Advice wanted on picking out a new varmint rifle.

[GomerPyle85]

Howdy all from the Beehive State! I'll start off by saying I'm a brand new member of The High Road. I've read the forums for years, figured I finally needed to join in on the fun. For my first thread, I'm seeking advice regarding a new varmint rifle. I just gave my Father my relatively new Remington Model 700 VSSF II chambered in 22-250 Rem. I picked it up last fall brand new at the local gun shop, I'm a longtime customer of the shop and they said that the VSSF II Model 700s were absolute top quality rifles that did not suffer from quality control issues like the cheapo Remingtons. It was the last one they had in stock, so needless to say I picked it up. Well long story short my Father has been a Remington man for decades, especially the Model 700, and he kept on saying how much he liked it. Being more of a blued steel and wood stock fan(hardwood and laminate), the VSSF II never grew on me. So, needless to say, I just gave it to my Father as an early Father's Day present. I'm keeping the scope, as Dad can hardly see the reticle (Leupold VX3 6.5-20x40mm with the target do reticle). So I've got a great varmint scope that needs a rifle worthy of the range it offers. I have the smaller varmint/close range battery covered, with three 22 rifles, a 22 handgun, and a scoped 22 Magnum. Right now the three cartridges I'm looking at are the ones most people seem to debate over: 204 Ruger, 22-250 Rem, and the legendary 220 Swift. If I had the money I'd get all three because all three rock, but there are other guns that have my eye right now as well. I'm leaning towards the 220 Swift the most, for a few reasons. #1 reason being that I handload, so relying on factory ammo is not an issue. #2 is the fact that not a ton of people have the Swift, and right now I'm trying to add more unique cartridges to my collection. #3 is that there is a brand new Ruger Number One Varmint at my local gun shop. It has beautiful wood and from what I have read and heard, the heavy barrel Number Ones are spooky accurate. I've also read/heard that back in the day, Jim Carmichael of Outdoor Life visited Ruger, and Bill Ruger told him that you could take a 22-250 and shoot a group, and then take a 220 Swift and cut that group in half. The second option is a new Savage M12 heavy stainless laminate thumbhole stock in 22-250. I have some friends who have Savage rifles and they are scary accurate. I myself am a Winchester Model 70 man, and I wish so bad that a new Model 70 Varmint rifle would be introduced with a nice laminate wood stock with the option of 220 Swift. The pre-64 Model 70 rifles are out of reach for me, especially the Swift chambered guns. The third choice is the 204 Ruger. I hear nothing but positive things about this cartridge as two of my Dad's friends own a 204 Ruger and they love them. So those are the ones I'm considering right now. I live in Northern Utah, so the varmints will be prairie dogs, jack rabbits, rock chucks, and coyotes come winter time. Mainly the latter 3, as I find my 22 Magnum is perfect for prairie dogs. So which rifle/cartridge combo should I go with? I'm pretty much a bolt action man but I have a soft spot for lever actions, and I have always thought that a single action such as a #1 or 1885 Winchester would be sweet to own. I'm also not considering the 223 Rem. Great as it is, I had one(Colt M4 Carbine) and it was fun, but I'm looking for some Lightning. I'm also not interested in a wildcat or the AI route. I am religious with gun maintenance, as my Dad, the Marine Corps and now law enforcement have instilled in me that a firearm shall be cleaned, inspected, and cleaned again. So from what I understand, keeping a hot rod round's bore clean should add a few years of life? I am also careful with shooting, making sure that when the barrel heats up I allow it to cool down. Long post and I apologize for it, I'm just very detailed and I like to cover all the bases. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

 

[dh1633pm]

I have had a 204 Ruger and a 220 Swift. The 204 is certainly fast. I have one in a CZ527, its a shooter, but I never get to shoot it enough. Its on the possible sale list. I like the 6.5 Creedmoor for that roll or just 223. I don't get many Varmint Shots that are long enough to take advantage of the 204's speed. Same with the Swift. My had has a heavy barrel stainless 22-250 Savage. He shot three Coyotes at 330 yards after they chose to eat his cat. And he hates cats. But it was his.

The Savage, like mine in 6.5 shoots very tight groups. I am sure you will get as many varied recommendations as their are responses.

 

[hdwhit]

Welcome.

Interesting first post.

