Dudedog
Contributing Member
Anybody have any reccomendations for an inexpensive 300 Blackout upper?
Would prefer complete with BCG say maybe 16" or 18" barrel.
Would prefer complete with BCG say maybe 16" or 18" barrel.
300 Blackout upper for AR15
- Thread starter Dudedog
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GAMEOVER44
Member
Id go with the 18" barrel.. still short while giving you that extra velocity.
bangswitch
Member
I'd get the 16" over the 18"; a tad more compact and you won't lose any noticable velocity. Or, do the paperwork for an SBR and go with a 10.5 or 12 incher. Whichever you do, go with pistol gas. Youll be better set up for subs, if and when.
Why not build one?
Why not build one?
carbine85
Member
Are you looking at changing uppers around? If not a barrel change is easy. I see a lot 300 BO barrels around.
loki.fish
Member
16" max length I'd ever get 300blk in
MachIVshooter
Member
I can tell you where not to get one from.
DO NOT buy from SOTA arms. I made that mistake. Barrel OD undersized at gas port, they basically told me to pound sand. I fixed it with steel shim stock, but they'll never get any business from anyone I know.
Also, I agree with Loki.fish in that shorter is better with .300 Blk, the cartridge being designed around a 10.3" barrel. .300 Blk is loaded with magnum pistol powders or the fastest of the rifle powders; I use H-110 for supersonic and IMR4198 for subs. Unlike 5.56, the round gains nothing from longer tubes. If you're trying to stay title I, I'd say find a 13"-14.5" tube and pin/weld a muzzle device to get 16". No performance sacrifice, more compact and better handling weapon. Honestly, SBR is the way to go. Mine is a 10.5"
DO NOT buy from SOTA arms. I made that mistake. Barrel OD undersized at gas port, they basically told me to pound sand. I fixed it with steel shim stock, but they'll never get any business from anyone I know.
Also, I agree with Loki.fish in that shorter is better with .300 Blk, the cartridge being designed around a 10.3" barrel. .300 Blk is loaded with magnum pistol powders or the fastest of the rifle powders; I use H-110 for supersonic and IMR4198 for subs. Unlike 5.56, the round gains nothing from longer tubes. If you're trying to stay title I, I'd say find a 13"-14.5" tube and pin/weld a muzzle device to get 16". No performance sacrifice, more compact and better handling weapon. Honestly, SBR is the way to go. Mine is a 10.5"
Blade First
Member
As suggested, what round you are going to use primarily will determine what barrel length is better.
Since currently-available commercial ammo loads cover an astounding 110g to 240g weight range, the number of variables end up in the thousands.
We learned from testing so far this much:
That barrel lengths with decent reliability [i.e., work most of the time] for that broad range of bullet weights are shorter in OAL. The longer barrels I've tested...up to 16"...seem to require less bullet weight and much higher velocity.
This is not to suggest that juggling variables won't make a particular bullet weight work in a particular barrel length. It might...but do you have the time and budget for that sort of experimentation?
Choose the primary purpose for your .300BLK and barrel length will fall in place. I'm with other posters...something in the 10" range with the proper twist is a proven commodity.
Since currently-available commercial ammo loads cover an astounding 110g to 240g weight range, the number of variables end up in the thousands.
We learned from testing so far this much:
That barrel lengths with decent reliability [i.e., work most of the time] for that broad range of bullet weights are shorter in OAL. The longer barrels I've tested...up to 16"...seem to require less bullet weight and much higher velocity.
This is not to suggest that juggling variables won't make a particular bullet weight work in a particular barrel length. It might...but do you have the time and budget for that sort of experimentation?
Choose the primary purpose for your .300BLK and barrel length will fall in place. I'm with other posters...something in the 10" range with the proper twist is a proven commodity.
Zerodefect
member
Purpose of said rifle?
16" with .300blk makes no sense. 5.56 and 6.8 do that just fine. .300blk is for a 7.5" barrel SBR, Pistol, or Silencer application.
But to answer your question, I guess a 14.5 with a pinned/welded flash hider would be fine.
16" with .300blk makes no sense. 5.56 and 6.8 do that just fine. .300blk is for a 7.5" barrel SBR, Pistol, or Silencer application.
But to answer your question, I guess a 14.5 with a pinned/welded flash hider would be fine.
