A gun shop episode that left a bad taste in my mouth...

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It bothers me that most have condemed the shop owner without hearing his side of the story........ I would have to hear his side before coming to a conclusion.
 
Unless that particular owner is on this board we will not hear his side. We can only go with what we are given. In this case what the OP reports is entirely believable, thus the conclusion.
Sometimes people post things that are not believable and get called on it. Maybe it didnt happen the way the OP said. Maybe he actually tried to get in the middle of an active deal. But I haven't seen anything that makes me think that.
 
The owner over reacted and there was no excuse for it no matter what some other owner/employees of gun shops say. He could have been polite about it. After all that is what he would expect from a customer. If it had been the other way around he probably would have asked you to leave and not return.

I was in a gun shop in Ft Worth a few years ago and asked about a certain firearm and an employee said that there was no such gun. I had seen it in a brochure I had gotten from the manufacturer and said so. The guy blew up and yelled "YES SIR, YES SIR, whatever you say is right". A few weeks later I returned with the very firearm I had asked about after purchasing it at another shop. The employee was obviously embarrassed and didn't want to talk to me and walked off in a huff.
 
It sounds like over-reaction, but I imagine the owner sees this all the time. He makes a lowball offer, knowing that a fair percentage of the time, the seller will come back later with more realistic expectations. His overreaction was to blow a gasket to a known customer. Like you, I would left, and never darkened his door again.

There is a reason the internet is killing mom and pop gunshops. Gunshops are dying out too frequently. It's not the prices on the internet; it's that mentality that you can do business with him or not at all. "My way or the highway" does not work in this economy. The internet has opened up resources to be able to research information and purchasing prices that an FFL would have dreamed about less than 20 years ago. Now, all of that information is in the hand of the consumer.

In this economy, no customer will allow themselves to be treated that way. It's a shame that a business owner can honestly think that his customer base won't melt away and disappear if they are treated this way. Don't becry the internet; look at your clerks and counter people and their people skills, or at your own.

I might have asked the owner directly, right then and there, if he minded if I ask her what she had and what she wants for it. A quick "What was she selling, do you mind if I look and make an offer?" Respect what he says, you are in his place of business, on his property. Being treated like some lowlife thug by a man with whom you have done business with, that is not part of the equation. You did the right thing - this guy needs to learn how to be an adult, and a modern business owner. Number 1 rule of business = Customers.
 
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It bothers me that most have condemed the shop owner without hearing his side of the story........ I would have to hear his side before coming to a conclusion.
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I believe the version as stated by the OP. Even if the story were "made up" or changed, what we are commenting on is the incident as presented.
 
If this is an ongoing problem for this guy thus resulting in the attitude he has shown, maybe he should put up a sign that no private sales are to be done on property or something like that.

Barking at customers who in turn are your "Bread & Butter" is not a smart thing.

A simple sign can solve this from ever happening again (except for those who actually don't care and do it anyway, THOSE people need to be booted out on their butts)
 
Its not a private exchange until money passes hands and furthermore the guy is a horses arse in my book as are so many in the sales department of any kind of goods and i wouldnt give him the time of day... Best deals ive ever made were private in vehicles and guns. I suspect that private exchanges are a pet peeve to stores cause they dont want little old ladies to know just how dishonest in there business they are.... A local store heres top paying price is 60 percent condition value even if the guns 95 percent or higher store policy then they add another 100 dollars on to there 30 percent markup of its actual value.
 
It bothers me that most have condemed the shop owner without hearing his side of the story........ I would have to hear his side before coming to a conclusion.
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If I had been present, even as a bystander, I wouldn't care what the shop owner had to say. He said enough. I wouldn't set foot in the store again.

Some folks claim Saturno_V was "disrespectful"... of whom?? Obviously, the shop owner deserves no respect at all. Unbeknownst to everyone until this event, the shop owner conducted himself politely (we must assume) in every previous encounter, but for only one reason-- only because there was a potential for money to change hands, and a profit to be made. This was *never* a relationship based on respect; at least from the perspective of the shop owner, that much is certain.

"Faux pas":scrutiny:... big effen deal. I've been in a pawn shop as a customer in the exact same situation. The store owner, a man named Curtis, turned down a possible exchange. I asked how much the potential seller wanted for a handgun. Curtis politely said to me, "Aaron, you'll have to stop your conversation and take that outside if you have an interest." No 'please'. But he was polite, civil, and spoke in an even tone. No tantrum, no hostility. I don't even know Curtis' last name. I apologized, and it was over. I doubt Curtis even remembers. IF the claim is that this happens a lot in gun stores, then get over it--if you're gonna run a gun store you better get used to the idea that this is part of your day. Obviously, Curtis realizes it's not understood by the public, and that there's no insult intended. And Curtis conducts himself with more dignity than a panting dog over a dollar. That's why I go there.
 
