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Best Combat/Defense Pistol

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by TFIT, Jan 11, 2013.

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  1. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    A full size 1911...
     
  2. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    I carry the gun in the small of my back, so you would be right. I'm not looking to have an incredibly fast draw. Hopefully, I'll never have to! Having said that, I have carried the weapon in just about every possible position over the years, and from my experience, anything worn under clothing is going to be somewhat of a "slow" draw. I would hope I can talk my way out of any encounter, but at the end of the day, if someone approaches you with a weapon drawn and bearing down on you, you'll be lucky to make it out alive anyway. I choose to carry in the small of the back for comfort and concealability.

    WRT how fast I pull the trigger and accuracy, at distances ranging form 5 to 15 yards, I am able to put all my shots in center mass and can discharge 10 rounds within five seconds +/-. Bear in mind when I say center mass, I am talking about full-sized man targets from the waist line to the shoulders, and side to side (inside arms). Most of my hits are upper region with a few stragglers below absolute center target. Obviously a little tighter groups at closer range. With this work, I'm not taking time to aim. I'm just pointing and shooting with both eyes open.

    There was absolutely nothing wrong with the slide or any other part of the DA weapon (Sig P226 MK 25). After significant time on the range, I just figured out I was pulling the trigger before it had time to reset. I didn't have that problem before working with the Glock Gen4, but afterwards, I noticed I was in fact short stroking the Sig. It is all me, not the weapon. I started to work with the Sig to break the short stroking, but then it hit me...bruh, if you're as accurate and comfortable with the Glock as you are the Sig, why bother! I like the low profile of the Glock...it's easier to conceal, and I am proficient with it. No brainer, uh! I also noticed this does not happen with the 1911; however, I'm just not quite as accurate with the 1911. I manage the recoil of the 9MM much better than the .45, but I sure do love the way that 1911 fits my hand, and when I slow down a little, I am as accurate. But, at the end of the day, I carry the G17...I am just more comfortable with it. I've gotten used to the Glock's constant trigger pull, and I am most proficient with it. :)

    Now, if I am deployed, I'll have to work with the M9...I'll cross that bridge when I get there. With any luck, I'll never have to use it...which means I'll be able to satisfy any encounter with my M4. ;-)
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2013
  3. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    Nice attempt at cleverness jackass. I served 12 years on active duty, and now serve in the reserves. Perhaps next time you will consider the fact you do not know everything before you pressume you do. Please, spare me your idiotic opinions.
     
  4. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    LOL!!! Get good at reloading? Good one!
     
  5. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    Yeah, that always sounds better in the head, but the truth is most people will never encounter that scenario. Realistically speaking, I'm looking for personal opinions from experience with a specific weapon. Thanks, though!
     
  6. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    Thanks for your input! Sometimes it's just good to know your own perspective is on point. :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2013
  7. C0untZer0

    C0untZer0 Member

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    If we were going to copy the British then we would have switched to BHPs a long time ago - instead of the Beretta...
     
  8. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    You idiot! It isn't about copying the British. It's about money. The US Armed Forces issue the Beretta M9 for one reason. Beretta won a bidding war. However, the US has been considering replacing the M9 for several years now. A number of platforms have been considered for this replacement, one of which is the Glock 17 9MM. They have been considering reaplacing the M9 for a number of reasons, but mainly due to cost. If you really knew anything about it, you would at the least acknowledge this; however, you continue to submit unqualified opinions. The M9 is a very large and finicky weapon that requires a lot of maintenance which takes time and money. The Glock, however, does not require a significant amount of maintance, and the cost is far less than the Beretta. I know traditional thinking says the US will never issue a weapon with no external safety, but the truth is they already do. It is the Sig P226. Granted this weapon is issued to special operators, but it was also the 2nd runner up to the Beretta losing only due to cost, not b/c of no external safety. Training will take care of new technology. Money wins every time!

    When it all comes down to it, Glocks are far less expensive than Berettas or Sigs, and with the way the economy is going for the US, it would not be surprising to see the USAF eventually go with a proven pistol such as the Glock. It really has little to do with copying the British as much as it has to do with economics and politics, but to say we don't copy the British is simply stupid when we have worked with, received technology and taken training from them so many times in the past. Suffice it to say you have no idea what you're talking about.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2013
  9. David E

    David E Member

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    Even if the draw itself is dangerous? Interesting.

    With all due respect, you're not doing it right.

    Again, with all due respect, you weren't. Above, you cited splits (time between shots) of 1/2second, or .5 The gun cycles in about .05, so your ability to pull the trigger is ten times slower than the gun cycles. Your later assessment of short-stroking the trigger is correct.

    Well, that's why they make Fords and Chevys, too! It sucks to fight your own equipment when you don't have to. Many don't realize that they are, then wonder why they never get better.
     
  10. Roadking Rider

    Roadking Rider Member

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    There is no best ,only opinions.
    The best choices for me would be a full size 1911 45acp , CZ75b 9mm, or CZPO-1 9mm. There are a lot of good pistols out there in todays market but those three are my favorite simply because there reliable and I shoot them the best
     
  11. MrBorland

    MrBorland Moderator

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    Chill, TFIT.

    You're certainly entitled to your opinion, as we all are, but being new on THR, I respectfully ask you to re-read the THR rules before resorting to any further name-calling, or trouncing others for their opinion. A moderator will likely be along make it clearer for you.
     
