.357 magnum vs .40

[BluedRevolver]

I was compiling data from different loads, and came up with this:

.40S&W (Doubletap): .40 caliber bullet; 155 gr. 1300 fps; 528 ft. lbs
.357 Magnum (Federal): .357 caliber bullet, 158 gr. 1240 fps; 539 ft lbs


They seem to be similar, with the .40 having a bigger diameter. Am I looking at this wrong, or does this .40 load equal or surpass a moderately loaded 158 grain .357 Magnum?

 

[Alaska444]

There are a lot of different loads for both calibers but I suspect that the .357 in max loads exceeds the .40.

Heavy 357 Magnum Ammo - 125 gr. J.H.C. (1,700fps/M.E. 802 ft. lbs.) - 20 Round Box

Our 357 mag. ammo adds more power than ever before to the 357 mag. This ammo is safe to shoot in ANY all steel 357 revolver - this includes J frames. This ammo is no harder on your gun than any other normal 357 ammo. Please don't phone us and ask if this ammo is safe in your gun. It is, providing your gun is in safe condition for use with any normal 357 ammo.

http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=103

Heavy .40 Smith & Wesson +P Ammo - 155 gr. Jacketed Hollow Point(1,300 fps/M.E. 582 ft. lbs.) - 20 Bullet Box

All Buffalo Bore Heavy 40 S&W +P loads use flash suppressed powders that give high velocities at low pressures. Since over 90% of all human shootings in the USA happen in low light, we believe that flash suppressed powders are a potentially life saving advantage - you don't want to be blind after you fire one shot in a life threatening, high stress situation.

http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=115

 

[7mmb]

All else being equal the larger caliber wins. You are comparing a light for cartridge bullet with a heavy for cartridge bullet though. In 357 the go to SD bullet is the 125 grain JHP. That is the round all other handgun loads are compared to, for good reason.

 

[BluedRevolver]

yes, the .357 I listed is a rather moderately loaded, but it's actually a rather typical self defense load.

 

[918v]

I read the CHP found the .40 did better than the .357 against assailants and automobiles in their use.

 

[sixgunner455]

That's a pretty maxed-out load for the .40, and yes, it's knocking on the door of what the .357 can do. But only just. The .357 can go a lot further than what that Federal load suggests. In one manual I have, the 2400 starting load for a .357 Magnum 158gr JHP is quite a bit hotter than that Federal load, and I'm not sure I'd want to shoot the max load. Not with *my* wrist.

SD is another thing to think about. A .40 bullet is only a little bit wider than a .357 bullet. If the bullets weight the same, the .357 bullet must be longer than the .40. Think about that - what flies better, a long missile or a short one? In almost every case, the long missile flies better, and long bullets may penetrate better, too.

Just something to think about.

 

[tubeshooter]

It's not really an apples-to-apples comparison, as stated.

What are the Double Tap numbers for .357? I'm seeing the "lowly" 110 grain yielding ~620 ft./lbs. from a 4" barrel (the comparison length I think is fair vs. 40-cal guns).

 

[MCgunner]

All else being equal the larger caliber wins. You are comparing a light for cartridge bullet with a heavy for cartridge bullet though. In 357 the go to SD bullet is the 125 grain JHP.

I prefer a 140 Speer and I load it to 600 ft lbs from a 3" gun. It's very accurate, better ballistics in a short barrel than can be gotten from the lighter 125 grain stuff, which really need at least 4" of barrel. The 140 Speer a VERY accurate bullet, works well in my .38s as well, though I sorta prefer 158 grains in .38 special.

I prefer a 165 cast gas checked SWC at 1470 FPS from a 6.5" barrel for hog hunting. I wouldn't hunt hogs with .40, a little light IMHO and more range limited. ,357 offers more energy, better SD, for medium game and does a good job. I've taken hogs to 60 yards with it. I also have a pet 180 XTP hunting load, 1402 fps/785 ft lbs from my 6.5" Blackhawk. That load is 5" high at 50 for a 100 yard zero, pretty flat shooting for a standard handgun round.

