.45 ACP Rifle: Useful tool or just fun toy?

[TMann]

One of our local gun forums has a Marlin Camp 45 for sale. These particular models are fairly rare, and are therefore a bit on the pricey side. (Currently asking $700.) I've read most of the discussions about the advantages/disadvantages of using 9mm ammo in a carbine. But what about a .45 carbine? Are the ballistics that different from a 5" barreled handgun? Is the .45 round a decent hunting round? Is the main advantage of this gun the it uses the same magazines as the 1911?

Just looking for opinions. Thanks.

TMann

 

[Kachok]

Um well the 45 can be usefull for some things, but even in a carbine length barrel I don't think of it as a suitable deer rifle, the pressure of the 45ACP is a little too low to hop it up much. Mabey with a compressed load of slower burning powder. Would be good for blasting coons and yotes at close range though.

 

[dprice3844444]

be a great home defense weapon,with limitations.it would pair up nicely with a 1911 for plinking.

 

[TurtlePhish]

Those things are awesome, just saying.

It's great for (expensive) plinking and perfect for home/camp defense. I don't know anything about accuracy, but they weren't made to be target rifles.

Just remember, some companies make 50rd 1911 drums...

 

[Swing]

Fun plinker. Maybe even an HD gun. Makes a great host gun for a suppressor.

I don't know about hunting, but it likely depends on what critters you are after.

 

[451 Detonics]

I enjoy shooting all pistol caliber carbines (PCCs). They make excellent urban HD and SD firearms and just about any caliber would work for survival hunting. I have owned and shot the Marlins in the past, not my favorite due to magazine capacity. However if you get lucky and can get one of the drums to work that would really boost it's value as a firearm for anything other than a range toy. I currently have a Mech Tech in 45 and when paired with my Taylor 28 round drum it is a great firearm. With a hot loaded 185 round like the CorBon DPX at 1250 out of the longer barrel it it a potent hunting caliber. Not legal in Indiana of course.

I also have PCCs in 9mm and 7.62X25...great firearms and fun to shoot. However even with the Marlin being hard to find I would have a tough time paying that much for one. for just $200 more you could buy an Auto Ordinance 1927 Deluxe that uses inexpensive 30 round sticks.

 

[Fremmer]

Sounds fun but id pass at that price and look at a beretta or a hi point for less.

 

[RGPM1A]

Camp 45s are a great plinking gun and perfect for pistol caliber carbine games involving pins or steel plates. They are very accurate at 50 to 75 yards and will feed any kind of bullet. The only thing you have to watch out for is that the buffer is sound, recoil spring is a 21 lb unit and action screws are tight or you WILL crack the stock.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

The .45 carbine does not gain much muzzle velocity over the pistol, like 950 fps versus 850 fps in a handgun length barrel, only a 24% increase in muzzle energy.

The 9mm carbines really don't give a spectacular increase in muzzle velocity and muzzle energy either.

The .357 does give spectacular increases in velocity (with some loads 400 fps more and double the energy in a 20" carbine barrel). Which to some make just 100 fps and 24% more energy less impressive.

 

[Dr.Rob]

SD and range toy. Great base for a supressed carbine. Might not be legal for hunting where you live, or may have too much magazine capacity for legal use.

$700 is pretty steep to me for a 7 shot 'rifle' with limited utility.

 

[SHR970]

What RGPMA1, Dr. Rob, and Carl Brown said with the following:
1) Good for 100 yards...150 is pushing it for most people. You have to compensate a lot for elevation past that quite a bit so your range estimation skills better be up to it.
2) Hunting in survival mode but not as a matter of course.
3) ABS plastic trigger assembly: doesn't play well wit hmany solvents (see 5).
4) Same annoying over travel and jerky trigger issues as Model 60.
5) Same annoying trigger issues as Model 60. If you have to reassemble it, you need several slave pins and 4 hands to get it back together w/o the factory assembly jig that is only available to the fasctory.

I own a Camp 9....same flavor but a little different. They're fun toys and are useful IF you understand and operate within their limitations. If you know how to shotgun sight a target; you can dance a 1 quart plastic bottle at 30-50 yards. Some good 10 round mags make it a little more appealing. If you already work with a 1911 single stack platform; you have a good one mag fits all combo. But for $700; some one is expecting a bit much for what they have. That is high even in California.

 

[jonnyc]

I have a No.4 Enfield rebarreled to .45ACP, and I load .45 Super for it. Great little 100 yard carbine.

 

[oldpapps]

I have one that I inherited from my dad.
What I have determined is my hand loads (5.6grain of 231, 200grain cast lead, mixed brass & CCI LP primers) will give 970fps and my 5 inch 1911 gives 846fps (average of 10 rounds taken at 10feet from the muzzles).
The increase from 5 inches to 16 1/2 inches with 231 powder isn't very much. I'm sure that with different powders this could be raised.

I have changed out the buffer and main spring.

The weapon is a pleasure to shoot and increases the usable range of the 45 round. As I live in the wilds of the Amarugia Highlands and I shoot my 100 yard range from my driveway, any 45 is not my 'go to' weapon. For home defense, in house, it would work as well as most.

