5.7 x 28mm Frustration

[RadBear]

I purchased a Ruger 57 about 14 months ago with the intention of reloading due to the price of the ammo. And being new to reloading didn't heed the advice this cartridge is a PITA to reload. But being this far in I don't want to give up. (Yes I'm living the fallacy of sunk costs.)

Using the Lyman 60th manual as a guide I started with 4.7 GNs of long shot pushing 40GR polymer tipped factory second bullets out of AE cases using CCI #400 primers. Then I started having feed issues. I figured it was a lack of powder so I went up to 4.8GNs of long shot, then 4.9. Problem persisted Today I tested 5.0 - 5.3 GNs at the range. The 5.0 and 5.1s functioned flawlessly. Then I tried the 5.2 and 5.3 GNs and the pistol wouldn't cycle correctly and pick up the next round. I had to push on the rear of the slide for the pistol to go into battery and pick-up the round. I would fire but it wouldn't eject the case so I had to cycle manually. This sometimes resulted in the next round in the magazine pushing up on the bottom of the round trying to enter the chamber resulting in a complete jam that required me to eject the magazine and clear the pistol completely. The only time the gun cycled normally was on the last round in the magazine.

So hoping the power of magical thinking could save the day I went back to some 5.0 and 5.1GN rounds I had in my range bag. Same result.

Just to make sure I sprang for a box of range priced FN factory ammo. I fired one round and it didn't cycle. I ejected the spent case and the pistol operated normally.

I've had these problems with cases I've just soaked and washed to preserve the coating and cases I've tumbled.

I use the lee resizing, seating, and crimp dies. I trim the cases to manual length each reload. I use the Sheridan slotted checker to confirm length, shoulder and diameter.

I'm looking for suggestions on what other variables I can try to eliminate or adjust.

 

[Palladan44]

How many factory rounds have you put through it since you acquired it? Any troubles?

If factory ammo didn't cycle......sounds like its not a problem with your loads necessarily. But not enough pressure can still eject the spent round, but not pick up the next one. Is the breech face hanging up behind the case head? (Sounds like it is, meaning the rounds are probably not too low of pressure)
Is the firearm starting to get dirty and need a cleanup? (Does the 57 have a feed ramp that you can polish by hand to a mirror shine with some Mothers polish?)

When you get a hangup, you have to pay close attention to what is getting hung up.
Is the bullet nose hitting the "ceiling" of the chamber? With the long OAL of the 5.7 round, they can be predisposed to feed issues due to their length alone.
Magazine feed lips allowing for improper angle, magazine spring pressure too much or to little? Mag catch in wrong position, worn or defective? An angry Extractor claw.....dont get me started there..

I have an old friend who sprays his finished 5.7 loads with a dry-lubricant that leaves the rounds slippery, I think its Teflon based. I believe he begins this process after 4-5 loads and the factory coating begins to disappear.
This helps with FTFs if there is no other problems going on.

 

[RadBear]

Thanks for the tips. I've got some researching and experimenting to do. I attached a couple of pics I took today I forgot to attach to me original post.

I have only put a couple of hundred factory rounds through it. No feed problems with American Eagle and just one with the FN ammo I sprang for at the range today. I clean the 57 regularly.

I appreciate the suggestions!

 

[N555]

I never had a problem like that. But I was using an FN and small base dies.

 

[drband]

Sorry you’re having issues. I don’t load 5.7x28 but I have experience loading .22TCM and the issues are similar— and the cases are similar.

I also recommend a case lube (Hornady One-Shot Case Lube— not the cleaner!). It will not leave the cases sticky after the solvent flashes off. Helps with feeding and extraction.
Bullet seating depth is key. Are your polymer tipped bullets seated to the same depth as the factory polymer tipped bullets? (Just checking)
Make sure your Ruger extractor is in good shape. Not everything that comes from the factory is perfect!
If bullet seating and case lube is in play, the gun should run when clean, and probably when dirty. I make that comment because a less than perfect extractor can have difficulty removing spent cases from a dirty chamber. It’s maddening. A good extractor should handle the dirt just fine.

I can’t help you with the specific powder charge, but you might need to run near max for best cycling— based on my experience with .22TCM.

I’m sure it’s a blast to shoot—when it works. Hope you get it sorted out.

 

[Palladan44]

Thanks for the tips. I've got some researching and experimenting to do. I attached a couple of pics I took today I forgot to attach to me original post.

I have only put a couple of hundred factory rounds through it. No feed problems with American Eagle and just one with the FN ammo I sprang for at the range today. I clean the 57 regularly.

I appreciate the suggestions!

Disassemble the firearm, take the barrel only...
Plunk test rounds in the barrel. Do they drop in nice and freely flush with the case head?
It appears the brass is getting hung up in the chamber due to an issue with the brass dimensions. Or so it seems.

 

[Palladan44]

If they plunk in the barrel fine, check to see how the cases are sliding up and in the extractor/ breech face area. Slide a round up from underneath the dis-assembled slide. There should be some resistance, but not crazy like. New firearms can have tightness in this area.
And....the plunk test, rounds should drop in and fall to head space depth under their own weight. No pressure should be required to get them in. Also, note the mirror finished feed ramp ;-)

 

[Mark_Mark]

Ruger 57 reloader here.. my problem is SOLVED, no one solution but a series of steps to be successful

RcBS small base die
AA#5 powder
Range of bullets
Frankford Universal seating die kit
Noe “M” step expanders on a Lee Universal

getting that bullet straight like a Cowboy from True Grit is the most important thing ever. Also the seating depth.