Nothing wrong with the .40 for self defense, I just prefer .357 as a caliber, much more versatility and I'm sorta a revolver preference kinda guy. Head to head, the 10mm is a better comparison to .357, can match energies of the hottest .357s with a bigger bullet, though I'm not sure if it can match the heavy .357's sectional densities, which is important for penetration on game. I haven't looked at the 200+ grain .40 caliber stuff. It's probably close enough, though.

But, I'll trump your 10 with a .44 magnum.

 

[2zulu1]

Kinetic energy comparisons in service calibers is a non issue, but revolver bullets have a more aggressive construction because there isn't a compromise to achieve reliable feeding. The sectional density of the 357/158gr compares heads up with 40/200gr and 158gr Gold Dots and XTPs typically penetrate 19"-20" of soft tissue.

Before the 125gr SJHPs were developed, we carried 158gr SJHPs and the 158s had a superb incapacitation reputation, in fact, many depts/agencies in the state I worked didn't change over to the 125s.

I know of no 10mm ammunition that matches up to 357mag 180 grain Swift A-frame or Nosler Partition bullets.

 

[MachIVshooter]

They seem to be similar, with the .40 having a bigger diameter. Am I looking at this wrong, or does this .40 load equal or surpass a moderately loaded 158 grain .357 Magnum?

Those are the key words here. Full power .357 magnum exceeds .40 S&W by quite a bit. The 10mm auto is the .357's ballistic twin, with both topping out around 800 FPE in normal (5"-6") barrel lengths.

 

[ku4hx]

If you're going to claim superiority of one unit or another, you have to compare the best each has to offer. If you don't do that you can alter your variables pretty much endlessly and never reach a conclusion.

Based solely on the metrics, the .357 Magnum has the edge. The raison d'etre for the 357 Sig is to create a 357 magnum-like load in a semi auto platform, with one specific bullet weight, since the wheelgun's "superiority" was well know.

If you want to get full .357 Magnum power in a semi auto using a 40 caliber bullet, go to the 10mm using a 135 grain bullet. My PACT2 clocks a max load for that round at 1,510 fps in my Gen2 Glock 20. I can break 1,450 fps with a 150 grain bullet. The difference between those and commensurate 357 Magnum loads is inconsequential. And I can carry 16 rounds of either.

 

[Thompsoncustom]

I remember on swampfoxes website for the max loads .357 was 1900fps/1000ft.lbs and the 10mm was in the 700 to 800 range energy, don't remember what the .40 was but it wasn't even close to the others.

 

[hardluk1]

These comparisons are mainly worthless if you can't hit your target. If you look at all the staes tropper , sheriffs dept. and police you will find all of the typical cartidges out there Antbody really care what califonia does?? Give a leo 15 rounds in a mag or 6 in a revolver and guess which they will pick most times reguardless of caliber.

Maybe the 40 should be compared to the 125gr 357 sig no the 185gr 45acp+P.

I hunt with 357mag or 44mag and carry a 9mm 124gr +P. Learn to hit your target.

 

[CDW4ME]

Here is a comparison between guns that might be used for CC.

I previously owned a Ruger Speed Six with 2 3/4 inch barrel (fortunately I recorded chrono data before I sold it).

Ruger Speed Six with Federal 125 gr. JHP (full magnum loading) @ 1,248 fps / 432# KE

Glock 27 (40 S&W) with Speer Gold Dot 155 gr. @ 1,134 fps / 442# KE
Glock 27 (40 S&W) with Ranger T 165 gr. @ 1,116 fps / 456# KE

The Glock has been completely reliable, holds 4 more rounds than the revolver, launches a bigger diameter bullet and produces a little more KE (power)

 

[MachIVshooter]

I remember on swampfoxes website for the max loads .357 was 1900fps/1000ft.lbs

That's very optimistic for a 5" or 6" gun. Maybe one could get that with 110 grainers, but with 125 I doubt it. Buffalo Bore's hot 125 grain load is getting 1,700 FPS from a 6" gun.