Any .35 caliber fans here?

[NCsmitty]

I have a TC Contender in 357 Maximum with a 10" barrel with a Bushnell Phantom 2.5x. I killed my last deer with it using 170 gr Sierra under 22gr. Rel-7. I changed to 180gr. Hornady single shot pistol bullet later on because it's a spire point. Quite potent to 125 yds.+ and versatile with the ability to shoot 357 Mag & 38 Special.

NCsmitty

 

[JShirley]

is it too much gun for deer sized game?

A sturdy .358 bullet won't fragment, so no, it'll just penetrate through while making a nice hole.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

I'm kinda partial to the .351 Winchester.

 

[gralewaj]

Yep, big fan!

.35 Rem: Marlin 336C
.358 Win: Ruger M77 Frontier
.350 Rem Mag: Rem 673

I really thought there would have been a bigger difference between the .358 Win and the .350 RM, but not so much. My Rem 673 sure looks good though! And she's what I carry on the elk hunts.

 

[MCgunner]

.35? Does a .357 magnum carbine count?

 

[jim in Anchorage]

.35? Does a .357 magnum carbine count?

No. My 35-300 Win mag on a 1917 action does.
Split two stocks.
Ouch. Destroyed two stocks would be a better description.

 

[natman]

BLR in 358
Ruger 77 Ultralight in 358
Interarms Mark X in 35 Whelen

Love 'em.

 

[oldrevolverguy]

The 35 Remington in the Marlin 336 with a Leupold VXII 2X7 is deadly in the deer woods easily out to 150 yards (more than double the average distance of the whitetails I have taken). It is very comforting if you are sharing the woods with large irritable hogs. The 200 grain round nose bullet at 2,100 FPS kills all out of proportion to its ballistics.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Thirty-five calibers kill very well. As they say in the commercials, "Size does matter."

 

[MCgunner]

Quote:
.35? Does a .357 magnum carbine count?



No.

Well, fine, then, I'll go join the 7mm club.....

Actually, pushing a 165 grain pill to 1900 fps, inside 100 yards, if a .35 Remington can kill it, the .357 can.

 

[jbkebert]

35 rem in a T/C contender 12" topped with a bushnell elite 3200 2-6x32 nice hunting handgun. Picked it up from a private sale for $275 with base and rings. I added the scope for another $200 or so.

 

[jaysouth]

760 Remington in .35 Remington. Doesn't get better for the woods. Thompson Contender in .357 mag. I killed two deer with the contender from a deer stand last year.

 

[jim in Anchorage]

Well, fine, then, I'll go join the 7mm club.....

Actually, pushing a 165 grain pill to 1900 fps, inside 100 yards, if a .35 Remington can kill it, the .357 can.

I suppose, but when I hear .35 I think BIG game. Like a 250 at 2800. Happiness is a bruised shoulder.

 

[MCgunner]

I don't know, think I'd soon have a .30-06 as the Whelen. I don't see any advantage in the Whelen. Similar energies developed at lower velocities with a bigger bullet and a rainbow trajectory. Far as "big game" goes, if the Whelen can kill it, the .30-06 with a proper bullet can and can do it a bit further out with less hold over.

When I think REALLY big, dangerous game, I start thinkin' .375 H&H or bigger. I simply don't have a need down here in Tejas, though. If I lived up there in Alaska, I might have one. Well, I don't know if I'd care that much for bear hunting. I hear the meat sux, but heck, I guess you can't have too much overkill on a moose, eh? But, down here in brush on hogs and deer, a .357 carbine properly loaded is a baby .35 Remington, effectively. It ain't far off in ballistics, anyway, with up to 180 grain bullets.

Heavy 357 Magnum Ammo - 180 gr. L.F.N. -G.C. (1,400fps/M.E. 783 ft. lbs.) - 20 Round Box

Our 357 mag. ammo adds more power than ever before to the 357 mag. This ammo is safe to shoot in ANY all steel 357 revolver - this includes J frames. This ammo is no harder on your gun than any other normal 357 ammo. Please don't phone us and ask if this ammo is safe in your gun. It is, providing your gun is in safe condition for use with any normal 357 ammo.

We don't recommend this ammo to be fired in super light alloy revolvers as bullets may jump crimp under recoil, but the ammo itself wont hurt these super light weight revolvers. These revolvers are simply so light that the recoil is severe enough to cause crimp jump.

The below velocities are offered so that you can see what guns/barrel lengths give what velocities with this new 357 mag. ammo. You'll notice that new S&W revolvers with short barrels are often shooting faster than older S&W revolvers with longer barrels. The new S&W revolvers are very good and are made with equipment that makes them more consistent and faster than the S&W revolvers of yesteryear.

Make special note of the Marlin 1894, 18.5 inch barrel velocities. Item 19C/20, supercedes 30-30 energies!!!





