.380's?

[Hunter125]

I had my eye on the TCP and liked the trigger a lot better than the other .380's I had handled. Then I saw this and do not have my eye on it anymore. Not sure if this cropped up before this guy published his video and people are just dealing with it, or not, but it's enough to keep me from spending money on a gun I'm not sure would fire every time.
My dad has a PPK that he refuses to send in to Smith for some reason, so he's just not using it, but he likes it. It is a jam-o-matic and the only thing he can get to cycle reliably in it is the Winchester Cleans. I like the style of a PPK, but do not like his gun because of this. I have not shot a Bersa, but have been told they will eat anything you put in them. I will probably have a Bersa Thunder Plus in my collection sometime soon.

 

[ESQJJH]

searcher451 The Walther PPK, in the USA (Interarms/Ranger)

Dear Searcher 451:

Your statement that " The Walther PPK, in the USA made by (Interarms/Ranger)" is correct.

Unfortunately, Interarms lost the contract several years ago, and Smith and Wesson now manufactures these guns in the US. The quality has greatly diminished.

Who knows, maybe they just wanted to kill off one of their biggest competitors. I have never bought 2 of the same guns and they were both defective.

How can you begin producing that many defective guns of a particular type that have been in production for over 60 years?

They also recently had a Smith & Wesson recall on the Walthers that they needed to add another part, because " the gun may suddenly discharge for no reason". Now that pumps up your confidence.

Jay

 

[1chemist]

+1 for the Bersa Thunder .380 CC.
I think the Bersas are some of the most undervalued guns on the market.

The thing is so thin, it practically disappears against my hip. But it's big enough for me to grab reliably without risking slide bite. The fixed barrel makes it amazingly accurate.

I know that on paper blowbacks are supposed to be harsher in recoil than locked breeches, but for some reason the worst-recoiling .380 I own is an old locked-breech Llama, while the Bersa is almost as benign to shoot as my big, heavy, locked-breech ATI MS380.

 

[papaairbear]

Look at the Kahr for all the reasons already mentioned. The sights are very quick to acquire and line up, the trigger is the smoothest I've used in a factory gun, it's unbelievably accurate, and it has chambered and fired every round I've put through it,and each case has been ejected without problem - save for one when I left my thumb on the slide stop. And finally, it conceals easily and discretly. I put some Decal Grips on it (I used sand, but you can get rubber) and a holster by Uncle George.
http://www.decalgrip.com/
http://unclegeorgeswalletholster.com/kahr380holster.aspx

 

[zxcvbob]

Tiny lightweight .380's are great for carrying, and terrible for shooting. I have one, and I hate practicing with it. The same gun in a .32 would probably be a lot better; easier to shoot, faster back on target, slightly lighter, and holds one extra cartridge.

 

[MedWheeler]

zxcvbob:

Tiny lightweight .380's are great for carrying, and terrible for shooting. I have one, and I hate practicing with it. The same gun in a .32 would probably be a lot better; easier to shoot, faster back on target, slightly lighter, and holds one extra cartridge.

Pretty much sums up my thinking when I went with the Kel-Tec P32 over the P380 (for those rare occasions when carry of my PF-9 isn't feasible.) I had/have a Grendel P-10 and it's kind of unpleasant to spend any time firing, and it's bigger and heavier than the P380. I do also have a Bersa Thunder .380, which is great to spend time shooting. It was my EDC (on the belt) for a year or so, until I stumbled across the PF-9.

 

[Cactus Jack Arizona]

If you are truly wanting a pocket pistol, then my vote would be for the Sig P238. It's a bit expensive, but it comes with actual Tritium night sights. That alone is enough for me to never consider the other offerings.

 

[Smokey in PHX]

The .380 is kind of an odd bird in my opinion as it is small but satisfactory in power for what it was designed. The new ones are kind of the rage now even though they are not a pleasure to shoot due to recoil and the small grips. Everyone seems to be jumping on these as some great sensation because of the light weight and smaller size. Even though the J fram is slightlyy heavier, slightly larger, and more powerful.

However I too have purchased a couple of these after firing most of the available models. I bought the S&W which has functioned flawlessly and an LCP that has performed as well as the S&W. The LCP is the one I carry all the time and has replaced the PPK/S that I have carried for so many years and has never ever malfunctioned.

For a small gun they work and give you some opportunity of protection in the event of some hostle situation.

 

[Rule3]

I couldn't disagree more with the recommendations for a Sig 238.

