20 Gauge hull identification

[Nipty]

I was hoping that someone may have some k knowledge on hull identity. I know their is alot out there. I have a few. Some I know for sure what data to use. Others..I just can't seem to locate for sure positive confirmation . Any help to what data can be used would be most greatful. I know the Remington load the rxp,premier,sts. The federal n Winchester I am not so sure about. Like can I use the same data for the win AA hulls & HS data for the two win I have in the picture. And the Federal hulls for data. Thanks

 

[NMexJim]

Well, it looks like some are Remington Shurshot, and the others I can't see well enough to help. I'll assume that your interest is in reloading the hulls and not from a hull collector view.

I highly recommend Lyman's 5th Edition "Shotshell Reloading Handbook" as a huge help in identifying the differences in hulls. I've attached a couple of scans that might help. You'll notice that I have a marker on the upper right corner of this page. I often go to this section.

Even with this book, I found a lot of hulls at the range that weren't listed. I started cutting them lengthwise in half so that I could see and measure the basewad and identify if it was either straight wall or tapered. I found quite a few manufacturers are built with the same dimensions.

After all that, I just said screw it and stayed with major brands and loading formulas for them. I've seen a shotgun explode on the line down from me, and I figured there is just too much at stake and that the hulls I need are plentiful.

The book is about $25 and is money well spent.

 

[entropy]

If you are going to reload 20 I agree with NMexJim, get the Lyman 5th edition book.
The short answer to your question is the only one you can reload using AA data is that short based Winchester hull second from the left. It is basically the Win. 20 equivalent to the Remington Gun Club.
The Remington hull you have there is not the same as the STS hull, so no that one won't work with the STS data.
The Lyman book is your best source to start with.

 

[Blue68f100]

I've loaded all of those in the past, 50 yrs ago. The Super X is a good one to load, it used the discontinued WAA20F1 wadding if my memory is any good. I still have some loaded with that combo use W540 (HS6) powder. Back in the 70's and early 80's Winchester's free load data book listed all of the factory loads. Most all of my hulls were Win AA or RP Magic Hulls using the smaller 57 primer.

 

[deadeye dick]

Back in the day of paper hulls i just loaded them. Same recipe for anything i picked up off the floor or shot NIB Thousands of rounds with never a hiccup.

 

[Nipty]

I was going by the book with "Field load" using 15.5 - 15.8 of unique with cb1078 -20. With remington primers. Your saying this is not safe? Correct? Jam it. Thought I was good on Remington data. It was the others I questioned. I ll have to pick up the Lyman 5th

 

[NMexJim]

Today's plastic hulls have internal dimensions all over the place. Matching hull, shot wad, and powder is the only way to reload shotshells safely.

I suggest you look through the powder manufacturer's sites such as Hodgdon. There is a huge amount of info available for free.

 

[NMexJim]

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide

Here's a link to Alliant for Unique.

Claybuster Wads

And Claybuster's to find out how the CB1078-20 crosses over.

 

[Nipty]

The picture I posted last is from the Alliant reloading guide they sent me this year. As I stated in original post. I was assuming from reading, what I sent in last post, in the book. That using the sureshot hulls ,which seem robust. That they are a game load hull. Thinking field n game kinda get put on the boxes. I sent some emails out to a few companies. I ll wait for reply. I do appreciate everyone that replied. Is why I inquired. Seeking knowledge beyond my own. In the beginning of this post, I found on the net. He was asking the same question..to a point. He had the Sureshot hulls. But I am not in a dire rush. I just want to be sure n safe. Ordering Lyman 5th edition. Hope to here back from Winchester on the others as well. And yes great call on contacting Claybuster! A while back I did about Federal top guns. They sent a sample pack of the wads I am using and said them the ones lol. They work great in 410 the c.b. wads.

 

[tmd16556]

Most load roughly the same within brands there. If the federal hulls are plastic, have a plated steel head and paper basewad, they’re all the same internally even if they’re Top Gun, Hi-Power, or Field. Don’t expect the, to last long, primer pockets loosen up quickly with those cases. I like them for 1 oz field loads though.