A gun dealer who gets a reputation for allowing private off the books transactions on his premises can be targeted by ATF; the dealer's "over reaction" could have been due to stress. Every gun transaction within a gun dealership should result in a 4473 transaction form to avoid suspicion.

I have seen a dealer stressed out by having obvious ATF stooges come in and talk about doing illegal transactions in a sting operation. He picked up the phone and dialed the local ATF office with the gents in his shop and they left. If I discuss a private gun transaction, it will be at a private venue, never in a gun dealer's shop.
 
There is a reason the internet is killing mom and pop gunshops. Gunshops are dying out too frequently. It's not the prices on the internet; it's that mentality that you can do business with him or not at all.
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Isn't it funny that retail owners and employees supposedly exist to offer a service to their customers. Most consumer goods could really come from anywhere, including mail-order. Most good retailers (and their employees) understand that folks like to come to a place where they can see the product, handle the product, and maybe discuss their needs with a salesperson who (appears to) understand the relative merits of the available choices.

This existed universally in the not-too-distant past. Grocers met each customer and asked what they wanted -- and then went and got it for them while they waited at the counter! Department stores had floorwalkers who would politely attend to a customer, helping them find, select, carry, and package up their purchases. Guns were sold in hardware stores and department store by clerks who offered genial advice and a smile. Mail order was possible, but who would want to buy that way when you could go have a nice chat with a friendly salesman who'd patiently let you try out your choices and help you make a selection?

("Ahh, the Winchester! An excellent choice, Sir! Shall I wrap that up for you?")

Since 1968, when most firearms transfers were mandated to go through the new Federal Firearms Licensed dealer system, gun stores started becoming more circumscribed, and the gun buyer became largely a captive audience. The FFL dealer requirement created a forced relationship whereby the buyer really had few options. The idea of the customer "always being right" -- or even worthy of respect -- went into decline. Gun shops became dingier, dirtier, less welcoming places. With few competing venues available, why put out extra effort? Where were gun buyers going to go?

I honestly think that's the primary reason behind our nearly universal complaints about gun shops: poor selection, high prices, waiting interminably for someone to even SPEAK to you, bad (even dangerous) advice, huge egos, reluctant service, and the audacity to YELL at a customer over a perceived slight.

Not that any of these things are universal! I've know a bunch of really good FFLs, and my hat's off to them. But if you hang out with gun guys very long, you hear the same bad stories over and over, and again!

The internet has really caught the dealers off-guard. It is hurting them, definitely, because the accessory and ammo market is now completely wide open -- if there is one guy 3,000 miles away who sells an item at a huge loss, you won't be able to even sell them at cost. But the information available to most gun buyers is so great these days that a dealer can hardly open their mouth without looking uninformed. And, with guns being sold at minimum mark-up by on-line dealers, while the transfer still has to take place at the local FFL, the dealer mark-up has to be kept very low to compete.

That's the tough reality of gun sales in the 2000's. Oddly, many dealers are stuck in 1983 and don't realize that their captive audience is gone. Or do understand it and bitterly resent it.

Ironically, I still love to go to gun shops. I like the smell, and the racks of guns to inspect in person. I think most folks do. I do appreciate good front-end customer service, too. But dealing with the anachronistically LOUSY "average gun shop counter guy" is just too off-putting. So, while I bemoan seeing a gun shop go out of business, part of me says we're better off losing the bad ones. Maybe the good ones will flourish -- IF they pick up the slack and offer the personal service that has degraded so badly.
 
Since 1968, when most firearms transfers were mandated to go through the new Federal Firearms Licensed dealer system, gun stores started becoming more circumscribed, and the gun buyer became largely a captive audience. The FFL dealer requirement created a forced relationship whereby the buyer really had few options. The idea of the customer "always being right" -- or even worthy of respect -- went into decline. Gun shops became dingier, dirtier, less welcoming places. With few competing venues available, why put out extra effort? Where were gun buyers going to go?
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I've lived in Oklahoma city for the past 25 years. In the Metro there are 6 real gunstores (used to be 8) and a slew of pawnshops that sell guns. Forget the pawn shops, the Academy Sports etc - they are what they are.

Of the 6 real gunstores, 3 are dark and dingy with crusty old farts or smartass kids running them. Of the other 3 left 1 is semi-dingy with about 1/2 and 1/2 good sales people and jerks behind the counter. 1 is a clean, well lit, professionally laid out and modern facility run by pirates who absolutely believe that the IQ of the average gun buyer is around 90 or so and treats its customers according to that attitude. The last one has professional sales people who are polite, mostly knowledgeable and understand that their jobs depend on selling guns. The store is huge, well laid out and the guns on display are displayed in a well thought out manner.All but one of the six has declined or stayed the same over the past 25 years. The other has tripled in size, bought out the 2nd largest gun dealer in the area in the past 2 years and continues to grow.

