Long_Range_Mauser
Member
I have been looking at the local shop. He has a CZ 52 ( think) in 7.62x25. Comes with 2 mags and a holster for $175. Can anyone tell me how well they shoot or how the ballistics of that round are.
Anyone here shoot CZ 52
- Thread starter Long_Range_Mauser
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havoc7usmc
Member
Good to go
I have two CZ 52's and enjoy them for there durability, the accuracy is OK, it's not the gun but the small sights. The 7.62X25 round is nothing to laugh at
and has a pretty good punch. Some of the ammo on the market is suspect to being over charged. I use only S&B ammo in mine. If you have some machining skills you can put some decent sights on it. I don't think you could buy anything else with that kind of power and durability for $175.
Have fun with it and look at some of the CZ 52 web sites.
I have two CZ 52's and enjoy them for there durability, the accuracy is OK, it's not the gun but the small sights. The 7.62X25 round is nothing to laugh at
and has a pretty good punch. Some of the ammo on the market is suspect to being over charged. I use only S&B ammo in mine. If you have some machining skills you can put some decent sights on it. I don't think you could buy anything else with that kind of power and durability for $175.
Have fun with it and look at some of the CZ 52 web sites.
Claude Clay
Member
fun gun & all goood things to say BUT--do not trust the decocker: it can become a 'second' trigger--actually firing a chambered round when you de-cock it. try to avoid over use of the SMG rounds as they shorten the guns useful life. and are a no-no in a t-33 anyways.
one of mine came with a 9mm bbl and that just makes it all the more fun to shoot.
one of mine came with a 9mm bbl and that just makes it all the more fun to shoot.
Rmac58
Member
Mine is accurate, and fun to shoot. That seems to be a good price.
mulletguter
Member
Neat pistol for the price. Don’t dry fire it. Firing pins have been known to break. You can get new SS pins online. You can find 1224rd tins of Romanian 7.62x25 online for about $120.00 + ship. It’s good ammo.
woad_yurt
Member
If you get it, order up a Harrington firing pin and trigger kit. It'll work wonders. They're great pistols.
Long_Range_Mauser
Member
Sweet, I think ill have to buy it then.
mulletguter
Member
I have both and enjoy shooting them. Also have different kinds of 45s 357s 9mms 8mm. 7.62s and on and on Enjoy them all
chris in va
Member
Hated mine. Everyone talked about how 'cool' and fun it is to shoot, but look closely at the design.
See the curve below the trigger guard? That thing slices and dices worse than a cheesy infomercial carrot grater. Ow.
Then there's the 'sights', or lack thereof. Mine shot literally 1' below POA at 15 yards. Not sure why.
How about the iffy decocker? Or the less than durable firing pin.
I sold it after about two months. That was enough for me.
If I absolutely *had* to get something in x25, it would be the Tokarev.
See the curve below the trigger guard? That thing slices and dices worse than a cheesy infomercial carrot grater. Ow.
Then there's the 'sights', or lack thereof. Mine shot literally 1' below POA at 15 yards. Not sure why.
How about the iffy decocker? Or the less than durable firing pin.
I sold it after about two months. That was enough for me.
If I absolutely *had* to get something in x25, it would be the Tokarev.
My main gripe with them now is the cost. For $100 or less, they might be interesting toys. But for the $150+ they're typically going for now, plus the money that you have to spend (unless you get lucky) for a reliable firing pin, working magazines, and a safe decocker, not worth it IMO.
Cz 52
Only 762x25 pistol that can be loaded to some impressive velocities. Read the Accurate Powder Co. reloading info on this gun and it will approach M1 carbine ballistics using Starline Brass. Ha ven't loaded any yet but one day I'll finish the honeydolist.afish4570
Only 762x25 pistol that can be loaded to some impressive velocities. Read the Accurate Powder Co. reloading info on this gun and it will approach M1 carbine ballistics using Starline Brass. Ha ven't loaded any yet but one day I'll finish the honeydolist.afish4570
Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
member
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2007
- Messages
- 13,146
The CZ-52 is not as strong as the TT-33. The barrel was thinned out for one of the rollers, which is it's mmajor weak point. You can fire regular 7.62x25 through it all day, but please do not try to hotrod the round.
