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Actual Shootout against armed killers.

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Proud Boer, Mar 9, 2009.

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  1. Proud Boer

    Proud Boer Member

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    Those of us who enjoy firearms in general and handguns in particular usually spend a lot of time practicing for the day we need to defend our loved ones and ourselves against attack. I am one of those individuals who have been fascinated by firearms and shooting since 10 years old, starting with my first BB gun. Since 1983 I've been a regular pistol and revolver shooter, competing over the years in Cowboy Action Shooting, Defensive Pistol Shooting as well as Practical Pistol Shooting.

    Cowboys, Boers and the history of the rugged individuals who have invented our great modern world, have always interested me. In South Africa violent crime is high and therefore I am grateful for my mindset of self-reliance as I now live in the heart of the current day "wild west".

    On the 8th of May 2008, I faced off a gang of three armed goblins who in the weeks preceding my attack, had robbed and killed numerous victims. These scumbags attacked me in front of my wife and daughter in the drive of my house at 20h00. I had just returned from a formal business function to launch the head office of a new dental insurance in Cape Town and was wearing a tuxedo and therefore only carrying single action .22 Magnum N.A.A. revolver. They wanted my house keys as well as the keys to my new Mercedes Benz SUV which I was driving. With their firearms pointed at me, I drew mine (thank God for years of practice), and shot the apparent leader of that gang in the chest - he screamed like a stuck pig and staggered backwards. The first thing I did was run for cover. As the other two were only about 20 feet away from me, bullets rained down on me as I hid momentarily behind a tree in my drive. In this exchange I was hit in the left arm (but actually felt nothing) and I returned fire hitting the first one of the two remaining goblins in the groin. He ran away to the getaway car standing in the road, shouting and crying and shooting into the air like a drunk Mexican officer during the Battle of the Alamo. There was one left besides the one who I shot first still staggering around.He still had his gun in hand and tried to point it again in my direction. I gave him another round to the chest and he disappeared to the getaway vehicle, fatally wounded as I was to find out in the days that followed. The last one had to run past me to get out of my drive and being the coward that these scum normally are, couldn't quite muster the courage. As I pointed my revolver and fired at him, the revolver blew up in my hand and I had no choice but to take him on bare handed. I smacked him to the ground by punching him in the face as the fact that I was now unarmed seemed to give him some courage. As he fell, he pulled off a shot and hit me in the right arm. He then turned and ran as he realised I was ready to fight to the death and he wasn't feeling well with a smashed nose.

    My wife, at this stage, had taken my .45 A.C.P. out and passed it to me through the window, giving me clear instructions to finish them off. They got away only with my bullets in them and in pain and I was lucky enough to win the fight.

    What did I learn from this?

    1. Always carry a gun no matter how small it may be. Even when the last thing you expect is to be attacked, don't let your logic of statistical probability of not being in mortal danger lull you into a false sense of security.

    2. Remember that in a gun fight - cover is king!

    3. Practice regularly to allow for the advantage of competent surprise,
    AND
    most importantly, if you want to win a gun fight, the most important factor is resolve and commitment. You have to have the inner courage to decide in a split second that you are going to win the fight irrespective of the consequences and then carry out that plan with determination and courage that surprises and stuns your "would be" attackers.

    I hope that the above sheds some light and gives some valuable insight into a real life gun fight. I would like to hear from others on this forum who have experienced the same or similar situations.

    Proud Boer.

    http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?art_id=vn20080511084250123C224954&set_id=1&click_id=13&sf=
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2009
  2. Kind of Blued

    Kind of Blued Member

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    Wow. First of all, I'm glad you survived the incident and that I'm able to say "Welcome". I can't imagine having anything more motivating during a life-or-death fight than your wife and child looking on. I'm especially glad that they didn't have to see evil overcome their husband and father.