The one danger of a question like this is that people may end up telling you what they would like to have rather than what is best for you. If you can sort that out, there should be some posts that contain more than a little wisdom.

I can't help you out since everything I currently have is either 22LR or 223/5.56x45 and the one is not appropriate for your needs and you said you weren't interested in the other. But check your post frequently because there will be posters come along that can help.

 

[DRYHUMOR]

Go with the Swift. As a handloader, you can get accurate loads, that don't necessarily need to be highest speed.

I have a M70 CRF, that started life as a 7mm08; it is now a 220 Swift. I wouldn't hesitate to do it again either.

Ruger #1s on gunbroker right now in 220 Swift. I've already come close to buying one a couple times now.

 

[witchhunter]

If you like Winnies, get you one. Have it barreled to .220 AI. This stops the brass flowing to the neck. Great round. But on the other hand, you can get a .204 in several rifles easy. Both are fast and accurate, the Swif has the edge past 300 on coyotes though. I have had swifts since 1978 and i love em! Research an Ackley Improved and you will see what i am talking about. I would be cautious with a Number 1. They can be finicky to get to shoot. Just my opinion. Buy what makes you happy.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I hear more about #1's being finicky than I do spooky accurate, assuming that means very accurate.

 

[jmr40]

I like 22-250 of your options.

Your post would be a LOT easier to read with a few paragraphs. One long block was very hard to make sense of.

 

[Art Eatman]

Back in the 1970s I had a heavy-barrel Ruger in .220 Swift. 3/8 MOA, reliably for five shot groups. It was my go-to gun for feral housecats at 400 yards. My quail should have appreciated my efforts in their behalf.

I've had a couple of Sako sporters in .22-250 which were okay but not that impressive.

For no particular reason I like the old Swift. Dunno why, really. Just one of those "likes".

 

[Axis II]

how far are you shooting? woodchucks, prairie dogs, coyotes? I hunt flat farm land and the 223rem does well enough but a 22-250 would offer a little better option. If you don't reload 223, 22-250 ammo and even 243 can be found everywhere in every flavor. scope will do well for any range. 22-250 ive seen woodchucks killed at over 300yards. ive shot them at 200yrds with a 223rem and cheap factory ammo.

I've never been a fan of the oddball cartridges like 204, 220, etc cause I like being able to find ammo anywhere and for a decent price.

 

[pert near]

Let me state right off, the Ruger #1 is by far my favorite rifle. Beautiful, classy & accurate. BUT realistically, you have a 50/50 chance of getting a "spooky" accurate one right off the bat, versus applying a bit of tuning & tinkering & TLC. If you intention is to buy it & shoot it, get a bolt action. Just a heads-up!

If it is important to you to watch the bullet's impact through the scope, the .204 is your prescription! But as a long range, powerful, varmint rig, the .22-250 or Swift would be a much better choice. Personally, I suggest 3 rifles, one in each caliber & find out which one you like the most. Perhaps a Ruger #1, Rem 700 & a Win 70. ...FWIW with tongue in cheek.

 

[Varminterror]

I might agree with the statement such "Ruger Number 1's are spooky accurate," but meaning finding one which is really accurate is like seeing a ghost!

The Number One's are much more expensive than many bolt action repeaters which will outshoot them. Even in many dollars spent in effort, they're not very accurate as compared to even base model bolt rifles made today. Sure, you'll easily find one in the 1moa ballpark, at least with the right load, but less money can be spent on a more versatile rifle with greater precision.

The Number One's DO exude sex appeal like a jug of tea sweating in the summer breeze, which isn't without merit, but if I were looking for my only dedicated varmint rifle, it wouldn't be a Ruger No.1. I only have two left, one blued international and one a stainless/laminate .45-70, but they don't see much use.

 

[zb338]

Get the Swift you can't beat them. We were in Wyoming a few years ago and after everyone shot their
Antelope the guide loaned us a .204 and put us on a Prairie Dog village. It was windy as hell that day
and the .204 was a little disappointing. The next day was calm and we really shot up those poor dogs.
Go with a Swift or something even bigger if you are shooting out West.

Zeke

 

[BigBore44]

First,
Long posts are fine. You want to cover all your bases. But paragraphs REALLY help.

Now that that has been stated again (there's a reason I restated it) we can move to your question(s).