From a post at the Firing Line:
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.
=========================================================================
B) The questioning of the "CZ52 is stronger than the Tokarev" myth on
the internet
=========================================================================
2000
1) I blew up 2 CZ52 pistols that split the barrels and took pictures.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachmen...7&d=1059258212
2) Ken Marsh, long time rec.guns contributor, pointed out that the crack
propagation seemed to start from a think spot in the chamber chamber
where there was undercutting for space for the roller blocks.
2003
1) Jaque Clarke "Uncle Jaque", a CZ52 owner, makes a drawing of this
thin spot. Here is the drawing:
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachmen...47360&d=116269...
2) I am unable to blow up any of my Tokarev pistols, with what blows up
CZ52s and much more.
3) I buy a broom handle 1896 Mauser 30 Mauser to compare to CZ52
strength. It blows primers, but does not blow up at the loads that blow
up CZ52s. I cannot go higher with these primers.
2005:
1) John Becrovitz, long time rec.guns contributor, buys 10 CZ52 barrels
and tests them for hardness. Measurements between RC25 and RC35 were
taken on intact 7.62x25mm barrels. A more modern 9mm CZ52 barrel tests
at RC47.
2) Accurate Arms "revised" their hot loads for the CZ52 only. This
example is for 110 gr SPR RN 1.3":
a) The hot load from 2000: 11.7 gr AA#9 41,800 c.u.p 1688 fps
b) The wimpy load from 2005 8.5 gr AA#9, 34270 psi, 1248 fps
http://www.accuratepowder.com
click on "30 (7.62)"
click on "7.62x25 Tokarev"
"Lynn,
As a result of various technical reasons, the data in the initial print
(year 2000) of the no 2 guide were not tested against a verifiable
standard or protocol.
As a result wrong conclusions and assumptions were made. The result was
that the initial loads were too high.
The recent adjustments were made in two phase’s i.e.
a) A Reduction in velocity to conform to the correct barrel length since
the initial velocities was for a 9” test barrel.
b) The adjustment of the actual charge weights to conform to the only
Specification/protocol in existence i.e. CIP “Commission International
Permanente” which is the authority, since this caliber does come from
Europe.
This pressure limit is : <2400bar or 34809Psi.
The final loads as published on the website are thus inline with these
standards.
However, due to the strong design of the CZ 52 pistol, people have been
using ex submachine gun(i.e. PPsh-41) ammunition from the eastern bloc,
which obviously were loaded to a much higher levels, and some of these
will function in the CZ 52 pistol. However, there is ammunition that
will even destroy the CZ 52.
Although the CZ52 gun can handle much higher pressures than some other
weapons it has never been incorporated into an official specification.
The strength of this gun is renowned, which lead to many “estimations”
of performance and a reputation of being able to handle just about
anything out there on the market.
This is obviously not true and we deemed it necessary to conform to the
official International specifications for the cartridge.
Regards
Johan Loubser
Ballistic Lab manager
Accurate Powders"
What does it all mean?
I have never got any published source to recant in print the myth about CZ52 strength, but the current published loads for CZ52s, Tokarevs, and broomhandles is now below that of original factory ammo for CZ52s, Tokarevs, or broomhandles. The loads are now lower than the lowest common denominator. Admit no errors, but lower the loads was the reaction.
From a post at the Firing Line:
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.
=========================================================================
B) The questioning of the "CZ52 is stronger than the Tokarev" myth on
the internet
=========================================================================
2000
1) I blew up 2 CZ52 pistols that split the barrels and took pictures.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachmen...7&d=1059258212
2) Ken Marsh, long time rec.guns contributor, pointed out that the crack
propagation seemed to start from a think spot in the chamber chamber
where there was undercutting for space for the roller blocks.
