Jail and prison is a horrible place. You don't want to go there, even people who work there don't want to be there. Visiting a prison is a depressing ugly experience, even a Federal one. Please don't take your permit or lack of one lightly or you will end up spending time in one of those terrible places, and it will change you forever. That's where all those guys you are trying to avoid are. Constitutional or not if it's the law you must abide by it or move some ware where it is allowed.
Anyone refuse to get a carry permit?
- Thread starter 35wailen
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Like them or not, laws are laws and if you don't abide by them you could wind up in jail. If you want to get serious about your perceived gun rights, exercise your most precious right, the right to vote. The legislators make the laws that we all have to abide by. On another note, for those that are worried about being on some government list due to fingerprinting, or filling out forms for license or gun purchase that's the least of your worries. If you use a cell phone, computer or credit card the government knows more about you and your daily life than you could ever imagine.
ForumSurfer
Member
Agreed, gym. I've worked in one, not as a guard though. Nothing could have prepared me for what it was like inside. I didn't care for it even though I could leave whenever I wanted...unless there was a lockdown and the goon squad was deployed. Then everyone gets down, period. I didn't like constantly watching my back at all. I also didn't like finding a few items a paranoid guard stashed. I thought it best to keep my mouth shut given my surroundings and sever lack of people I would trust in that place. Did my contract jobs and left. I work in IT and I'll never work a prison contract again. No thank you...at least in corporate environments getting stabbed in the back is figure of speech, in prison it is a real possibility.
bhhacker
Member
Ive done a lot of crazy **** when i was younger...(23 nowand have calemd down a bit
) but ive never been arrested ever. I would be very dissapointed in myself if I was given a felony charge or even taken in for processing for carrying without a permit.
Its kind of like a risk outweighing rewards pretty heavily in this case, though I do agree that having to pay extra to conceal carry is ridiculous.
) but ive never been arrested ever. I would be very dissapointed in myself if I was given a felony charge or even taken in for processing for carrying without a permit. Its kind of like a risk outweighing rewards pretty heavily in this case, though I do agree that having to pay extra to conceal carry is ridiculous.
ForumSurfer
Member
Actually prisons are nicer. I caught so much crap from the staff when I suggested ripping out the LCD TV’s prisoners were enjoying in certain areas so that my father could have a TV in his VA hospital room. I’m sorry, people can cry out about prison rights and where certain budgets are funded all they want…there is no excuse as to why a prisoner’s quarters or general assembly area should have more or higher quality amenities than our nations veterans. You’re going to spend your life serving our country only to see a prison infirmary and general quarters have a higher standard? It disgusted me to the point I was physically, literally sick to my stomach as I had just visited my father the night before in a VA hospital. It’s a disgusting, filthy situation. Veterans deserve better than criminals, end of story.
jcwit
member
Actually the one I go to here In Northern Indiana is first rate, and the care is super. It is an old building but so is the much of the main hospital in South Bend. If you are having a problem with the conditions at the local VA facilities, don't gripe here but do something constructive and contact your Congressmen and Senators. Complaining here accomplishes nothing.
I've been in a few different hosiptals and cancer centers in the last decade and my local VA is as good if not better then any.
Regarding concealed carry without a permit is making no more of a statement than trying to take the law into ones own hands and being judge and jury. But I suppose if you wish to make your statement even tho illegal go for it, just don't ask for any sympathy when you're caught.
leadcounsel
member
If it's a money issue, offer to pay it for him...
He's fine until he gets caught, then it's loss of firearm, jail, court, lawyers, and maybe prison and big fines.
He's fine until he gets caught, then it's loss of firearm, jail, court, lawyers, and maybe prison and big fines.
razorback2003
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Cost VS Benefit
If I lived in a state where open carry and car carry is an option without a permit, like in Louisiana, I can understand folks not wanting to get a permit. It would be best then to openly carry on a belt when out of your car and you are fine down there. I know some states, like Arizona, are the same thing. I don't have a lot of sympathy for folks in states that have great open carry laws (AZ, Louisiana, Colorado) concealing illegally without a permit. They can't claim they have the 'right' to conceal when they can openly carry for free.
I see a little bit of folks' argument who live in states like Tennessee (where I live) who must have a permit to carry whether open or concealed...basically to carry in public or in the car loaded that it is an infringement. Yes, in an ideal word open carry would be free in TN (like Louisiana/AZ) and conceal would be free. The problem is that dealing with a misdemeanor weapons charge in TN is going to cost more than the permit from the state. Lawyer, court time, trying to cut a deal with the prosecutor to get the charges dropped, paying court costs, fine. Yeah you won't go to jail or prison here with a clean record over carrying a handgun without a permit generally since it is a misdemeanor...but it will be a hassle.......think of it as dealing with a DWI/DUI....BIG HASSLE.
If I lived in a state where open carry and car carry is an option without a permit, like in Louisiana, I can understand folks not wanting to get a permit. It would be best then to openly carry on a belt when out of your car and you are fine down there. I know some states, like Arizona, are the same thing. I don't have a lot of sympathy for folks in states that have great open carry laws (AZ, Louisiana, Colorado) concealing illegally without a permit. They can't claim they have the 'right' to conceal when they can openly carry for free.