I recommend 1st. Shooting a box of factory ammo. It should function FLAWLESSLY. If not, Call Ruger and tell them your gun is broken. DON’T mention you used reloads.

then use a Small Base RCBS die, and make dummy rounds for plunk and full mag feed test. Try different bullets

5.7x28 is not a beginner round to load. I’ve spent more money then buying a case of 5.7 ammo. But!!! was satisfying when done right. Good Luck, don’t forget to walk away, and research.

 

[Mark_Mark]

wish they made one of these for 5.7x28!!! would save a lot of frustration

 

[Mark_Mark]

^^ chamber seating die

 

[RadBear]

I’m sure it’s a blast to shoot—when it works. Hope you get it sorted out.[/QUOTE]

It is indeed a joy to shoot when it works.

 

[RadBear]

5.7x28 is not a beginner round to load. I’ve spent more money then buying a case of 5.7 ammo. But!!! was satisfying when done right. Good Luck, don’t forget to walk away, and research.

Yeah. When the first 20 rounds went down range w/o incident yesterday and I was drilling the X ring the joy and satisfaction were indescribable. And hence the crushing of my soul more complete when every following round failed to cycle.

 

[TEXASJD]

wish they made one of these for 5.7x28!!! would save a lot of frustration

View attachment 1134635

Wilson at one time would make you one if you sent them some of your fired brass I think.

 

[RadBear]

If they plunk in the barrel fine, check to see how the cases are sliding up and in the extractor/ breech face area. Slide a round up from underneath the dis-assembled slide. There should be some resistance, but not crazy like. New firearms can have tightness in this area.

And....the plunk test, rounds should drop in and fall to head space depth under their own weight. No pressure should be required to get them in. Also, note the mirror finished feed ramp ;-)

When I disassembled the pistol to take your advice I noticed I'd been neglecting the breech face during cleaning so the first order of business was to clean that up. I tried to test the tightness like you demonstrated but quickly discovered the 57 isn't configured like other semi-autos so I couldn't slide a case into the grove. I could set a case on the breech face only if I squeezed the opposite end of the extractor. No way to easily inspect the extractor w/o further disassembly that I'll need to research.

Also confirmed the 57 doesn't have a feed ramp, but the breech end of the barrel is chamfered w/ the bottom part of the barrel having a steeper angle, so I'll be polishing that instead.

 

[RadBear]

With the long OAL of the 5.7 round, they can be predisposed to feed issues due to their length alone.

I also checked the OAL of some handloads I had on hand and one is the same as the factory and the other was off by .010". Is it possible crimping causes the bullets to be squeezed up a little

 

[Mark_Mark]

Yeah. When the first 20 rounds went down range w/o incident yesterday and I was drilling the X ring the joy and satisfaction were indescribable. And hence the crushing of my soul more complete when every following round failed to cycle.

Get one of these! ! I don’t normally run them but 5.7 is to dangerous and sensitive

Don’t GIVE UP!!!! you are at the finish line!!!

 

[Mark_Mark]

or a Case Gauge, same difference

 

[Engineer1911]

RadBear, your photography skills are phenomenal, either improve your reloading knowledge for an impossible cartridge or or buy a 22 magnum semi-auto Kel-Tec. Send me a PM for a lead on a 5-gallon bucket of once fired brass.

 

[Slamfire]

I don't know about the Ruger pistol, but from what I have read the 5.7 X 28mm round comes from the factory with a polymer lubrication coating. I suspect it is sintered teflon. For the FN pistol, this coating is absolutely necessary as the coating breaks the friction between case and chamber. This might be the problem with what you are doing. I think it highly probable you no longer have a lubricant coating on the outside of your cases. This will create drag during extraction. Drag will slow down down the slide, messing up the timing of the mechanism. As you increase the charge level of the powder, you are increasing drag as the case is adhering to the chamber just that much more. I am surprised you have not pulled the cases apart.

What I recommend is that you do not remove any sizing lube from your resized cases. Leave the lube on. Prime with the lube on, dump powder and seat bullet with the lube on. And fire the cases lubricated and see if that corrects your function issues.

You can also oil the cases just as you insert them into the magazine. Put a drop of oil just at the junction of bullet and case. That oil will break the friction between case and chamber. Oil will incidentally be blown up the barrel, and squeezed back out of the chamber. The oil squeezed back out of the chamber will keep your slide rails lubricated real time. The oil blown up the tube will reduce leading and jacket fouling.

If it was not so messy shooting oiled cases, oilers might have not have gone on the ash heap of history.

 

[Mark_Mark]

RadBear, your photography skills are phenomenal, either improve your reloading knowledge for an impossible cartridge or or buy a 22 magnum semi-auto Kel-Tec. Send me a PM for a lead on a 5-gallon bucket of once fired brass.

WAIT WAIT… did you say a 5-gallon bucket of 5.7 brass???

 

[RadBear]

Success!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 31 reloaded 5.7x28 rounds on target!!!! Thanks for all the advice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[PWC]

Glad....but what did you finally do ?

 

[Mark_Mark]

Glad....but what did you finally do ?

yes?? shorten the COL?

 

[RadBear]

On the pistol front:

• I thoroughly cleaned the breech face
• Polished the flared portion of the barrel that serves as a feed ramp

On the cartridge front:

• Switched to Hornady OneShot lube
• Adjusted the sizing die down for a tighter shoulder
• Swearing. Lots of swearing.

 

[thump_rrr]

I've been reloading 5.7x28 for about 3 years now.
I don't do any cleaning to my brass.
I lubricate the brass with Hornady Unique before sizing.
I clean the primer pockets and pass a neck brush into the case.
Once the rounds are loaded I wipe the outside down with a microfiber cloth.

I couldn't push the shoulder back enough with my Lee sizing die.
I took 0.003" off the bottom of the die till I was able to get the shoulder where I wanted it.
I use a Hornady comparator with a .260 bushing to measure from the base to the datum line.