Guess which one has tripled in size and is still growing.
 
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I agree he could have handled it without the Drama. I get very defensive if someone starts screaming at me as I am sure most of us do. I would never go back there. He could have made his point in a normal conversation. I had a dealer at a gunshow do that to me, after he asked me what I thought the gun should cost, when I said "no thanks". I told him to give me his laptop and I would show him how much it retailed for. He went nuts, started calling me all kinds of names, cursing etc. I asked him if he would like to go outside and discuss this in private, he dissapeared.
 
I do this in Gander Mountain, almost everytime I am in there lately.

Screw 'em. They have G22 police trade-ins listed for $549 and the used equipment is most often priced more than new weapons.

The guy turned the lady down on her rifle and you offered to look at it, and perhaps make her day with a sale. Which, in turn, might have left HER with a good impression of the premises no matter WHO bought it from her.
 
I don't care whether the guy was selling guns, gutters or gumballs; you treat your customers with the same respect you would expect them to treat you. If the OP breached proper etiquette, a polite but firm request to handle such business elsewhere is in order, but to lose your temper in such a fashion is likely not only to cost the business of the OP but that of other potential customers, as well. Worse, word can get around about the "out-of-control" gun store owner, possibly costing you even more business. People will go miles out of their way to avoid an unpleasant retailer.

I have worked in a gun shop and have worked in retail management where my responsibilities also included sales and dealing with problem customers. My wife manages a supermarket and deals with problem customers every day. It doesn't matter what kind of day you've had or whether the ATF is breathing down your neck; you don't get to have outbursts like that. Sound tough? Sound unforgiving? It is. But that's business.
 
I know this has been rehashed. Granted you should have waited until you guys were outside, however, that guy should not have reacted like that. Especially since he declined to buy the gun. I would not buy from that guy again. I dont care if it does happen all the time at gun shops, you act like that you dont get my business and Ill tell people about how I was treated there.
 
Anyone screams at me for my bad, then I apologize, and mean it when I do..... If he/she continues, then that means dis-respect and I dis-respect right back! I learned that from my father and I learned that in the work place. Twist and turn it as you want but dat's du way it is 4 me!

The Dove
 
As per a coupla other threads on the forum, maybe the gunshop owner suspected you were an BATFE agent pulling a sting in his store. Maybe his overly animated objection to your FTF purchase within his FFL storefront was only a ruse to prove to you(the suspected BATFE agent) that everything he did was on the up and up. Just sayin'.:rolleyes:


Or.......... he could have been having a bad day and just over-reacted. The multitude of these kind of threads here on the forum is proof that not everyone that owns/works in a GS/Wal-mart is knowledgeable and/or has a bubbling personality with a plenitude of people skills. I suggest you move on and get on with your life, make peace with him or go somewhere else.
 
That's the tough reality of gun sales in the 2000's. Oddly, many dealers are stuck in 1983 and don't realize that their captive audience is gone. Or do understand it and bitterly resent it.
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I've listened to more than one dealer bemoan the net (and the AWB sunsetting).

Ironically, I still love to go to gun shops. I like the smell, and the racks of guns to inspect in person. I think most folks do. I do appreciate good front-end customer service, too. But dealing with the anachronistically LOUSY "average gun shop counter guy" is just too off-putting. So, while I bemoan seeing a gun shop go out of business, part of me says we're better off losing the bad ones. Maybe the good ones will flourish -- IF they pick up the slack and offer the personal service that has degraded so badly.
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I enjoy gunshops, as well. I don't mind paying a premium to be able to handle before I buy, but don't try to put your kids through college with one sale.
 
It is always strange to me how we will take treatment from a gun store owner / employee that we would not accept from any other salesperson. I refuse to do this. The OP committed a small breach of ettiquete by trying to talk to the lady in the store. This hardly merits being berated loudly by the owner. I would simply have left the store, never returned, and told everyone I knew about the way I was treated at that store.
 
i would have went outside to ask her to see the gun after he passed on it. did this on a camera once at a pawn shop, he didn't want it so i bought it. funny thing was i was in there to buy that type of camera
 
I would have had NO IDEA that there was any law against buying something from another free citizen. The Owner obvioulsy didn't want it. I want the owner to stay in business, but all he has to do is politely explain WHY he doesnt' want me to speak about the gun in his store. He could even say WHERE I could do it.

I assume that people in a gun store are PRO-GUN, which also means they are PRO-OWNERS of guns. They should be there to HELP me, which includes educating me. Education I appreciate. Yelling at me? I'll be gone quicker than a flash. There are many other places to shop.

All of us over-react at times. All it takes is a, "golly, I could have said that better....sorry" and it is over. But avoiding the problem in the first place is much better. Create a positive ambience in your place of business.
 
he probable just paid his gun bill and could not afford the gun in question and got ticked off seeing a lost sell he passed on
 
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