  12. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    You know, there is always someone like you who seems to think they have a better grip on things than anyone else. Sure, you have a right to your opinion, but that doesn't make your opinion right. Perhaps in giving yours you could figure out a better way to do so. In other words, stop trying to be so clever or cute with silly statements such as "if you want combat step away from your xbox". What, did you really think that was funny? Come on bruh...perhaps you should chill and think before you offer your opinion. This is a written forum, not a public meeting room where we exchange ideas in person, so you really don't come across the way you might think. Just food for thought.
     
  13. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    No offense taken. If you have some recommendations, I'm always open to it. Maybe I wasn't communicating my experiences accurately enough, but I think we agree what I was doing was short stroking the Sig. In my mind, with my limited knowledge of trigger resets, it just made sense to me that that is what was happening...in short, short stroking is not giving the trigger enough time to reset. Is that inaccurate?

    On the carry position, I can't tell you exactly how I would draw in a given situation, and I can see your point on the danger aspect. My natural draw, when not under duress, is to bring it out free and clear from the body, but I'll concede that may very well change depending on the encounter. Give me some recommendations!
     
  14. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    As you probably read, I do love the 1911 .45. Great pistol! I also like the CZ75...that is one well designed and proven pistol as well. I also agree with your input. It is what works best for YOU. That is what my experience has proven to me, and it is backed up by the many I've talked with, such as yourself. Thanks for your input bro!
     
  15. 460Shooter

    460Shooter Member

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    It isn't so much a time thing, as it is that you are not allowing the trigger to reset all the way before pulling the trigger again. The mechanism is not cycling fully.

    I short stroked a Ruger LCR in the store, so I went with a S&W 642 instead. Trigger worked better for me.
     
  16. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    Yeah, I guess that is what I'm saying...it isn't a "timing" think as much as "room" thing...not giving the trigger enough room to reset before I'm trying to depress it again. Hurt my feelings too b/c I have been partial to P226 for a long time. At any rate, I guess it is a moot point since I've finally decided to go with the G17. Can't go wrong with either weapon...as long as it is the right weapon for you given the choice.
     
  17. buck460XVR

    buck460XVR Member

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    While we all are entitled to our opinions, name calling is not really the "High Road". MrBorland is very knowledgeable and highly respected here on THR. While he, like many of us sometimes makes a assumption that is not accurate, two wrongs never a right makes. While many here may not share your personal opinion of what is "the best", and why you believe their firearms are not worthy, none have resorted to name calling.

    ......just sayin'.
     
  18. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    Buck, I'm not going to argue on the high road. Simply stated, you're right, but I don't think I have belittled anyone's opinion on a specific firearm. The only reason I responded to the guy the way I did is b/c I took his comments as silly and denigrating. Thanks for your input, but I'm a grown man just like you. If he wants respect let him give it. Just sayin...
     
  19. David E

    David E Member

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    Yes, that's inaccurate. Short stroking the trigger means you're not letting it come forward far enough to mechanically reset. Time has nothing to do with it.
     
  20. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    And goes BANG every time.

    Everything else is just foolish favoritism.
     
  21. TFIT

    TFIT Member

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    Understood...thanks for your input! Enjoyable.
     
  22. C0untZer0

    C0untZer0 Member

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    TFIT said
    And I said:

    IMO you haven't explained your logic, you've said it isn't about copying the British, but some how their adoption "will lead the way to the US doing the same upon their next replacement".

    How is their adoption of any sidearm going to affect what sidearm is used by our military?
     
  23. easyg

    easyg Member

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    There's nothing dangerous about drawing from the small of the back if you practice doing it correctly.
    Reach back and grasp the pistol grip, unholster with an upward motion, once the pistol has cleared the holster extend your arm downward keeping the barrel pointed toward the ground, swing your arm and the pistol in a very slight arc around your hip and up to a shooting position.
    If you do this, at no time will you ever sweep your own body while drawing.
    And with practice it becomes smooth and surprisingly fast.

    As for what's the best combat/defense pistol....

    For COMBAT (and I mean war) I would have to recommend a high capacity 9mm pistol like the Glock 17 or the XD 9.
    When one is going to war one expects to fight many many enemy combatants.
    So capacity is important...more rounds between reloads is better than less rounds between reloads.

    For self defense capacity is not quite as important.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2013
  24. David E

    David E Member

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    Using the palm out cavalry twist draw results with the person likely pointing the gun at their pelvis during the draw, so I hope the practice is done in earnest. And, as I said in Post #17, even if you're not pointing the gun at yourself, it's a slow draw.

    That's a lot to do properly when micro-seconds count.....

    It's faster and more consistent to draw palm-in from a 3-4 o'clock position, not to mention faster. As an example, my fastest draw using a 5" Colt 1911 from an IWB BraveHeart rig from concealment starting with my hand on the jacket front was a witnessed .73
     
  25. easyg

    easyg Member

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    Not really. It just takes practice.

    I can draw and shoot in 1 second, so you're definitely faster than I am, but not by much.
    Besides, speed isn't everything.

    I've carried at the 3-4 o'clock position before and hated it.
    I've spent lots of money trying various different holsters but it still sucked....especially with a full sized pistol.
    It's very uncomfortable to me and also looks like I have a colostomy bag or a tumor on my side.
     
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