It's not an ideal pocket pistol based on it's size and the fact that it's a single action......requiring "cocked & locked" carry.

While it may ride quite well in someones pocket, it is the same size as many of the small 9mm pistols. In essence, you are carrying a weaker caliber in the same sized package. The 238 is not in the same size class as the LCP, P3at or Kahr P380. It is closer in size to the Kahr PM9/CM9, Ruger LC9 and several other 9mm pistols.

While "cocked & locked" is fine when carried IWB/OWB, inside a pants pocket is a whole 'nother world of lint and debris. If you choose a single action, exposed hammer semi auto you need to be diligent about checking for lint/etc getting inside. Not to mention the issues with drawing an exposed hammer pistol from inside a pants pocket.

I've owned nearly two dozen .380's and currently have about a dozen. When I chose to carry a .380 it is either a Kahr P380 (the best polymer frame .380 IMHO) or a Ruger LCP (the best value in a .380).

I agree and I really like Sigs. The main issue is that it is a single action without a grip safety, so as mention a cocked and locked and if the thumb safety moves???????

I have and like the Ruger, also have the KT which I bough before Ruger copied it. The Ruger is a much nicer looking gun fit and finish . Other than that they shoot pretty much the same.

 

[doorman]

I traded out a Kahr P45 last May for a S & W Bodyguard .380. My first .380 and I love it.
Because:
Nice weight
Laser sight
Real Pistol Sights
Second strike capable (but have not needed this to date).
Slide locks back on last round.
One of the most accurate CCW I ever shot. With irons or laser.
To date, about 500 rounds through it, no failures of any sort.
Ended up paying $309.

 

[mdauben]

If you are truly wanting a pocket pistol, then my vote would be for the Sig P238. It's a bit expensive, but it comes with actual Tritium night sights. That alone is enough for me to never consider the other offerings.

The Kahr P380 is also available with night sights. I'm looking to pick up a pocket 380 some time soon, and these two were my short list. I've pretty much decided on the P380 simply becuase of its "Glock like" manual of arms (my other defensive pistols are all Glocks). If I was a 1911 guy, I would probably opt for the single action P238.

They are both a little larger and heavier than the Ruger, S&W or Kel-Tec .380s, but they have far supperior sights and are easier to handle (IMO) than the smaller 380's.

 

[Warp]

IMO a J-frame size snub nose .38spl +P is head and shoulders above a micro pocket auto in .380 or smaller. I came to this conclusion based on personal experience. I had and sold a P3AT and a P32. My S&W 642 isn't going ANYWHERE, though.

 

[mdauben]

IMO a J-frame size snub nose .38spl +P is head and shoulders above a micro pocket auto in .380 or smaller.

I don't know about "head and shoulders" but I would agree that the .38 +P is better than a standard pressure .380. Its also harder to control in a small frame pistol and even an alloy j-frame is noticeably bigger/heavier than a polymer .380. A better comparison IMO to the S&W 642 would be the Kahr PM9, which is much closer in size and weight to the j-frame and uses an even more effective cartridge.

Its all a matter of where you draw the line in the size/power trade-off. If you accept a little more size (642) for a little more power (.38 +P), why not a little more, and a little more, and pretty soon you're CC'ing a Glock 20.

 

[heeler]

I shoot my Diamondback 380 and my newly aquired LCP far better than I do my Smith J frame.
And with less discomfort to boot.
And now that the PM9 has come up in the subject line I shoot it far better than all of the above.
And by a wide margin at that.
Still I find the micro 380's a bit easier to pocket carry over the J frames due to over all length of the J frame.

 

[shootingthebreeze]

I was going to give a range brief on the Kahr P380-excellent performance, cycled and fired every time, suprisingly accurate and extremely comfortable to fire-fired 50 rounds the first time, 100 the second, another 50 and comfort level was the same with 100 rounds at a time.
Easy to take apart and clean. Easy to re assemble.
Carrying is perfect. Overall a nice dependable little handgun.

 

[zxcvbob]

I can fire 2 or 3 shots remarkably well with my P3AT, considering the almost-nonexistent front sight. After that, the recoil starts to get to me and the group opens way up. I don't know if that would happen under stress or not (but how many times am I likely to need to use a mousegun at 50 feet?) I've never tried shooting it rapid-fire, just slow and timed.

CZ-82 loaded with Silver Bear JHP's is my favorite, but I don't have an appropriate holster for it yet. So meanwhile I carry a 4" service revolver; it carries very well and I'm confident with it.