Same with rem hulls. The unibody hulls are generally the same until you get back to the old RXP and earlier, and even then, the differences may not be big (Im not near my manuals so I can’t verify that). Steel vs brass heads are the biggest difference. There are some other types to watch for with plastic basewads.

Winchester hulls are the odd ones with the newer poly formed hulls designed to use the same loads as the older unibodies (at least according to Lyman 5ed).

A big thing to look at if mixing these internally similar hulls is that some versions use 6pt and others 8pt crimps. Sorting these is best done before they reach the sizing die. I’ve made that mistake before, they may close but it’s not pretty. Although the newer zinc head Winchester hulls it probably doesn’t matter since they crimp equally badly even if you do everything right.

 

[entropy]

Most load roughly the same within brands there. If the federal hulls are plastic, have a plated steel head and paper basewad, they’re all the same internally even if they’re Top Gun, Hi-Power, or Field. Don’t expect the, to last long, primer pockets loosen up quickly with those cases. I like them for 1 oz field loads though.

Same with rem hulls. The unibody hulls are generally the same until you get back to the old RXP and earlier, and even then, the differences may not be big (Im not near my manuals so I can’t verify that). Steel vs brass heads are the biggest difference. There are some other types to watch for with plastic basewads.

Winchester hulls are the odd ones with the newer poly formed hulls designed to use the same loads as the older unibodies (at least according to Lyman 5ed).

A big thing to look at if mixing these internally similar hulls is that some versions use 6pt and others 8pt crimps. Sorting these is best done before they reach the sizing die. I’ve made that mistake before, they may close but it’s not pretty. Although the newer zinc head Winchester hulls it probably doesn’t matter since they crimp equally badly even if you do everything right.

The only exception to the old AA-CF and new AA-HS loading the same is when using large loads of bulky powders like Green Dot, Blue Dot or Unique. You will have to use a shorter wad for these. I use the Downrange DRA-12 wad it is a shorter clone of the WAA-12.

 

[Fishtales]

For myself, I would not use any of the hulls shown in Nipty's picture. Win AA's in 12 and 20 (1970's and 80's versions) compose 99% of my reloads since 1970. 12 gauge wads are WWAA12 for 11/8 oz and WWAA12F1 for 11/4 oz. 20 gauge wads are WWAA20 for 7/8 oz and WWAA20F1 for 1 oz. I use Unique for 12 gauge and Herco for 20 gauge. Sorry, but I don't have the weights available at this location (reloading info is at home). However, I have noticed (at least in my early days of reloading) that Red Dot and Green Dot seemed to be the more popular powders for trap and skeet shooters. I don't have experience with Remington STX hulls but have seen a lot of good things written about them. As has been mentioned previously (and that I see you have invested in), always keep a reloading handbook close by. Lastly verify the amount of powder dropped by the powder bushing with a scale so you can verify that the amount being dropped is what you had planned on.

 

[Nipty]

You guys rock! Yeah safety is top priority, for the gun, those around & myself. Yeah, can't have too many books on reloading. Old or new. I write everything down and double check weights when not using my RCBS link. Anymore I use that when loading more then just a few test rounds of anything. Check it's powder drop just about. At least every other. So the attached is the email I got today. She said prior this week no one else was around to give answers.
From what she is saying, I did reply with a double check email to verify, that these hulls & gun clubs start out as the same hull. And once a destination is made, the hull goes to become "said" round. Loaded a few. Actually not a horrible crimp. I ll post one

 

[Fishtales]

Impressive that you got a reply from a rep with Remington that included some very interesting information.
By the way the 12 gauge 11/4 oz load is 22 gr of Unique and the 20 gauge 1 oz load is 16 gr of Herco.

 

[Nipty]

Tad bit of a swirl. I don't think it came out horrible... first 20 gauge shell I have loaded. Powder and wad in a dozen or so. Going to load a few federal up. Definitely going to test this one Remington rd out before I load them all up. Range day tomorrow! Have to get some shooting in. Local gun ship yesterday, I could not believe my eyes. Lots of primers sp,spm,sr,209, even some match sp mag. A few match sp. Winchester n federal were the pistol . Cci small rifle. And powder. Lots of powder. Wish I had more $ to spend . Rl.19. 56 bucks...ouch..I wanted it.. but damn.. couldn't do it...