Now you are just being intellectually dishonest by only counting Glocks and not "Glocks", and at the same time lumping every 1911 into one group. Doubly so since in your examples on the next page you include a kit built 1911, but won't consider the epic failures of many kit built "Glocks". Go visit /r/polymer80/ over at Reddit for a constant stream of "My gun won't run" posts. Ergo, by your standard, Glocks have reliability problems and shouldn't be trusted. I say that wearing a custom Glock 26 right now. That I absolutely trust. Because I know that counting the failures of "Glocks" made by bubba the dremmel slave against the reliability of Glocks isn't logical. Just like counting the reliability of a 1911 put together by a bunch of ham fisted morons trying to jump on the 1911 craze shouldn't be counted against 1911s in totality
Youre the one who wants to lump in things that "arent" a Glock. I said "Glock".
As far as the "1911's" go, what do each of the companies that make them, call them? What do they sell them as or refer to them as? 1911's.
Those companies making things "similar" to Glock, arent selling them as "Glocks". Are they? Do they say Glock on the gun? Whats on most of the 1911's? ....... more often than not, something like 1911 or 1911A1.
And Glocks were what I was referring to whenever I say Glock. I dont buy the others youre referring to, and have no experience with them.
1911's to me, are either a Colt or GI gun. The others are clones, like your Glock clones. Yet, they are still considered a 1911 by most, so they all get lumped together. I dont see anyone differentiating between them when they describe them. As an example...."What kind of gun do you have?" A 1911. "OK.....What kind?" A Springfield. A Kimber. A Colt. Whatever.
And......what kind of gun is it?
See my point? I understand what youre saying, but the fact is, to most people, a 1911 is a 1911, no matter who made it.
And even then, throw all the "clones" out, and use just "real" 1911's, whatever that may be these days, and head to head against a SIG or Glock, would you still take that bet?
I have owned six 1911s. Five of them I still own. I have never owned one that has been in the $1k or above range.
The first gun I ever owned was a second hand Colt MK IV Series 80. The previous owner had removed the firing pin block and done some work on the internals. It was prone to light strikes.
RIA GI: Runs perfectly
Citadel Compact: Runs perfectly
Citadel full size: Runs perfectly
Taurus PT-1911: Ran this gun in IPDA for years flawlessly. Right side safety fell off eventually, replaced with standard safety. Ended up selling it to a friend.
PSA Two Tone: Runs perfectly
So, other than the actual Colt, my 1911s have all be trust worthy. Of course, the Colt was the only one fiddled with. Some of the cheapest 1911s are the best 1911s in terms of functionality since they tend to be building closest to the original specs and not fuddling about trying to make the gun with tighter tolerances or fancy features.
Lucky you.
Youve had totally different experiences than I have.
As best as I can remember and count up, Ive owned around 40 over the years, and basically 75% of them, were a PITA of some sort. Even the "good ones" usually required something to make them right too. Even if that just meant changing out some crappy parts, or having the slide cut for sights, etc.
I dont normally buy custom guns either, normally just box stock things that, in the case of the 1911's, usually required a gunsmith to help get them right. Which just adds to the cost. Still, other than that POS Loaded, all my 1911's are basic guns with stock triggers, or triggers in the 6# range.
So why is it, I can buy other things, of similar or less cost, that work right out of the box, yet I cant buy a factory 1911 (of any kind) that will? At least with enough confidence that it will. I dont have that confidence, and thats from actual, personal experience.
Counterpoint: I picked up a second hand German made Sig P220 for an absolute steal. It couldn't get through a single magazine... which is probably why it was sold so cheap. Replaced all the springs and some of the internals and now it runs like a sewing machine.
The lesson here is that anecdotal evidence is only good for story telling.
Yea, one gun anyway. Ive owned four P220's, German and US Standards, Carry, and Compact, and a German P245 as well. Never had a lick of trouble with any of them, and every one of them worked 100% right out of the box, new and used.
So again, we seem to have totally different experiences. Or stories.
Well, it did take six pages before someone turned this into a Glock is better than 1911 thread, so there's that. At least you chronicled your own history with the 1911 …
But, returning to the topic at hand, I would just say for those who've been away from the 1911 for a while, don't judge the platform on the old shipboard watchstander guns or military duty issue pistols with the clapped-out mags from your time on active duty in the 70s or 80s. I was fortunate to get into a unit with a dedicated 1911 armorer and supply folks who let us order decent magazines, and that's when and where I learned to love the 1911 (also, I had a Marine instructor cadre who were disciples of Col. Cooper) -- if I based my opinion on the pistols I was given to stand duty and qualify with during my first enlistment (early 80s) I'd absolutely hate the 1911 (my experience may have resembled SSNVet's).
It wasnt my intent to make this a 1911 vs anything. Simply using one as an example of what works vs one that seems to often have trouble doing so, and why cant we get that.
If you dont like the Glocks, then use SIG, or any of the others that seem to not have any difficulty building guns that actually do work, right out of the box. If you dont like SIG, HK's work like that too.
Look, I like 1911's as much as the next guy, as long as they work, and I dont have to keep dealing with them. I want to shoot them, and be able to count on them, just like anything else. The 1911s I have now that do work like that, are a Colt, and a gun built on Colt parts, and both those guns, still required a gunsmith to get them to be reliable and how I wanted them. Almost 30 years later, and a lot of rounds downrange, they still work as I want. As Ive said, a good, working 1911, is a wondrous thing. Im not disputing that in the least.
Ive bought two "current" "1911's this year, a High Standard, and a Springfield, and neither of them has worked as they should, and realistically, if I still lived near EGW, if they are even still doing that type work, and I felt it was something I needed to dump more money into (which I dont) Id have dropped them off and had them made right. Anything I ever gave them, and I gave them a number of things, always worked when I got it back, and as far as I know, still are. The ones I no longer have that they did, went to friends in trades.
But thats been the whole point of my bitching! NOT having to do that.