5. 18.5 inch Marlin 1894

a. Item 19A/20-180gr. Hard Cast = 1851 fps
b. Item 19B/20-170gr. JHC = 1860 fps
c. Item 19C/20-158gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 2153 fps---- Can you believe this?!!!
d. Item 19D/20-125gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 2298 fps---- Or this?!!!

 

[IllHunter]

A simple lesson..

I preferred .270W for deer in rifle country and until I won a Marlin 35W I never considered using another caliber. I lent the 35 to my nephew when he joined the hunt and saw him shoot a buck broadside at 30 yards. Factory 225 put a small hole in the close shoulder and a double fist sized hole in the off side. The buck appeared to fly sideways about ten feet from where it was standing over the scent sticks! Although I only saw that once, it's stuck in my head. I have not used a rifle for hunting in several years but will bring that Marlin if I go north.

 

[Kernel]

35 Whelen wrote,

Last year... I opted for the 358 Norma. WOW!! What a cartridge!!

So, will you be changing your screen name to 358 Norma, then?

 

[dr0]

I don't know, think I'd soon have a .30-06 as the Whelen. I don't see any advantage in the Whelen. Similar energies developed at lower velocities with a bigger bullet and a rainbow trajectory. Far as "big game" goes, if the Whelen can kill it, the .30-06 with a proper bullet can and can do it a bit further out with less hold over.

When I think REALLY big, dangerous game, I start thinkin' .375 H&H or bigger. I simply don't have a need down here in Tejas, though. If I lived up there in Alaska, I might have one. Well, I don't know if I'd care that much for bear hunting. I hear the meat sux, but heck, I guess you can't have too much overkill on a moose, eh? But, down here in brush on hogs and deer, a .357 carbine properly loaded is a baby .35 Remington, effectively. It ain't far off in ballistics, anyway, with up to 180 grain bullets.

I'm at work so the only ballistic's tables I have are the ones in the 2002 Gun Digest, but they should do. (All generic factory to factory comparisons).

30-06 puts the 180 gr pill out at 2700fps. At 300 yards it has 1666 ft/lbs. of energy and a drop of 9.3". (using a 200 yd. zero)

35 Whelen puts out a 200 gr @ 2675. At 300 yards it has 1958 ft./lbs of energy and a drop of 10.2". 200 yard zero.

20% more energy. 10% less trajectory. I'd hardly call it a "rainbow". It's very close to the parent 30-06.

How about heavier bullets?

The big 220gr .30-06 leave the business end at 2410 fps but retains only 1301 ft/lbs of energy at 300 yards. The drop is 18 inches.

Meanwhile the .35 Whelen kicks a 225gr out at 2500fps but manages to retain 1870 ft/lbs of energy at 300 yards. It's only dropped 10 inches. WOW! 8 inches less drop, 500ft/lbs more energy.

For 220/225 class bullets the Whelen is clearly the superior killing machine. (And that's not even factoring the bigger hole it punches.) Which cartridge has the rainbow trajectory again?

OK, but we're not done. Let's take the other contender and run him through the paces. The 2002 Gun Digest lists only 1 round for the .338-06. Conveniently a 200 grain one.

200gr @ 2750 results in 2118 ft/lbs. of energy at 300 yards! And 8.2" of drop.
This beats the .30/06 180 by a significant amount! 450 ft/lbs more energy, an inch less drop and a slightly bigger hole.

200gr .338 vs. 200gr Whelen is pretty close. 2118 vs. 1958 - 150 ft/lb advantage .338
8.2" inch drop for the .338-06, 10.2" drop for the Whelen, a 2" advantage for the .338.
The Whelen however still retains the larger hole advantage.

In summary: if you want to use heavier than 200 grain bullets the .35 Whelen and .338-06 both deliver significantly better ballistics than the parent .30-06. That's why some real smart guys invented them way-back-when and they have been well loved cartridges since grandpa's day. (In the guise of the .333 OKH in the case of the .33).

Cheers!

 

[Vern Humphrey]

In summary: if you want to use heavier than 200 grain bullets the .35 Whelen and .338-06 both deliver significantly better ballistics than the parent .30-06. That's why some real smart guys invented them way-back-when and they have been well loved cartridges since grandpa's day. (In the guise of the .333 OKH in the case of the .33).

There's no question the .35 Whelen will outperform the .30-06 with heavy bullets. My .35 Brown-Whelen drives a 225 grain Nosler Partition Jacket to 2800 fps (measured on my Shooting Chrony.) That's 20% more bullet weight at 100 fps faster than a .30-06 180 grain load -- and, as you say, a bigger hole.

 

[MCgunner]

There's no question the .35 Whelen will outperform the .30-06 with heavy bullets. My .35 Brown-Whelen drives a 225 grain Nosler Partition Jacket to 2800 fps (measured on my Shooting Chrony.) That's 20% more bullet weight at 100 fps faster than a .30-06 180 grain load -- and, as you say, a bigger hole.