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Dudedog
Contributing Member
California, no can, no barrel shorter than 16. (hard to have fun here.....sigh)
Looking for a whole upper to do an easy change and still use 223. Just wanted a BCG so I would have another, you can never have to many toys
Primary use = fun
Lots of .223 brass to use to make 300BK
Don't really have bullet weight in mind will try lots!
I know with heay bullets its like a mag pistol round H110, 4227, 1680 maybe.
Appreciate the don't get this one. You never know about those most of the until it's to late.
Maybe when I retire I can move to a "free" state, it's on my list of retirement goals.
Looking for a whole upper to do an easy change and still use 223. Just wanted a BCG so I would have another, you can never have to many toys
Primary use = fun
Lots of .223 brass to use to make 300BK
Don't really have bullet weight in mind will try lots!
I know with heay bullets its like a mag pistol round H110, 4227, 1680 maybe.
Appreciate the don't get this one. You never know about those most of the until it's to late.
Maybe when I retire I can move to a "free" state, it's on my list of retirement goals.
newfalguy101
Member
I am probably going to order one from Surplus Arms and Ammo, the upper is Aero Precision ( rebranded as SAA ) and can be had with Magpull furniture.
I ordered one in .223 and am very happy with it.
I ordered one in .223 and am very happy with it.
I have both a 16" and 18" 300 BLK uppers and the difference in velocity between the two is negligible.
If you are planning on some kind of muzzle device, the 18" barrel starts to get less handy with a muzzle device installed on it.
The only advantages I see for blackout are that it supresses well and excels in a short barrel. Not trying to rain on your parade, but you may want to look at a different cartridge such as 277 wolverine or 6.8spc if you are going to run a 16+.
Just be glad you can still buy some semblance of an AR in California. I rely completely on the rifles I bought before CT's ban or I have to buy pre 1994 rifles to have one! But we do get cans and full auto only machine guns.
Just be glad you can still buy some semblance of an AR in California. I rely completely on the rifles I bought before CT's ban or I have to buy pre 1994 rifles to have one! But we do get cans and full auto only machine guns.
Ibmikey
Member
My 300 Blackout rifles are in lengths of 8", 12 1/2", (2) in 16" and a single shot Handi Rifle 16". The cartridge is fun and super easy to reload, Brownells has really good CMMG barrels for $150, PSA often has complete uppers for 3-4 hundred. I do not go cheap on my rifles as quality parts provide quality builds but I'm sure you can find most any price range in the Shotgun News. Sixteen inches is about the max I would want for this cartridge that holds about a third less powder than a .223 and three times the bullet weight.
I hope not because I have two 14.5 inch barrel rifles (w/pinned brakes) in the state right now. Unless the law changed last year and I didn't know about it. The pining work was done in state by a reputable smith. And the definition of a SBR is Federal and not State. But I'm sure a state like CA can/will make it's own definition.
300Blk is the most fun as a pistol or SBR. But all poster are giving spot on advice. At 18 inches you should be looking at a cartridge like 6.8 SPC.
This Article might be helpful.
http://www.automagtic.com/300-blackout
B!ngoFuelUSN
Member
I'm sure Dudedog meant barrel length as measured from the bolt face to the end of the barrel or muzzle device. That is the way the barrel length will be measured if there is ever an official test of the firearm. You can have a 10" barrel here in CA if you have a 6" pinned muzzle device attached.
I believe the root of the rule lies in the ability to conceal, not in performance.
B
Ibmikey
Member
I have an eight inch 300 Blackout pistol and find it quite lacking in the concealment department ( not that I would even try) and less so with the 12.5" uppers in .223 and 300 Blackout that I have for it. After shooting it a few times I submitted paperwork to ATF as a SBR. The 300 is a hoot out of the short barrels and supersonic levels..I leave the suppressed stuff for others to play with as to me this is just another fun toy.
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Dudedog
Contributing Member
Don't try to assume there is any logic behing CA gun laws.
Sounds like 16 is the way to go.
I might be mistaken but I thought the overall had to be 16"
I want good parts, but to get started I did not want to get carried away with furniture. I was hopeing I might be able to find one for between $350 - $500.
Will check the places listed above.
Sounds like 16 is the way to go.
I might be mistaken but I thought the overall had to be 16"
I want good parts, but to get started I did not want to get carried away with furniture. I was hopeing I might be able to find one for between $350 - $500.
Will check the places listed above.
MachIVshooter
Member
If you're not able to run short barrels and suppressors, the .300 BLK doesn't make a lot of sense. It'd be like opting for an expensive multi-fuel vehicle that runs best on diesel in a location where diesel is not available.