2003
1) Jaque Clarke "Uncle Jaque", a CZ52 owner, makes a drawing of this
thin spot. Here is the drawing:
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachmen...47360&d=116269...
2) I am unable to blow up any of my Tokarev pistols, with what blows up
CZ52s and much more.
3) I buy a broom handle 1896 Mauser 30 Mauser to compare to CZ52
strength. It blows primers, but does not blow up at the loads that blow
up CZ52s. I cannot go higher with these primers.
2005:
1) John Becrovitz, long time rec.guns contributor, buys 10 CZ52 barrels
and tests them for hardness. Measurements between RC25 and RC35 were
taken on intact 7.62x25mm barrels. A more modern 9mm CZ52 barrel tests
at RC47.
2) Accurate Arms "revised" their hot loads for the CZ52 only. This
example is for 110 gr SPR RN 1.3":
a) The hot load from 2000: 11.7 gr AA#9 41,800 c.u.p 1688 fps
b) The wimpy load from 2005 8.5 gr AA#9, 34270 psi, 1248 fps
http://www.accuratepowder.com
click on "30 (7.62)"
click on "7.62x25 Tokarev"
"Lynn,
As a result of various technical reasons, the data in the initial print
(year 2000) of the no 2 guide were not tested against a verifiable
standard or protocol.
As a result wrong conclusions and assumptions were made. The result was
that the initial loads were too high.
The recent adjustments were made in two phase’s i.e.
a) A Reduction in velocity to conform to the correct barrel length since
the initial velocities was for a 9” test barrel.
b) The adjustment of the actual charge weights to conform to the only
Specification/protocol in existence i.e. CIP “Commission International
Permanente” which is the authority, since this caliber does come from
Europe.
This pressure limit is : <2400bar or 34809Psi.
The final loads as published on the website are thus inline with these
standards.
However, due to the strong design of the CZ 52 pistol, people have been
using ex submachine gun(i.e. PPsh-41) ammunition from the eastern bloc,
which obviously were loaded to a much higher levels, and some of these
will function in the CZ 52 pistol. However, there is ammunition that
will even destroy the CZ 52.
Although the CZ52 gun can handle much higher pressures than some other
weapons it has never been incorporated into an official specification.
The strength of this gun is renowned, which lead to many “estimations”
of performance and a reputation of being able to handle just about
anything out there on the market.
This is obviously not true and we deemed it necessary to conform to the
official International specifications for the cartridge.
Regards
Johan Loubser
Ballistic Lab manager
Accurate Powders"
What does it all mean?
I have never got any published source to recant in print the myth about CZ52 strength, but the current published loads for CZ52s, Tokarevs, and broomhandles is now below that of original factory ammo for CZ52s, Tokarevs, or broomhandles. The loads are now lower than the lowest common denominator. Admit no errors, but lower the loads was the reaction.
CapnMac
Member
I like my little CZ-52. Got a good deal on it, too. Even better as it was rebarreled to 9x19.
roller-locked action seems ludicrous overkill in such an itty-bitty thing--but, I'm not taking that as license to test the limits either.
Now, it's fun, but it's still got W-Pact ergonomics, and you are stuck with that extry-slippery grip, too.
But, it does make an interesting comparision for thouse wanting to winge on the ergonomics of, say, a Glock ('98 Mauser also helps this <g>).
Buck-and-a-half with two mags & holster seems very reasonable.
roller-locked action seems ludicrous overkill in such an itty-bitty thing--but, I'm not taking that as license to test the limits either.
Now, it's fun, but it's still got W-Pact ergonomics, and you are stuck with that extry-slippery grip, too.
But, it does make an interesting comparision for thouse wanting to winge on the ergonomics of, say, a Glock ('98 Mauser also helps this <g>).
Buck-and-a-half with two mags & holster seems very reasonable.
LightningCrash
Member
- Joined
- Jan 26, 2009
- Messages
- 60
#13 Dr Tad, I order stuff from Reed, he's a good guy.
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