    I thank you for sharing with us, as it is something that can truly be learned from, but at the same time may be difficult to recount. I've luckily never had to so much as draw or point a gun as a result of another's actions, but I'm smart enough to realize that I've just been lucky so far. Even though I've never had the cause for one, I've adopted your first piece of advice and carry a gun (or two) every day.

    You may find this thread interesting. Many folks on THR have recounted their experiences here. They may have been misfortunate, but thanks to their preparedness, nearly all of them ended well.

    P.S. I'm curious to know what your attackers were armed with. You've sure given me a new respect for the .22 Magnum!
     
  3. ACBMWM3

    ACBMWM3 member

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    That is quite a story. Ive been to SA and other places like Brazil and let me tell you if I could have carried there you bet I would have been.
    Luckily in Brazil we ran with a security team because the CEO of the company I was with had a lot of death threats.

    just wanted to mention if you know what Boer means, its nothing racist. And neither is Goblin, heck its a standard Halloween word our kids say.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2009
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  4. Proud Boer

    Proud Boer Member

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    Kind of Blued,

    The goblins were armed with Tokarev 7.63x21 military type pistols (as used by communist armies during the cold war). They fired 12 rounds at me combined.

    The 22mag N.A.A sure saved my life and if/when I move to the U.S.A. one day (I love the South West and visit it annually) or when South Africa becomes safer, I will again carry one again.Here in South Africa, I now feel safer with my Star .45 A.C.P.,which has been my regular/daily carry gun since 1990. It is also my Defensive Pistol Gun.

    I know that I would have killed all three of the goblins had I have been carrying it that night. I was "outclassed" but not "outgunned" that night. If I lived in Dodge City in the mid 1800s I would recommend a Walker Colt above Derringer for the same reason.
     
  5. Shung

    Shung Member

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    wow, what a story. Glad that you are ok !

    So in the end you did kill only 1 of the guys ? were the others caught ?

    Didnt you fear they would come back for revenge ?
     
  6. Proud Boer

    Proud Boer Member

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    Shung,
    http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?sf=13&set_id=1&click_id=13&art_id=vn20080509062726622C293344


    The police came back to me a few days later to collect my gun for ballistics. The gun is blown to bits so they brought it back with no tests. Apparently the body they found had two .22 holes in it and nine warrants for arrest, 4 for murder. They said they are closing their files! The others were all arrested as part of a syndicate of 61. They are in jail and will be after trial for life or long sentences. The Police have been great and fully supportive of me.

    I doubt they or their connections will ever come back. These types of cowards never take risk when they are guaranteed a good fight, which they now know I will give them!
     
  7. BlacklabelOP

    BlacklabelOP member

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    This whole story is fake

    /end
     
  8. Proud Boer

    Proud Boer Member

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  9. loneviking

    loneviking Member

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    Fake? No doubt as I can't see any way that a .22 is going to be blown to pieces. The.22 doesn't have enough power and even if it did, the gun would be largely intact even if it was damaged.
     
  10. Proud Boer

    Proud Boer Member

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    loneviking,

    The cylinder has a hole blown in it. The topstrap is detached from the frame. The locking rod of the cylinder is sheared off. The frame is cracked and bent. A 22 magnum operates at pretty high pressures. My arms have healed o.k. from the 7.62 rounds but I still have metal filings in my hand from the .22.mag. They slowly surface and pop out!
     
  11. Mp7

    Mp7 Member

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    ...

    except for the connotations of your chosen username
    and the slur-term goblins - i find it an interesting story.


    If you haven´t read what the THR guidelines
    are - do it, before the mods read´em to ya.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2009
  12. Proud Boer

    Proud Boer Member

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    MP 7,

    Thank you for the comments. Goblin is a standard term,initiated by Col Jeff Cooper to label an evil doer. It has no other meanings or overtones. I never mentioned the color of my attackers once and in fact still haven't.