Interesting. Now, I can see the infatuation, at least on paper. I think, though, that the old naught six will kill anything the .35 can kill just as dead. Maybe the .35 would be a bit better for moose, though. Always thought in terms of .338 win mag on such animals, but with those ballistics, the whelen could do the job.

Not a lot of moose down here, so I've never given it that much thought.

 

[35 Whelen]

35 Whelen wrote,
Quote:
Last year... I opted for the 358 Norma. WOW!! What a cartridge!!

So, will you be changing your screen name to 358 Norma, then?

No, I won't....and actually, I still favor the 35 Whelen over the 358 Norma. I hunt up to and including elk and have seen firsthand the Whelen drive a 225 gr. TSX from the **** to the shoulder of a big New Mexico bull. I see no reason for anymore power than that.
Also, any comparison, especially in the energy department, is...well...almost ridiculous. I've killed game with .30 and .35 caliber bullets and in my experience, there's simply no comparison.
35W (Not 35NM)

 

[MCgunner]

Why is an energy comparison "ridiculous"? Energy kills. I like the 7mm Rem Mag, myself. A 160 Nosler Partition delivers a hefty punch way out there. It's all about the construction of the bullet. I particularly like Barnes bullets, too. I shoot 'em in .308 for hogs. I KNOW they'll penetrate AND expand, no problem.

With a .35 caliber FLAT NOSE SWC, I don't need expansion to kill, but I also can't shoot as far due to pathetic BCs. One reason I like 7mm is the BCs. 6.5 has even better BCs and SDs and many a 6.5x55 has brought down many a moose and elk.

To each his own, I guess, but if bigger is better, get a .45-70.

 

[35 Whelen]

Why is an energy comparison "ridiculous"? Energy kills. I like the 7mm Rem Mag, myself. A 160 Nosler Partition delivers a hefty punch way out there. It's all about the construction of the bullet. I particularly like Barnes bullets, too. I shoot 'em in .308 for hogs. I KNOW they'll penetrate AND expand, no problem.

With a .35 caliber FLAT NOSE SWC, I don't need expansion to kill, but I also can't shoot as far due to pathetic BCs. One reason I like 7mm is the BCs. 6.5 has even better BCs and SDs and many a 6.5x55 has brought down many a moose and elk.

To each his own, I guess, but if bigger is better, get a .45-70.

SIGH..... Energy does NOT kill anything. A bullet that destroys tissue and blood vessels kills. If energy were the sole basis on which a bullet killed, then a .223 with a 55 gr. SP would have the equivalent killing power or capacity as a 44 Rem Mag (rifle) with a 240 gr. SP @ @ 100 yds. because they have similar "energy" levels.
Remember: A .45 caliber, 500 gr. roundnose FMJ bullet at, say 2000 fps, has exactly the same energy as a .45 caliber, 500 gr. roundnose SP bullet at 2000 fps, BUT shoot both of them through the lungs of a bull moose and guess which one kills better?

"Energy", in and of itself, is nothing more than a mathmatical formula that was intended to be used in comparing similar caliber/weight bullets to one another.

So, to suggest that a .30 caliber bullet at xxxx fps, will have the same killing "power" as a similarly constructed .35 caliber bullet at the same xxxx fps is...well....ridiculous.

And with regards to flat trajectory, IMHO there's little to discuss here as inexpensive rangefinders have eliminated most of the need for a rifle that shoots .5" flatter or has a "maximum point blank range" of 3.643 yds. further than another rifle.

35W

 

[jim in Anchorage]

If you have time to use the rangefinder.

 

[MCgunner]

SIGH..... Energy does NOT kill anything.

That's a common belief that I do not agree with. Read up on some of Dr. Michael Courtney's work. It's quite convincing. He is a PhD physicist and knows about the subject, studies "ballistic pressure waves".

I've had way too many DRT kills with lung shots to believe that energy isn't responsible. Your argument has some merit with lower power handguns. They do produce a ballistic pressure wave, but crush cavity is far more important in, say, a 200 ft lb .380 ACP. But, in a rifle cartridge producing 3500 ft lbs, the pressure wave is important. At rifle velocities, not just neural damage, but tissue damage, sometimes massive tissue damage with the right bullet, can be see WELL away from the path of the bullet. Whole shoulders blown off game by a piddlin' little 7mm bullet is common.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I think, though, that the old naught six will kill anything the .35 can kill just as dead.

And you can say the 6.5 Swede will kill anything the .30-06 will kill. And the .243 will kill anything the 6.5 Swede will kill. And we can keep on until we conclude the .22 short will kill anything any other cartridge will kill.

But by and large, the more powerful cartridges give you a bit of leeway you don't have with lesser cartriges -- when you have to take that less-that-perfect shot.