4 more years in Iraq

[Harve Curry]

On CNN headlines today I read that our goverment expects our soldiers to be in Iraq four more years. That would make this war 7 years? Also read our goverment has given up on a Democratic goverment there.

Our own Civil War was fought and resolved (mostly) in 4 years.
Our part in WWII was done in 4 years.
Every war since seems to have gone awry.

Maybe we should suspend Elk & deer season here and all go over there for the fall .

 

[Commissar Gribb]

On CNN headlines today

there's your first mistake.

Also read our goverment has given up on a Democratic goverment there.

what?

are you talking about afganistan?

 

[Harve Curry]

I believe both headlines were about Iraq.

CNN , I know, I know, but that's all we get on Dish out here. To cheap or broke to upgrade.

 

[Commissar Gribb]

because the govt in iraq has been surprising nearly everyone in it's ability to work- especially on the part of the religious fanatics that saturate that country and tend not to get along.

 

[dasmi]

Our part in WWII was done in 4 years.

So very wrong.
We were in Japan and Germany for DECADES after WWII, rebuilding, and maintaining a military presence. Iraq will be no different.

 

[javafiend]

We were in Japan and Germany for DECADES after WWII, rebuilding, and maintaining a military presence. Iraq will be no different.

In Japan and Germany the US and its allies did not fight a protracted guerilla war.

The US had a window of opportunity of about one year to win the peace in Iraq. Unfortunately it failed.

See How America Lost Iraq by Aaron Glantz, a reporter who arrived in Iraq just a few weeks after US troops entered Baghdad. Not embedded with the US military, he spent the next year travelling around the country and interviewing ordinary Iraqis.

See also Squandered Victory : The American Occupation and the Bungled Effort to Bring Democracy to Iraq by Larry Diamond. Diamond was personally asked by his former colleague Condoleezza Rice to serve as an advisor to the Coalition Provisional Authority.

See also Losing Iraq: Inside the Postwar Reconstruction Fiasco by David L. Phillips, former senior policy adviser to President Bush. Phillips sat on the State Department's Future of Iraq group.

Iraq is a lost cause. The insurgency is not, as Dick Cheney claims, in its' last throes," and there is no light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[FPrice]

On CNN headlines today I read that our goverment expects our soldiers to be in Iraq four more years.

I believe that the original story was that the Army was planning on being there for four more years, a worst case assumption they have to make in order to have men and material necessary if that happens. It's not that they expect this, but if they are trying not to get caught short if it happens this way.

Our own Civil War was fought and resolved (mostly) in 4 years.

It was fought for four years. It was not resolved in those four years, the occupation of the South went on for many years after that.

Our part in WWII was done in 4 years.

Again, the fighting went on for those four years, we occupied Germany and Japan for a good ten years afterwards.

Every war since seems to have gone awry.

EVERY war goes awry. One of Murphy's laws is, "No plan survives first contact with the enemy." Anyone who has the remotest knowledge of war understands this basic fact. And that is why you cannot announce a pull-out date until everything is settled. Something which John "Do You Know Who I Am" Kerry has conveniently forgot.

 

[powertoast]

> Iraq is a lost cause.

Not only that, there is no stinking way we will ever catch Saddam, much less ever see a free and open election in Iraq.

best regards

 

[walking arsenal]

there is no stinking way we will ever catch Saddam.

Don't read the news much do you.

the occupation of the South went on for many years after that.

Yup, us guys in the north are still trying to keep you southern guys from raising so much heck. It's a full time gig.

 

[Lone_Gunman]

I think the Army makes plans for a lot of things that never happen. I don't think anyone knows how long we will be in Iraq, but with support for the war now dwindled to about 35%, the Republicans better hope they figure a way out of it prior to 2008.

As far as I can tell, though, the Republicans are doing everything they can to lose in 2008 anyway.

As for free and open elections in Iraq, they will end when we leave.

 

[powertoast]

nevermind

 

[Lone_Gunman]

ok

 

[gc70]

Planning for the possibility of another 4 years in Iraq is a good thing. The US involvement in Iraq started with inadequate planning. I'm glad somebody learned from that experience and is now looking ahead at both best- and worst-case scenarios.

Iraq is a lost cause. The insurgency is not, as Dick Cheney claims, in its' last throes," and there is no light at the end of the tunnel.

Interesting. However, I don't think the conclusion is accurate because I don't see a monolithic insurgency in Iraq.

I think there are several insurgencies in Iraq that could persist or quickly disappear, depending on the flow of events.

There are clearly two insurgent groups operating in Iraq: Wahabbis, who want to achieve Islamic martyrdom, and; Baathists, who crave their lost power and wealth.

I suspect there are also other insurgent groups: Sunnis, who need to demonstrate they are not an inconsequential minority; Shiites generally, who need to show that there are limits to how much they will let the Sunnis act up; Shiites influenced by Iran, who want to tilt the new government toward theocracy; tribal groups, who are settling old scores in the confusion of other insurgent activity, and; probably other groups, similarly trying to advance their respective agendas.

 

[javafiend]

there is no stinking way we will ever catch Saddam,

Catching Saddam (like toppling his regime) was never much in doubt once the shooting started.

much less ever see a free and open election in Iraq.

