40 S&W

[Walkalong]

Good old fashioned W231 has good fill, is lightly colored, easy to see in the case, and 5.0 Grs under a coated 180 Gr TrFP bullet in .40 is very accurate with a nice short recoil impulse. Sport Pistol will do about the same velocity with 4.8 Grs. Both very accurate, and push a coated 180 Gr around 935ish to 950ish depending on barrel length/pistol.

Start low and work up.

If you want more pop/velocity, Silhouette or Longshot will give it to you, with more recoil.

 

[fxvr5]

If I recall Lyman states in the Hand loading guide that a 0.015" bullet setback can double the pressure.

Please find this information in the Lyman manual and indicate exactly where it is, what it says and what caliber it is for so we can confirm it - to avoid spreading possible BS on the internet.

 

[Jake Pearson]

Thank you everyone for all the advice. Titegroup doesn’t sound like the place to start for sure. Another question I am coming across. Is there a real need to trim straight wall cases? Do you guys trim straight walls? I’ve read a lot of people don’t bother doing it. Would trimming be more important for a semi compared to a revolver?

 

[ATLDave]

I don't trim straight-walled brass. It often shortens over time, as opposed to bottleneck brass, which nearly always stretches. A few people trim pistol brass just to try and maximize crimp consistency, but, especially if you don't seat and crimp in the same stage, then it doesn't seem to have much payoff.

 

[Texas10mm]

Please find this information in the Lyman manual and indicate exactly where it is, what it says and what caliber it is for so we can confirm it - to avoid spreading possible BS on the internet.

I know that Speer has posted that with NATO spec 124 gr 9mm that a very small setback can cause a huge pressure spike.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Is there a real need to trim straight wall cases? Do you guys trim straight walls? I’ve read a lot of people don’t bother doing it. Would trimming be more important for a semi compared to a revolver?

I think you'll find that more revolver shooters trim their brass than semi-auto shooters.

I do know a local shooter than trims his .40 brass...mostly once fired...but accuracy is his religion

 

[Bfh_auto]

Thank you everyone for all the advice. Titegroup doesn’t sound like the place to start for sure. Another question I am coming across. Is there a real need to trim straight wall cases? Do you guys trim straight walls? I’ve read a lot of people don’t bother doing it. Would trimming be more important for a semi compared to a revolver?

I trim one time, then don't worry about it. It doesn't take very long and gives me peace of mind. I can't shoot handguns well enough to tell if it makes a difference.

 

[Walkalong]

I never trim auto cases like .32 ACP, 9MM, .40 S&W, & .45 ACP.

I do trim revolver cases.

 

[fxvr5]

I know that Speer has posted that with NATO spec 124 gr 9mm that a very small setback can cause a huge pressure spike.

Yes, but again, we need details. How much setback and how much pressure increase?

 

[bbqreloader]

I have never for semi- 9, 40 45. I do for rifle.

 

[Dudedog]

Welcome to THR,
lots of great people here.

 

[Caplock]

I always questioned people complaining of snappy recoil in 40 cal. Then I loaded with Longshot.

 

[Jeff H]

Just adding to the group consensus here.

HP-38/Win231 is my go to powder for all non magnum handgun rounds. Just works well.

Never trim pistol rounds.

40S&W is a great cartridge to reload. Just ran 300 last night.

 

[Doublehelix]

I load a lot of .40 as I shoot it in USPSA regularly. I tried TiteGroup, but now use WST pretty much exclusively. I am surprised that I did not see anyone else mention WST yet as it is pretty popular in my neck of the woods for .40.

Welcome to THR!!!

 

[Texas10mm]

Yes, but again, we need details. How much setback and how much pressure increase?

Going off the top of my head it was 0.03" setback and a doubling of pressure.

 

[ATLDave]

Tex', I find your recollection to be very plausible, and quite consistent with my understanding of setback issues causing kabooms in high-pressure handgun cartridges. That said, I have labored in vain to find comparative pressure curves or PSI measurements that would quantify precisely how much extra pressure gets added (in a particular case - it's always going to be component-specific) for various changes in cartridge space. If you think you have a source that provides that kind of information, it would be a great service to post it here... not because you're currently spreading "internet BS" (again, what you're saying sounds generally correct to me), but because hard numbers are useful and elevate the discussion.

Any chance you could dig up that source?

 

[fxvr5]

Here is a chart published by Ramshot that shows the pressure in 9mm as a bullet is seated deeper, using Zip and 115 grain bullets. It shows a 20% increase in pressure when OAL is changed from 1.155" to 1.082" - a change of 0.073". See their page 3.

http://www.castpics.net/LoadData/Freebies/RM/Ramshot/Ramshot_3.pdf

Obviously, results will vary with different powders and bullet weights.

 

[ATLDave]

Note, too, that faster powders (and Titegroup certainly qualifies) show steeper pressure-rise in response to variances, and that 40 shows more case-space sensitivity than 9mm. Again, this all paints a picture of TG and 40 being a touchy combo.

 

[kcofohio]

I load a lot of .40 as I shoot it in USPSA regularly. I tried TiteGroup, but now use WST pretty much exclusively. I am surprised that I did not see anyone else mention WST yet as it is pretty popular in my neck of the woods for .40.

Welcome to THR!!!

I use WST in 45 and have been thinking about using it in 40. I didn't know it was popular for the 40. At least it should be good venture then.

 

[Texas10mm]

Tex', I find your recollection to be very plausible, and quite consistent with my understanding of setback issues causing kabooms in high-pressure handgun cartridges. That said, I have labored in vain to find comparative pressure curves or PSI measurements that would quantify precisely how much extra pressure gets added (in a particular case - it's always going to be component-specific) for various changes in cartridge space. If you think you have a source that provides that kind of information, it would be a great service to post it here... not because you're currently spreading "internet BS" (again, what you're saying sounds generally correct to me), but because hard numbers are useful and elevate the discussion.

Any chance you could dig up that source?

Ok, here it is. And the source is this forum.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/9mm-bullet-setback.814834/

From 28,000 CUP to 62,000 CUP with 0.03 of setback.

 

[Blue68f100]

#15 on the right column where the mark is.

I've see in another manual I just need to see if I can locate it. It may have been the 9 and not 40 but both are high pressure rounds the behave similar to pressure.

 

[ATLDave]

Awesome, thanks. I was using the search function, but the text was in a picture!

 

[Blue68f100]

There was another thread where I guy Kboomed a 40 cal with tight group. It referenced to the literature on setback/TG/40 cal? It was finally determined it was bullet setback that caused his Kboom.

Now this only happens when your at max load, where you don't have any wiggle room for variables.

When ever I load a MAX anything I'm weighing every charge and checking it twice against a second scale.

 

[Kevin Rohrer]

howdy all
I’m new here and very new to reloading. I wanted to ask if anyone loads for the 40 smith and if anyone uses titegroup to do so.

Yes.
No, I use Longshot.