 

[chez323]

I have a Sig P230, it's light, handy, easily carried/concealed and accurate. Great little gun!

 

[Draskuul]

I had a chance to try out an LCP recently. While I had considered one before, I likely wouldn't buy one after that experience.

I pulled the trigger back so far without breaking that I thought I had somehow forgotten to rack the slide. It didn't break until it hit maximum pull and was almost touching the frame. It then took almost full movement forward to reset.

After two shots, it basically 'climbed' out of my hand, and I had to reset my grip on it. Granted it was 103 degrees and 75% humidity so sweat was a factor, but I live in San Antonio, so this would be a very real-world scenario.

That said, the closest comparably-sized firearm I've shot was a .25 ACP Raven. Unlike the Raven, I didn't have to worry about keeping my hand out of the slide's path, and I was able to get what felt like a normal grip and use of the trigger finger.

With some wraparound grips to add some tack I could possibly live with the trigger. I'd like to find an alternative, though.

 

[heeler]

I bought a brand new LCP last week and was very impressed with it.
I took it out of the box,cleaned it,relubed it,and racked the slide about 200 times.
I took it to the range and fired 15 rounds of five different types of fmj ammo for a total of 75 rounds.
There was not one issue with it.
It fed every round perfectly as well as fired and ejected them perfectly.
All that without a hitch and better yet I only paid $239.95 for it.
Hell I should have bought both of them the dealer had if I had known how smooth these little jewels were.
The other one was gone the next day.
True it does not have the sights my Diamondback has and the trigger is long but I adjusted to it quick enough and after a couple of magazines I even had the sights down for five yard shots.
A great and amazing little pistol.
If I can find another one at that price I am buying it.

 

[Nushif]

I compared the Ruger, Taurus and Keltec the other day for when I start my desk job.

Hands down the TCP felt the best in the hand and had the nicest trigger. As for funtion ... I have seen the same mixed reports copied and pasted from all over the internet, claimed as first hand experience every time, of course.

Ultimately it's like any other pistol. See which one feels best and test it for functionality, then shoot and carry it.

Edit:

It does crack me up every time though when people post pics of their OWB holsters and carry rigs, with their compact pistols in a mousegun thread claiming they are the better option.
Remember ... Mousegun. Not compact, not 1911, not Beretta 92 discussion. This is about a gun you stuff in a well fitted suit pocket and carry all day at work, when your customer base or your coworkers are scared of guns.
As much as I like the PP style pistols ... They are not pocket pistols. Neither is an Officer size 1911, neither is the subcompact PX4, neither is a service revolver.
Alright. I am done ranting. 8)

 

[heeler]

No kidding Nushif.
Hey I picked up a Fobus paddle holster for $25.00 for the LCP and with my pocket T shirt hanging over it you cant even tell there is a gun on me.
I did order a leather RKBA pocket holster last week for it too.

 

[The_Armed_Therapist]

If we're sticking with the smallest of .380s, then I would have to say that the Kahr P380 is a darn good selection. They are a hundred or two more than the LCP, P3A-T, Bodyguard, and TCP, but just as small and more mechanically-sound, easier to shoot, with usable sights.

 

[The_Armed_Therapist]

Also, the Sig P238 is superior to the Ruger, Kel-Tec, S&W, and Taurus... another fantastic choice! The Sig and the Kahr are just as small, but much better. If you choose one of the others, clean them even more often and only use the best ammo.

 

[Warp]

It does crack me up every time though when people post pics of their OWB holsters and carry rigs, with their compact pistols in a mousegun thread claiming they are the better option.
Remember ... Mousegun. Not compact, not 1911, not Beretta 92 discussion. This is about a gun you stuff in a well fitted suit pocket and carry all day at work, when your customer base or your coworkers are scared of guns.

There is always a way to carry a "gun" and not a "mouse gun". I've carried that 642 where it was against policy (but legal), to the beach, to the gym, while running, etc. IMO it is worth taking the slightest bit of effort to avoid having to carry a piddly little "mouse gun" (and I used to own both a P3AT and a P32...realized my mistake and sold them, though with the .380 performance was a problem)

 

[franco45]

I have wanted a Kahr P 380 for a while. I tried a DB380 and it was not reliable. I traded it for an LCP as a stopgap until I could get the money together for the Kahr. After adding a CT laser and Pearce mag extensions and having shot almost 500 trouble free rounds through it, I am no longer looking at the P380. I bought a CM9 instead. It's a great little pistol but my LCP still sees just as much duty as my CM9.