AR Upper for use with WOLF ammo?

[dust_101]

Ran Wolf in my Stag upper, but I built it with a Colt Defense 5.56 NON-CL Barrel and Colt BCG. The only issue I had was one time shooting a few stacks of Wolf, then switching to some brass .223 ammo to burn out. On the first round the brass expanded in the chamber and grabbed all the gunk in there, causing the round to stick with a FTE. After that was pulled out and the chamber swabbed, it ran fine.

If only shooting Wolf ammo, shouldn't be any problems. If you shoot a mixed bag, shoot the Wolf ammo last.

 

[jburnett]

I've heard this for years and there's some validity to it with the previous laquer-coated Wolf... But I haven't had a STITCH of problems with their ammo. Now, when it first came out with the laquer cases I DID have issues when I fired it out of my AR or M16 but never a single issue out of my AC556. Since the polymer coating has been out I've probably shot in excess of 10k rounds of it through my AC AND my AR's/M16 without ANY problems. The steel case can be rough on extractors (my MP5 has gone through a couple of extractor springs since I started shooting their 9mm) but I haven't had a stuck case or a separation EVER.

And, keep in mind I'm not afraid to shoot this stuff out of Form 4 registered full-autos...Which are, essentially, irreplaceable. If I'm not worried about f-ing up a $7k to $15k m.g. I don't believe others should be worried about it hurting their $1k AR...
-J.Burnett

 

[NWGunner]

Full-Auto with WOLF? Alright! The Del-Ton warning seems like more of a cover-your-butt type of disclaimer. I fully intend to use reloads, WOLF, steel cased ammo, etc. If I could afford to buy new brass-cased .223/5.56 at $.40 to $.50/round, then I wouldn't be buying a kit rifle. I've never shot any of my guns enough for them to need warranty work, so i'm not too concerned about it, either way.

jburnett makes a good point about worrying about ruining an irreplaceable gun. Utlimately, it's likely that a new BCG would be the most expensive repair needed, and those aren't astronomically expensive, compared to the ammo.

 

[RP88]

so wait...

what are the potential consequences - short and long term - of using steel and/or lacquer-coated ammo through an AR?

Since I'm gonna get an AR soon, I might need to know this

 

[Picard]

what are the potential consequences - short and long term - of using steel and/or lacquer-coated ammo through an AR?

None whatsoever. You just may have to clean your rifle after every range trip, not that you shouldn't do that already.

 

[RP88]

I clean my AK of all things after every session, so that won't be a problem. But, let's say you 'let your Ar go a bit' in terms of cleaning, start having failures, etc. Could/do those failures wear on any of the somewhat sensitive parts of the gun?

 

[NWGunner]

I don't always clean my guns after every session. Sometimes it's weeks, if not months in between cleanings. I would think that round-count in between cleanings would become significant at some point. For example, if I go to the range and fire ony 20 rounds, I probably won't clean the gun immediately afterward. This is especially true with my pistols. However, if I shoot 200+ rounds through any weapon, I usually clean it soon after the session.

Maybe we need to ask "How many rounds of WOLF in your AR between cleanings?" I've read 200 already.

 

[W.E.G.]

If you feel the need to buy Wolf ammo, you might want to consider just getting a Kalashnikov-pattern rifle for that purpose.

I had a goodly supply of crappy .223 ammo that failed horribly in my AR's.
The WASR-3 doesn't mind it a bit.

I would expect a SAIGA to tolerate crappy ammo.

 

[Ben Shepherd]

The steel case doesn't spring back as fast or as far as a brass case does. Ever wonder why that compared to any russian round the 223 remington has a fairly straight case wall? Is has to do with the sharper taper aiding extraction with the steel case.

Add that to a dirty or tightly machined chamber? Then compound the situation a coating that may be slightly sticky/graby? Poof!! There 'ya go, extraction trouble.

W.E.G.- All the saigas I have shot do indeed eat wolf without trouble.

 

[strat81]

If you feel the need to buy Wolf ammo, you might want to consider just getting a Kalashnikov-pattern rifle for that purpose.

Agreed. Between the cost of the upper and new mags, it makes sense to just get an AK.

 

[NWGunner]

Somehow I knew this thread was going to evolve into "just get an AK". Lol. I have a AK in 7.62x39 that I am quite happy with. Maybe an AK in .223/5.56 Is THE solution. Can't say I haven't wanted one...