Under those constraints, the 7.62x39mm uppers make more sense. The round is a little peppier and a whole lot cheaper. I'm no x39 fan, but as .30 cal options in the AR-15 platform go, it makes a lot more sense for a blaster in a locale where suppressor and SBR are a no-go, since the .300 BLK was specifically designed for suppressed SBR.
Under those constraints, the 7.62x39mm uppers make more sense. The round is a little peppier and a whole lot cheaper. I'm no x39 fan, but as .30 cal options in the AR-15 platform go, it makes a lot more sense for a blaster in a locale where suppressor and SBR are a no-go, since the .300 BLK was specifically designed for suppressed SBR.
You are correct. As long as the shorter barrels have "permanently attached" muzzle devices that equal to 16 inchs. Usually pined and welded on. Just like you can own a standard magazine body, as long as it is "permanently block" at 10 rounds. It considered a 10 round mag.
The over all barrel length is determined by closing the bolt and inserting a rod down the barrel. they make a mark at the end of the barrel and then measure the rod to that mark. You can go 10 inch barrel with a 6 inch brake, or 14.5 with at 1.5. or any combination, as long as it equals 16 inches. And the key word is "permanently attached" It go a little longer, about 16 1/8 inch just to be on the safe side. If you are buying a complete upper and going this route, the manufacture will consider this for you.
bangswitch
Member
For target shooting, if you're not going to shoot subs, the two best weights are 125 and 155. You'll get a bit over 2100 fps with 125's and around 2000 fps with 155's. I use the green tip Nosler 125's and Sierra Palma MK 155's. You can load either bullet using H110, W296, LilGun and A1680.
The 155's have enough energy to shoot silhouettes at 300 yards. You can cut and form your own brass, but there are 'net sellers that have reformed once-fired LC brass for about $.15-.17 per case for orders of 500 or more. Still cheap and saves a lot of work.
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Dudedog
Contributing Member
Yes 16" overall, I said barrel but really meant the whole assembly if the brake is permenant. (got to double/triple check the laws to be sure.)
I understand the limits of 300 Blackout, but 223 brass is cheap/(free).
As an example the indoor range I shoot at allows rifles, but less than .27 cal you must use thier ammo. 300 BLK I can load my own and shoot it at the indoor range if I want to. (indoor range is 15min from home, outdoor range is close to a two hour round trip), so I could easly practice with the rifle if I wanted to while shooting my pistols. If I decide to hunt I have a Savage 99 in .308 and a 700BDL in 7 mag if I need something more. In CAL I can only have 10 rounds anyway. 7.62 by 39 has more zip but brass is much harder to come by. I will checkout Surplus arms and Ammo and see what they have.
I understand the limits of 300 Blackout, but 223 brass is cheap/(free).
As an example the indoor range I shoot at allows rifles, but less than .27 cal you must use thier ammo. 300 BLK I can load my own and shoot it at the indoor range if I want to. (indoor range is 15min from home, outdoor range is close to a two hour round trip), so I could easly practice with the rifle if I wanted to while shooting my pistols. If I decide to hunt I have a Savage 99 in .308 and a 700BDL in 7 mag if I need something more. In CAL I can only have 10 rounds anyway. 7.62 by 39 has more zip but brass is much harder to come by. I will checkout Surplus arms and Ammo and see what they have.
RustyShackelford
member
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The Dark Side....
I'm left handed, so if I purchased a new AR/M4 .300aacblackout upper, Id go with www.StagArms.com . They sell decent rifles so I'm not unhappy with the choice, .
I'm left handed, so if I purchased a new AR/M4 .300aacblackout upper, Id go with www.StagArms.com . They sell decent rifles so I'm not unhappy with the choice,
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MachIVshooter
Member
If you have a mill or decent drill press with a good depth stop, .300 BLK brass is easy.
I just center one of these 2" mini chucks under the quill in my vise:
then insert a .300 BLK case and set the depth. I can cut down 100 .223 cases in less than 20 minutes, and using a sharp, high quality cutter, there is little/no need to deburr. There's also no need to trim after forming; I quickly discovered that if I cut the brass to 1.355", it will be within a thou of that after forming.
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Dudedog
Contributing Member
My dad used to have an M1 carbine in 30 Cal. (sold it to my cousin, sigh) I liked the gun and thought it was fun to shoot even though it did not have a lot of power. Think 300 BLK would be as much fun, same idea with a little more power. Will check out stag arms as well.
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