For rifle choice, it's really hard to beat a Savage 12. They are very accurate right out of the box and sometimes need nothing but a scope mounted, dialed in, and go shoot. Sub MOA is the norm. And their triggers are fantastic. I'm a Winchester guy myself too. But Savage gets my nod. However a M70 action with rebarrel is definitely an option. I'd stay away from a #1. For the price, you could buy a really nice Savage. Maybe even 2. Remember, you don't have to spend a lot to get a great rifle. I bought mine for $400 new. It's light, handy, easy to carry long distances, and 1/2 MOA with factory Hornady ammo.

Now for the caliber. The 220 Swift is a great cartridge. Being a handloader means we can choose whatever cartridge we want because, whilst it may take some time and experimentation, we can find the "right load". I prefer more standard calibers for some applications. And some slightly different for others. The .223 got my nod for my varmint rifle. And it's a tack driver. But you won't be disappointed with 220 Swift. I've actually been looking into getting one myself.

But in the end I say go get a Red Rider and learn to be really sneaky. Kill a yote or prairie dog like that and you've got some real bragging rights.

 

[SwampWolf]

there is a brand new Ruger Number One Varmint at my local gun shop. It has beautiful wood and from what I have read and heard, the heavy barrel Number Ones are spooky accurate.

I am getting to be an old man now and I've shot a lot of rifles in my time but, of the many rifle I've had and have, the most accurate ever has been my Ruger Number One Varmint rifle, chambered in .220 Swift. Spooky accurate indeed, especially with Hornady factory ammunition. When I first bought this rifle, back in 1995, my biggest decision was whether to get it chambered in .22-250 or the .220 Swift. Like you, I kind of like having a unique firearm or two in my inventory so it was easy to opt for the Swift; a decision I've never come to regret.

Get the No. One while you still can, GomerPyle85; they're going to get harder and harder to find and really pricey when you do locate one. And welcome to The High Road!

 

[olkowsr]

A 204 is a pretty slick little round.

In my state (Michigan) you cant use anything larger than a 22 caliber at night and well that 204 puts a hurtin on varmits unlike any other in my area.

- My opinion.

 

[redneck2]

I've only been on three prairie dog hunts, but they were multiple days in eastern Montana. I had a super accurate Remington.22-250. I mean ultra accurate. Problem with a 250 is the muzzle blast. After just a couple shots the dogs go down.

Now we use Varminter .223 AR's or my CZ .204. The CZ with 39 Blitzkings is also super accurate, has the same ballistics as the 250, and has about the same blast as the .223's (26 grains of Varget in either one). If you're shooting into the wind, they usually stay up if they're 250 yards or more.

I'd suggest you consider a CZ 527 in .204. Single set trigger is awesome

 

[Sniper66]

Welcome Gomer.....I've been shooting all my life and at age 70 have shouldered and shot many calibers. I've been actively shooting prairie dogs for the past 12-15 years. I currently shoot 6 rifles at p-dogs (occasionally coyotes), none of them a 220 swift. I've never gotten around to considering the swift since my other rifles do such a good job. I have an Anschutz 1517HMR, a Savage Model 25 22Hornet, a Kimber 84M .204, a Ruger #1 .204, a Remington 700 VSF .223, and a Remington 700 VLS .243. My Ruger #1 is an accurate rifle, but not scary accurate like my Anschutz and Kimber. It is definitely my prettiest rifle. From your narrative it sounds like you are sold on the Swift...I say go for it. BTW I've heard a number of people who bought the Savage Model 12 with high hopes and were disappointed.
Here's what happened to my brother and me. Together we own about a dozen excellent rifles suitable for prairie dogs and coyotes. In addition to the my list above my brother also has a Ruger #1 .204 with which he has killed 100s of p-dogs. He also has a Sako heavy barreled 22-250 and a Remington 700 VLS .223. When we encounter a lot of shooting opportunities (lots of p-dogs) at variable distances and shooting conditions (unpredictable wind gusts) and spooked dogs that rarely come out closer than 200 yards, we gravitate to the most reliable weapon. For me it's my Kimber .204 or my Rem 700 VSF .223. My brother grabs his Rem 700 VLS .223 or his Ruger #1 .204.
Since you are looking for lightning, I would recommend the .204. I've seen prairie dogs and pieces of prairie dogs fly 10 feet. A sight to behold. A footnote here. My brother and I have killed several coyotes with our Ruger #1 .204s; these both as targets of opportunity when hunting prairie dogs or when I call them in with a varmint call. I'm in the process of having a really nice AR style rifle built for coyote calling and plan to get it chambered in .204. Good lick with your choice.