By "free and open election" do you mean one secretly bought and paid for by Uncle Sam? See GET OUT THE VOTE: Did Washington try to manipulate Iraq’s election? by Seymour Hersh (The New Yorker, 7/25/2005).

 

[longhorngunman]

In 1944, the USMC lost nearly 7,000 men and had over 23,000 injured taking Iwo Jima in the pacific. This island was at it's biggest 4 miles long and two miles wide. The Marines had to kill nearly every Jap to take the island, over 22,000 of them, who nearly all fought to the death. All this so that our bombers wouldn't endure attack from Jap fighter planes based on the island and so those bombers could make emergency landing if need be. Took I think 36 days to take that island, there were 27 MOH winners there and of course this is where the famous flag-raising photograph was took. Those men thought, laughed, loved, lived, and had loving families just like our fallen in Iraq today. It was a price paid then and there is a price being paid now. People can debate strategy all they want, and Bush adm, and Pentagon's handling of the war. Which is very justified, there is no debate however to those who can see down to the fork in the road. Iraq MUST be won, or our future generations will pay a heavy price for our lack of commitment.

 

[PCGS65]

It's a catch .22, if we pull out and there's more terrorist attacks on our country everybody will scream why did we pull out? Lets go get them b---. I know saddam didn't cause 9/11 but he openly supports terrorisom on US and increased the award money for suicide terrorists family members from $10,000 to $25,000. The bottom line is freedom has never been free.

 

[rick_reno]

Our President knows what is best and it's important to support him. Remember, Saddam Hussein tried to assinate the Presidents father once and he was clearly on the path toward making and using weapons of mass destruction. It was important that we stop him.

 

[redneck2]

Our part in WWII was done in 4 years.

Dude...don't look now, but we still have troops in Germany and Japan. My nephew is there (Japan) right now.

We don't and shouldn't want to get out of Iraq. It's in the middle of the action. Personally, I hope we have military bases there for a long, long time. Everybody's worried about getting out. I'm worried about not staying.

 

[Sleeping Dog]

As I understand it, the general said the army was planning for 4 more years of occupation (or whatever it's called). I'm sure the army is also planning to pull out by christmas, planning to invade Iran, Syria, Sudan, and/or Canada. They make tons and tons of plans, just so they don't get surprised by some executive order. Then, of course, some surprise comes along.

Four more years? By my thinking we've been there since 1990, so that'll make it a pretty long war.

Regards.

 

[javafiend]

And that is why you cannot announce a pull-out date until everything is settled. Something which John "Do You Know Who I Am" Kerry has conveniently forgot.

Has Kerry called for the US to withdraw troops from Iraq? Please give details. (Hint: I bet you wont be able to.)

Our President knows what is best

Goober has quite a track record of misstatement and poor judgments.

“I would remind you that when the inspectors first went into Iraq and were denied—finally denied access, a report came out of the Atomic—the IAEA, that they were six months away from developing a weapon. I don’t know what more evidence we need.” George W. Bush, Sept. 7, 2002.

The truth, as always, is somewhat different than the fantasy world inhabited by Goober. 'There's never been a report like that issued from this agency,' said Mark Gwozdecky, the IAEA's chief spokesman."

and it's important to support him.

Support a man who listens only to what he wants hear? No, thanks.

Saddam...increased the award money for suicide terrorists family members from $10,000 to $25,000.

Sounds like Israel's problem, not ours.

The Marines had to kill nearly every Jap to take the island,

Those darn "Japs." Maybe we have to kill nearly every raghead in Iraq.

Newsflash: Japan declared war on the US. Iraq did not.

 

[beerslurpy]

None of these people objected to being generously paid to serve in peacetime.

 

[Waitone]

President: "Ok military leaders. We got ourselves a genuine crisis in <insert crisis of choice>. What can we do militarily about it?"

Military Leaders: "Gee, Boss. We never thought of that one. Give us 3 months and we'll get back to you."

Preceding conversation is one that no one in the federal government ever wants to take place. The military plans, full stop.

Yes, they have plans for 4 more years in Iraq. And I'll wager it has plans to be out in 1 year. I'll make a side bet it has plans for 25 year presence. I'll further bet the military has plans for a ground strike against Syria. I could go on but won't.

Anything coming out of CNN gets windage.

 

[Standing Wolf]

Land wars in Asia tend to be long wars.

 

[FPrice]

Has Kerry called for the US to withdraw troops from Iraq? Please give details. (Hint: I bet you wont be able to.)

Here's one. I'll let you find more.

From the first 2004 Presidential Debate:

MR. LEHRER: Speaking of your plan, new question, Senator Kerry. Two minutes.

Can you give us specifics in terms of a scenario, a timeline, et cetera, for ending U.S. -- major U.S. military involvement in Iraq?

SEN. KERRY: The timeline that I've set out -- and again, I want to correct the president because he's misled again this evening on what I've said.

I didn't say I would bring troops out in six months, I said if we do the things that I've set out and we are successful, we could begin to draw the troops down in six months."

 

[Lone_Gunman]

Land wars in Asia tend to be long wars.

And unsuccessful for the invader.