I see a little bit of folks' argument who live in states like Tennessee (where I live) who must have a permit to carry whether open or concealed...basically to carry in public or in the car loaded that it is an infringement. Yes, in an ideal word open carry would be free in TN (like Louisiana/AZ) and conceal would be free. The problem is that dealing with a misdemeanor weapons charge in TN is going to cost more than the permit from the state. Lawyer, court time, trying to cut a deal with the prosecutor to get the charges dropped, paying court costs, fine. Yeah you won't go to jail or prison here with a clean record over carrying a handgun without a permit generally since it is a misdemeanor...but it will be a hassle.......think of it as dealing with a DWI/DUI....BIG HASSLE.
I haven't gotten a license to carry concealed yet. But, I'm thinking about getting one.
I don't feel the need to be armed to go out in public. And, if I ever did feel the need, I wouldn't ask for permission. But, it has become increasingly clear in this day and age, that as a hobbyist and competitive shooter, having a concealed carry license can be a convenience.
I don't feel the need to be armed to go out in public. And, if I ever did feel the need, I wouldn't ask for permission. But, it has become increasingly clear in this day and age, that as a hobbyist and competitive shooter, having a concealed carry license can be a convenience.
Autolycus
Member
People who carry without permits are just like drug dealers, murderers, and thieves. You cannot just pick and choose the laws you will obey because you dislike them. Anybody who does is a criminal and I hope they get caught. If your friend is caught with a firearm and he is carrying it illegally it will be one more gun crime made into a statistic that will be used against me.
the iron horse
Member
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"License requirements to carry a firearm are unconstitutional... plain and simple."
Not until the Supreme Court says so. Are you a member of the Supreme Court?
John
The Supreme Court is not the U.S. Constitution.
Not until the Supreme Court says so. Are you a member of the Supreme Court?
John
The Supreme Court is not the U.S. Constitution.
Some folks here need to slow down and think about what they're saying. Carrying a concealed firearm without a state mandated permit is the equivalent of murder and larceny. Really now?
If a person decides that they won't pay a state tax on a fundamental human right and instead chooses to conceal a Colt 1911 on their person and go about their business in a peaceable manner without harming or attempting to harm anyone else they are now the same as:
1) A man who stabs a woman to death while attempting to rape her
2) A man who breaks into his neighbor's home and steals the property which said neighbor worked each and every day to earn or
3) A man who sells cocaine to a nine year old boy who is incapable of truly understanding the danger of using such a substance in any meaningful way.
If you really believe that the above is true then you are profoundly misguided and ignorant. To compare an action which draws no blood and deprives no innocent person of life to a capital felony is absurd. This type of thinking is a result of a lack of clear, structured, well educated thought. No one with any ounce of moral or intellectual sense could compare a man like David Olafson to Charles Manson by implication and keep a straight face.
If a person decides that they won't pay a state tax on a fundamental human right and instead chooses to conceal a Colt 1911 on their person and go about their business in a peaceable manner without harming or attempting to harm anyone else they are now the same as:
1) A man who stabs a woman to death while attempting to rape her
2) A man who breaks into his neighbor's home and steals the property which said neighbor worked each and every day to earn or
3) A man who sells cocaine to a nine year old boy who is incapable of truly understanding the danger of using such a substance in any meaningful way.
If you really believe that the above is true then you are profoundly misguided and ignorant. To compare an action which draws no blood and deprives no innocent person of life to a capital felony is absurd. This type of thinking is a result of a lack of clear, structured, well educated thought. No one with any ounce of moral or intellectual sense could compare a man like David Olafson to Charles Manson by implication and keep a straight face.
mljdeckard
Member
On THR we do not condone, rationalize, encourage, or justify breaking the law.
I'm shocked at some of the replies to this thread.
The lawmakers could rule that breathing oxygen is now unlawful and half the people in this thread would hold their breath
Permits are stupid because people, good or bad, who want to carry a gun will do so whether it is legal or not.
The lawmakers could rule that breathing oxygen is now unlawful and half the people in this thread would hold their breath
Permits are stupid because people, good or bad, who want to carry a gun will do so whether it is legal or not.
mljdeckard
Member
No they couldn't, and we follow the law, PERIOD.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
You also have to be honest with yourself about what constitutes fighting for your rights and what does not. Simply refusing to pay for a permit and carrying anyway isn't fighting for your rights. It isn't doing ANYTHING for your rights except jeopardizing them.
Getting politically active, organizing and educating your peers and fellow constituents, calling, writing, and otherwise (respectfully) harassing your elected representatives is an effective means of fighting for your rights. Maybe not effective today, and maybe not tomorrow, but someday if enough people are persistent. That's how a representative republic works.
Simply saying that you will live outside the rule of law doesn't uphold the Constitution. As I stated before, deliberate, calculated, and PUBLIC acts of Civil Disobedience may be an effective route to directing society to change the way you want it to, including influencing your legislators to view the Constitution the way you do. Simple defiance of the laws of the land do NOT.
The fight IS worth it. But engage in the FIGHT, not is simple law-breaking.
If you carry without a permit you should get the same as anyone else caught breaking the law. There is no reason if you have the right to a permit not to get one. thats what seperates us from the outlaws. I am a stanch 2A guy with time in the Marines with trigger time. The 2A does not give me the right to own hand grenades or pipe bombs. It does give me the right to own a gun. I also have the right in the state i live in to get a permit. If you want to carry get a permit. Without that you are an outlaw.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Are you saying that NFA-regulated Title II "Destructive Devices" are not covered by the Second Amendment?
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