 

[CoalTrain49]

I was looking at a #1 varmint (.223) but when I read all of the bad press I decided against it. I ended up with a bolt gun. Rugers have priority mounts which is another negative. There seems to be a definite cut back in production so I'm thinking they won't be available for much longer. no production, no parts.

Not sure why you aren't considering .223. 3600 fps is plenty fast for varmints with a 40 grn bullet. If you have to have the 4000 fps my choice would be 22-250. That has been the varmint shooters gold standard for a long time. There is a better selection of rifles and bullets for 22-250 and 223. More people shoot those cartridges on varmints for good reasons. 204 isn't as versatile nor does it have the huge bullet select that the 223 and 22-250 has. It's main attraction is light recoil, speed isn't anything special with a 40 gr bullet..

 

[MistWolf]

My father had owned both the 22-250 and the 220 Swift. He saw no edge in accuracy in one over the other. I like the 22-250 better because it became one of my favorite calibers to shoot before Dad got the Swift. I also like rimless case in a bolt action over rimmed or semi-rimmed cases. The 220 Swift has the edge in raw velocity. Either caliber will serve you well. Choose the one you like best. Or better yet, choose the one that comes in the rifle you like best.

I haven't tried the 204 Ruger yet, but I've shot a pile of 223s. I know you aren't interested in the 223, but in many ways, it's the most practical varmint caliber out there. It's effective at the distances most varmints are shot at, it's light recoiling, reloading components are easy to find and it's affordable. It has the added bonus of being easy to get good suppressors for.

Looking at the numbers, the 204 shares several of the advantages of the 223 and will use the same suppressors

 

[Sunray]

"...But paragraphs REALLY help..." Thank you.
The .220 Swift and 204 Ruger aren't exactly common as loaded ammo or as brass. Midway shows the .220 as only in stock from Hornady or Jameson. The Ruger's only available from Hornady. You can order whatever you want through your local gun shop, but it'll be unlikely to find either in small places. It's more about what varmints you plan on hunting and will the rifle be a dedicated varmints only rifle anyway.

 

[CoalTrain49]

I had one(Colt M4 Carbine) and it was fun, but I'm looking for some Lightning. I'm also not interested in a wildcat or the AI route.

Having an AR carbine isn't a comparison to a heavy barrel bolt gun. I reload and I find the .223 to be versatile and economic. I have two 223 bolt guns. I've never paid a dime for the brass. I can shoot 100 rounds a for under 20 bucks and tweak my loads for my rifles. 220 Swift brass is 0.60 a pop. Want an antique cartridge? 220 Swift would be the one of those.

Do you want to hone your ability to shoot or collect pretty rifles that use outdated cartridges? That would be the my question.

 

[Geno]

O, hale! Eye doughn't sea watt thee fuss is bout sum perri grafs. Seams two mi, if a body kant comb pretend watt eye'm tie ping, myt bee hees git two much buuk lurnin! Perri grafs?! Eye doughn't kneed em!

Whelkomb two thee hi rhoad!

Gee Know

Ps: .22-250 Rem in whatever you like. Love my M70 Stealth! For craps n giggles, we shoot shotgun primers at 200 yards, using a Nightforce 12-42 optic: 80 shots for 80 hits! Hard to imagine anything besting that.

 

[SwampWolf]

Do you want to hone your ability to shoot or collect pretty rifles that use outdated cartridges? That would be the my question.

You can have and do both. The op reloads, allowing him to "hone" his shooting ability using classic cartridges cost-wise and otherwise, and the Number One is a very pretty rifle. That would be my answer.

 

[Nature Boy]

I think you should find a way to get a Win model 70 in .220, .204 or .22-250

That's what you really want. Make it happen

And welcome to THR

 

[joed]

I wanted a Swift more then anything in my last varmint rifle. Good luck finding one, they're scarce. I ended up with a .22-250 and haven't regretted it.