want simplicity and speed. Simplicity as in the least number of things to have to juggle and think about per stroke of the press. (for me that means feeder/collaters for cases and bullets) Then I can focus on primers and powder. Speed as in speed to change calibers. The harder it is to change calibers the less I am going to change calibers. You mentioned in the other thread that you will mainly do 9mm pistol. In that case most any progressive will do the job well. If you plan on loading 3 or 4 pistol calibers plus 3 or 4 rifle calibers........pay attention to caliber change procedures.

You noticed a few have several progressives.....I have three. And all three change calibers easily. But I still would prefer to set up a press for one and leave it there. Or at very least, one for rifle and one for pistol. People with one press don't have that option......and in that case get a press that's easy to change calibers. Again if you are sure you are only going to reload for 9mm, then it doesn't matter.....then just worry about station count that does what you want.

Amazing thread. The level of detail impressive. And OP, you say you're "thinking" about reloading but not actually doing it yet? I don't think you've been warned that once you start it's like the fog of war, all your planning will be greatly stressed. So have plans B, C, and D ready to go (along with the cash to pay for them).

Good luck

I helped a friend years ago get into reloading with a Lee Classic Turret, he chugged along for a few years and then purchased a Dillon ??? for his pistol, last weekend I saw him and he now uses a Lee APP to decap and size everything before cleaning and then uses either the Dillon or a new Lee Six Pack for pistol and the LCT for rifle. He thinks the Lee APP is the best thing ever and is looking for another

LiveLife said:

I was curious about FA X-10 as well when I was looking for replacement for Dillon 650 with case feeder. But having been spoiled by Dillon's toolhead swap (I had caliber conversions with separate powder measures), more and more I was interested in X-10's caliber change process (But that became moot as X-10 became vaporware for a year). With Six Pack Pro, caliber change is quick and easy as dies are simply spun off and on with breech lock bushings, pre-set Auto Drum is swapped out and shellplate changed (There's no need to change priming pin from small to large, just swap out of small/large primer slider guides) within a few minutes.

Here's caliber conversion from .308 to 9mm on FA X-10 ... Ummm ... not for me.

8 FA X 10 Caliber Change

www.youtube.com

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Oh my gosh......not ever going to that one, unless intended for to be set up for ONE cartridge. With the Pro 2000 or Pro Chucker 7 or Lee APP or 6000, I could change calibers 3 times in that much time.

Can't speak for Dillons or LnL's since I've never witnessed a caliber change on those.

Mike P Wagner said:

Does this same issue happen with wet tumbling?

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Virtually never - I did have one short pin, the same length as a primer pocket diameter, get stuck. I got it out and chucked it. So far, just that one.