Can anyone suggest a budget .223 AK model? Didn't see the WASR-3. I checked atlantic firearms to get an idea on price, $500 seems a little pricey, but I guess not compared to an AR upper. Oh hell, now I'm actually thinking of an AK in .223....

 

[R.W.Dale]

want an ar upper that'll run on wolf? do like I did and build a 7.62x39mm A2

If an AR wont run wolf it is a POS.

agreed and any manufacturer who says I can't handload is by default making POS'es

 

[Ben Shepherd]

Maybe an AK in .223/5.56 Is THE solution. Can't say I haven't wanted one...

Can anyone suggest a budget .223 AK model?

Yes you do. Thery're as much fun as you can have in public.

I suggest a saiga. Buy a new one in sporter configuration, build it into the exact configuration you want as time, funds, and desires dictate.

 

[tokarev762]

OMG! You mean that I trashed my AR with the 2000 rounds of Wolf that put through it!?!?

Sorry. Couldn't help it. Really though. I've heard that for years, but have never had a problem with it in any caliber(except the .22 lr stinks!).

The only reason I don't buy it anymore is because of the price of ALL ammo and l just reload for my AR now.




(actually I've still got 3 or 4 30 rounds mags of wolf left)

 

[RockyMtnTactical]

I find that a 5.56 chamber is more forgiving of Wolf than one that isn't. Unfortunately many makers mark their barrels as being 5.56 chambers that turn out not to be.

for example?

 

[jburnett]

I haven't even SEEN any laquer cased Wolf .223 (their early stuff) in at least a couple of years. I "may" have a case of it left in my stash (I bought 5k of it originally) but the majority of it was eaten by my Ruger AC556. Like I said in my above post, my M16 didn't care for it once it got HOT and I let a cartridge "cook" in the chamber. The laquer would gum up and the extractor (with its upgraded spring and d-ring) would pull the case in half. That only happened twice but was directly attributable to the laquer softening.

I bought about 5k rounds of the polymer coated ammo a couple of years ago (you know, when it was still $129.00 a case?? ) and I have had NO stoppages out of AR-type weapons that I can recall. You can let the polymer stuff cook in a chamber all you want, and believe me after a Beta-C it DOES cook: with no problems... At least I haven't had any...
-J.Burnett

 

[frankd4]

I went to a fighting carbine class they supplyed the AR's and we shot aprox 2,000 rounds of Wolf 223 with out any issues, since then I have shot ton of it through my LMT no Issues, If an OME tells you you can't shoot wolf then buy some thing better.

 

[mr..plow]

no problems with wolf in my rra 20" rifles..

 

[Leif Runenritzer]

A consequence of steel

I have witnessed a stuck steel case being removed from an AR-15, which i believe was polymer-coated Wolf. The gunsmith explained that the cause was filth getting in the chamber because of inadequate expansion of the steel case, and a further effect could be scarring of the chamber. After the chamber was cleaned, a single encircling line could be seen around it. According to the gunsmith, this was a scar left by the steel case, and if brass got hung up on it, the barrel would need to be replaced. It didn't really make much sense to me; how could this ring-shape appear in the chamber? What makes ARs so special that steel can damage their chambers? Oh well, not my problem.

 

[jburnett]

Again...I shoot the stuff outta my machineguns and have had ZERO issues. Your mileage may vary but it would surprise me.

The "ring" in the chamber was from where the case separated I would wager and was only a surface imperfection... I've seen separated brass make the EXACT same mark. A fine Cratex rod will polish it out w/o removing any material.

FWIW: This isn't related to Wolf but rather to one of my reloads D); my MP5 has had a bulge in the bbl. for the last 10 years due to an undiscovered squib load...It still shoots as accurately as ever and as reliably as ever (even with steel-cased Wolf 9mm).
-J.Burnett

 

[gvnwst]

i have had good experiance with wolf ammo, no failure to extract, ect. mabye it is because i have a POF gas piston rifle, but nobody i know has had any problems either. mabye some rifles have specs that conflict with the ammo specs, but i haven't found any yet...

 

[daskro]

I have LMT build AR and have put a few thousand rounds of wolf/silver bear/barnaul with no problems what so ever. I clean it after every 150 rounds or so and the extractor is still fine. I think this "don't use wolf in ARs" becomes less of a problem when you have a higher quality AR build and if anything you may have to replace your extractor.