Accidental Discharge (Graphic Pics)

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If you fail to properly identify the action, you do a dis-service to all concerned. Many pilots hate the term "pilot error" but if is is the root cause of a crash, it is appropriate to use, and ego be damned.

The difference between an AD and an ND is crucial to understand, and is crucial to define correctly.

but if you follow the three rules of firearms this will never happen.
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Make that Four Rules, please.
He looked into the chamber, worked the bolt and pulled the trigger several times, then, in defiance of all our training, worked the bolt one more time, pointed the rifle at my head and pulled the trigger!
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He would have ceased to be my friend at that point.
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He would have ceased having front teeth at that point. There, fixed it for you. :)
 
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Stuff Happens.
We live in a fallen world.
We are no longer in the Garden of Eden, thanks to the serpent (devil), Adam and Eve.;)
 
wow !!!! Hope everything goes well for him.
That would get your attention real quick.
 
I do not think that a police investigation will follow, as the report was made and settled at the hospital. And as far as my insurance is concerned I don't have to file. There is a small hole in the drywall I can easily patch myself. The land we shoot on is very secluded and we have a rather large, secure backstop.family has been shootin on the property way before I came in this world and I'm sure it'll continue after I leave. I'm lovin the AD/ND debate.LOL
 
Had my first and only ND years ago. I won't go into the details. I failed at two of the rules that day. The other two kept a friend alive.

Since that day I've added a "absolutely no ammo in the room in which I'm cleaning check." Not in boxes, cases, clips, magazines, closets or cabinets.

Yeah, I know, "if i followed the other two rules...", but I feel this adds an additional layer of security. The point is, human beings can and will make mistakes. "To err (in negligence or otherwise) is human."

To the OP: I hope your buddy recovers quickly. I also hope he realizes how lucky he was to get a bullet through the hand vs. through a more critical area. I'm sure he will; he'll have a lot of time to reflect on it.

Best regards
 
I'm pretty sure what everyone is saying about the AD / ND debate is all about perception on what the words mean....


AD would imply that the User is not at fault.

ND would imply that the user is at fault.

i happen to agree with the ND side of things, we humans are to blame.. and if we don't accept responsibility for our actions then we cannot learn and try to do things differently next time.

almost everyone who owns a firearm will have at least 1 ND in their life... the odds are just against you... all we can do is try to be safe every single time and hope no one dies from our mistake.
 
pbearperry said:
Android I understand where you are coming from,but you may have missed my point.Why would anyone ever,ever want to point the muzzle towards any part of his body and pull the trigger unless suicide was the subject?
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Well, obviously the OPs friend didn't realize where he was pointing the muzzle or he was attempting suicide by shooting himself in the hand! :D

That's the thing, IF the trigger weren't involved, for example, this is a Browning Hi Power with a round in the chamber, then if you grabbed the slide and your hand hung over the front as you pushed it back, as long as you kept your hands off the trigger, this wouldn't have happened.

Another example. Think of all the whiz bang ways to switch something up and down. Toggle switches, push buttons, touch screens, everything under the sun. But do you know what makes a tail hook go up and down in any Navy aircraft? A big switch that looks like tailhook that goes up for up and down for down. It's consistent, it's obvious and that reduces the chances of messing it up.
 
Thank you for sharing this story. I will be showing my son how ignorance is not bliss, but bloody.
 
AD would imply that the User is not at fault.

ND would imply that the user is at fault.
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Right. "Accidental discharges" most commonly occur due to some sort of improper mechanical function. "Negligent discharges" happen due to somebody's handling or mishandling of the firearm.

Note that "accidental discharges" are not the same thing as accidents. They may be unexpected or of unwanted consequence, but are not due to a human behavior failing.

"Negligent discharges" may be accidents in the sense that they were unexpected or of unwanted consequence, but they are a type of accident that is due to improper human behavior and in particular, negligent human behavior.

And you can have events that are both accidental and negligent. The accidental part is the gun going off on its own accord. It was unexpected and the gun failed to function properly. The negligent part is the gun not being handed properly (oriented in a safe direction) and people getting hurt or killed as a result. The examples are from the old version Rem 700 bolt guns that would sometimes discharge on their own accord after the safety was disengaged and the person attempted to open the bolt to remove a live round that wasn't going to be fired.
http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg02199.html
The guns should have never fired, but they did. Nobody should have ever been shot as a result, but the gun owners had the guns pointed at themselves or others while working the bolt (except in the case of the ricochet).
 
"please be safe and remember to handle your firearms in a responsible manner."

Thanx for the reminder! :eek:
 
and this is why when i go to clean my Sigma (have to pull trigger to release the slide) i aim it in a safe direction EVERY time and hold it like i am shooting down range AFTER i make DOUBLY sure it is clear.
 
I'm glad that my scare can be a teaching tool. That is pretty much the only reason why i posted it here. I love this forum and all its members for all the great information that circulates. Its hard to find places online where people conduct themselves like adults.
 
I have a friend (we're still friends) that had a small Freedom Arms concealed in a Pager made for that pistol. He demonstrated how it worked. Pointed it at me, pulled something back...pressed a button and click. When I stopped shaking I stated to him how wrong he was and how he should know better and NEVER take a fire arm out in front of me again.
 
Wow!:what: I have to admit that though I follow all the rules to a T, incidents like these serve a very important reminder of what can happen. We all get so comfortable with the fire arms, we start to slowly dis-regard some things. We need the occasional reminder and for that forums like this one are invaluable. I have seen some stupidity at the range, with time you see it and ignore it figuring you'd not be so stupid to do so yourself.

When I was new to shooting, I had a discharge when I was getting ready to shoot, gun was already pointed at the target, but I was doing my breath technic readying to pull the trigger, and suddenly Booom! Out of nowhere. I still can't tell you what happened, but made for one weary newbie who was hyper-alert to what was going on around me at all times. Eventually, I slack off and don't watch the other shooters as much. These stories remind me to be alert and be cautious, unfortunately there are people out there not as careful as you.
 
People who get in the habit of dropping the hammer, in my opinion, are just waiting for an AD to happen. Dropping the hammer means you have to pull the trigger. I don't pull the trigger on any gun unless I want it to go bang. The ONLY exception is if I am doing dry fire practice, and before that I REMOVE the magazine, check three times it is clear, and still point in a safe direction.
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Yup, absolutely agree. Whether or not you are checking for a round before you pull it makes it an absolute bad habit.

This gets ingrained as muscle memory and then you start pulling the trigger on everything, sometimes without thinking about it. Its just habit, a bad one.

When i clean: Drop magazine, pull back slide to remove chambered round, lock slide, look and feel for any round, pull slide lock pin and disasemble. Thank God i dont have to pull on a trigger to clean my gun.
 
Basic pistol safety course (beginner or refresher)= $100?
Gunshot in the hand hospital bill = $4,000+?

So did the police show and charge him with discharge within city limits?

I hope your friend gets to keep the slug, I know I'd want it if it were me. And regarding taking the photos before going to the hospital, I'd probably do the same. :)
 
Thank God you are all alive. I understand how something like that could shake you to the core.A incident that im sure wont be repeated anytime soon.
 
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