As stated above, if you get it, check the buffer.

 

[sigpro]

I couple of years ago some one was making copies of the DeLise (sp?) carbine. Those where 45acp suppresed carbines, built on a Lee Enfield action. They used 1911 mags, I think, and the Suppresor was intergal. I think the Commandos and the OSS and SOE used them. Anyhow, someone was making Repos a while back. I think they made them with a fake suppressor. Gibbs might of been the company, whoever it was also sold a supprsed M3 SMG mock-up.

 

[Curator]

I have both a Mech Tech semi auto carbine and a No4 Lee Enfield Rheinfield conversion carbine in .45ACP. They are fun to shoot, accurate and effective out to 100 yards. While GI "hardball" gets up to about 850 fps in my 1911 Colt, the Mech Tech gets 1050+ from the same ammo. The Lee Enfield being a bolt gun, I load .45 Super loads: 255 gr. lead flat point at 1200 fps. This load is excellent for dealing with boar 'coons, coyotes, and the occasional shoat hog that roots on my side of the fence. Another nice thing is they are pretty quiet as compared to most center fire rifles. A real plus in rural-suburbia. Now if just I would spring for that suppresser----

 

[sigpro]

Fired one of those beretta Storm Crbines a a training a while back. Cant remember if it was a 9, a 40, or a 45. Wouldn't want to go to war with it, but it sure was fun to shoot!

 

[Furncliff]

But what about a .45 carbine? Are the ballistics that different from a 5" barreled handgun? Is the .45 round a decent hunting round? Is the main advantage of this gun the it uses the same magazines as the 1911?
Just looking for opinions. Thanks.




1. Only a little different. The .45acp is not known for gaining a lot of velocity from a longer barrel the way a .357 magnum gains velocity.

2.Depends, what are you planing to hunt and what range? And some states have restrictions on hunting with pistol calibers.

3. The camp 45 and Camp 9 both use pistol magazine. My Camp nine uses the S&W 59 series mags, I believe they go up to 20 rounds. The 45 uses 1911 magazines, I have a 1911 mag from Pro Mag that's 15 rounds, but it's not very reliable.

In my opinion $700 for a range toy is on the high side and the Hi Point carbines might float your boat for a a lot less $. They are reliable, ugly and fun to shoot. But .45acp could get expensive.

I like carbines, all mine are range toys for my daughter and I. I like my Camp 9, it wasn't too expensive and it's cheap to shoot and I like wood and steel guns. I like my Hi Point 4595, it's cheap to shoot because I reload .45 and it was an experiment that has proven itself fun to shoot. It would be a dandy HD weapon, it's been very reliable.

If you want to have fun at the range AND hunt...38/357 lever action carbine. Mine is a Marlin, fun to shoot at the range and high velocity rounds either home made or from Buffalo Bore are an option for deer at 100 yards.


Note: Check the trigger on the Camp .45 before you buy it. My Camp 9 was AWFULL and I had to send the trigger group away to be worked on (about $50). Don't shoot it until you check the buffer. Here's where to get a new buffer and recoil spring for the Camp 9 and 45.

http://www.blackjackbuffers.com/index.php?main_page=product_combo_info&products_id=874&zenid=37def1b4f3d31cd915340c833cce76cd

Good Luck

Tom

 

[pmlawson]

Furncliff -

Where did you send your trigger group away to be worked on??

I just finished a Camp 45 rebuild here in "California" - as someone put it. I have to install a bullet button yo make it legal.

 

[TXSWFAN]

Last time I checked, the Thompson was in .45 ACP and it works quite well.

 

[Elkins45]

Useful for plinking and antipersonnel duty.

 

[henschman]

It would be better than a handgun against people, but not nearly as effective as a rifle/carbine in an actual rifle caliber. It would definitely be cheaper on ammo, and cheaper to reload for, though.

 

[Ramone]

Am I the only one that's noticed that .45 ACP (and subsonic 9mm) out of a carbine barrel is remarkably quiet, and produces a really minimal muzzle flash?

Right there, it makes a 'go to' for use in confined spaces, and/or low light.

 

[MJ]

Ummmm what won't the .45 do? I had a .45 M1A1 for a time in the service and engaged target at 100 and 200 yards no problem. I can hit Arizona Ice Tea cans at 250 yards still today with 230g ball single shots. NOT A TOY.

 

[RPRNY]

Hmmmmm. Could the Marlin be modified to feed 45 Win Magnum? 260 gr JHP at 1500 sounds like a jolly good deer round to me. I'm sure I read about someone getting a Reising to stomach 45WMR. But of course I can't find it...

In any event, even a move to 45 Super (identical cartridge dimensions to 45ACP but based on stronger Detonics brass would deliver roughly 400 - 500 fps more with carbine loads. That would make for a fine brush gun! I just noticed there is a member posting above by someone with the .451Detonics handle, I am sure he can tell you much more about this than I can, but if the Marlin can handle 45 Super, that definitely makes this more than a range toy.

 

[dprice3844444]

http://mechtechsys.com/ makes a pistol cal carbines using glock/1911 lowers.somebody in the pistol section was selling glock lowers for 225.00 and below