    Boer is a term given to a particular group of South Africans, from pioneering heritage, who blazed a trail north into South Africa and ultimately founded the Boer Republics. They ultimately fought British Imperialism here in South Africa between 1899 and 1902. My Great Grandfather was a Boer General in that war. I am proud of that heritage. That heritage goes back long before South Africa lost its way politically as that only started in the 1930's.

    Regards PB
     
  13. Birddog1911

    Birddog1911 Member

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    I don't see what is wrong with the username-Boer? Is there something wrong with that?

    Before I condemn the slur goblins, I suspect that this could be a matter of translation, not derogatory.

    As far as a .22 Mag NAA blowing up, wouldn't surprise me.
     
  14. DHJenkins

    DHJenkins Member

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    How is "goblins" a slur? They're in Lord of the Rings, for Pete's sake!

    Jesus, has everyone lost their mind?

    BTW, great job Boer! I don't care what you call them.
     
  15. blkbrd666

    blkbrd666 Member

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    What rule did he break???
     
  16. Mal H

    Mal H Administrator

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    Proud Boer has broken no THR rules, but some others have come quite close to doing that. Let's keep the "fake story" comments to yourselves until you can prove otherwise.

    I have personally done some checking using info not privy to others here, and so far most details of his story check out.

    Why anyone would think the terms goblins, gremlins, or Boer are disallowed is a mystery to me.

    Proud Boer - if you can supply a picture of that blown up .22 NAA, I think that would help a lot.
     
  17. twoclones

    twoclones Member

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    It's my understanding that Boer is the Dutch word for Farmer. "Proud Farmer" is offensive???

    Nice touch getting the newspaper to support your 'fake' story ;)

    22 Mag uses a max pressure of 25,600 psi. which is a lot higher than .38 Special. Exploding gun is plausible.

    Goblins? I'd call them worse than that...
     
  18. twoclones

    twoclones Member

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    I'd love to see that since .22 mag NAA is my *nice clothes ccw*
     
  19. Flea

    Flea Member

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    Impressive ordeal... glad you came out on top!

    The 7.63x21 is a Mannlicher cartridge, not used by the Soviets.
    7.62x25 was the Tokarev cartridge.

    I was actually looking at one of those in a .22 magnum this past weekend for a pocket gun! Guess I'll just stick with fullsize.
     
  20. HardKnox

    HardKnox Member

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    To all you who think the mini is a reliable weapon, that doesn't malfunction, i have a naa companion that has a swollen cylinder from nothing but 5 by the book shots, these guns are NOT meant to be fired. <-period end of story
     
  21. mbt2001

    mbt2001 Member

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    Did you call NAA and say that your bloody gun blew up in the middle of a gunfight and damn near cost me my life??? I am sending it back to you and want a NON-POS in return.

    Well, anyway, good shooting. Amazingly good shooting. Fast, accurate Center Mass hits end gun fights. Remember that time honred maxim.
     
  22. TexasRedneck

    TexasRedneck Member

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    BlacklabelOP - with all due respect, do you realize that you've publicly called the man a liar with no cited proof of your position? In many places, such an accusation is not only rude, but tantamount to "fighting words". While I was a bit suspect initially, the (albeit limited) online research I could do indicated that at very least an incident such as was described DID occur. Surely you should have done at least that much prior to making your post, eh?
     
  23. TexasRifleman

    TexasRifleman Moderator Emeritus

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    Some people simply look for things to get upset about I guess.

    Good story, reinforces the old saying "first rule of a gunfight...bring a gun, any gun".

    Glad the OP is alive and kicking.

    The lack of education, manners, and general high road behavior here is disappointing.
     
  24. mbt2001

    mbt2001 Member

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    I think that we Texans are (for the most part) the only ones that still feel that way.
     
  25. ravencon

    ravencon Member

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    .

    I'm from Massachusetts and I'd see them as fighting words if they were directed at me. ;)

    But, calling someone a liar from behind a screen name is a low risk endeavor.
     
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