Best SD ammo for .38 Snubby

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What is the best carry for a .38 Special snubby, in particular a J-frame like my S&W 442. I recall somewhere on this site someone recommending either wad cutters or semi-wad cutters. I was in a LGS today asking about that and they were adamant that wad cutters are no good for SD but good for punching holes in paper, and semi-wad cutters are not good for SD. They recommended Hornady JHP.

Also he asked if my snubby is rated +P and the other guy there said that would be horrible to shoot out of a J-frame. Seriously? I think the +P is 20,000 psi vs regular at 17,000 or something like that. Seems pretty minor to me.

The other LGS sold me some Magtech jacketed soft points and seemed to agree they would be good for SD. I have that or the Hornady I bought a couple years ago (XTP I think). I was carrying the Black Hills honeybadgers (cross bladed bullet tips), but figure with the liberal prosecutors these days, I can only carry those if I am in certain very conservative jurisdictions, not Wayne County (Detroit area) Michigan.

For now I am banking on the jacketed soft points with the Hornady JHP in my speed strip because I don't want to rub lead into my pocket lining.
 
A rabid raccoon might not be the ultimate SD target, however both Buffalo Bore and Underwood offer a 150 gr WC load for SD.
Have used both in a 38 SPL Ruger LCR - think I had the BB load for the raccoon that was snarling at me from the raided garbage-
took the 'coon right in the boiler room at about 10 steps, Not sure the 'coon knew what hit him. Both of these loads have been accurate
in the LCR, easy to shoot and so far effective. Shot placement is vital, no matter the load.
 
Are Semi-Wadcutters really that effective… say compared to modern Bonded JHP
 
If I had to carry a snub, it would be with a bullet that penetrates at least 12'' and consistently expands from a 2'' barrel.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
Federal 130 HST Micro, Hornady FTX Critical Defense 110 +P, Golden Saber 125 +P, Winchester 130 +P PDX Defender.

I do not see a 158 LSWCP +P that can accomplish both of those goals from a 2'' barrel.
Wadcutter? Poor performer compared to the loads I listed above, Winchester 148 Super Match wadcutter - 15.8'' / .36 (Expand it does not)
In contrast the Golden Saber with 13.9'' / .62
 
Ill second what you shoot best with over something that may or may not do what its supposed to and/or can make the gun more difficult to shoot with.

The snubbies, and especially the Airweights, take a good bit more work on your part to get and stay decent with them, and that generally requires a lot of shooting. 50, 100 rounds of full power ammo out of an Airweight at an outing isnt a whole lot of fun, but necessary if youre carrying one.

These days, if I were to go back to carrying one, Id use the same standard velocity 158 grain LSWC's I use with my other 38's and shoot all the time in practice. Accuracy isnt an issue, and I know they will still perform and penetrate out of the short barrels, which is something I think is better than counting on a bullet that may or may not expand, due to what it goes through and loss of velocity.
 
Post 6 beat me to posting the LuckyGunner link.
I'll add, finding .38 Special ammo at a good price is often hard to do.
I'm not too picky about what ammo I'll carry, but it's typically a name brand JHP and then I buy a case.
Right now, I've still got several 50-round boxes of Winchester 125 grain "Silvertip" .38 Special +P. "X38S8HP" seems to be the product number on the boxes. I don't know if it's even being packaged in 50 round boxes anymore as I don't see it on the website:

I also was carrying Winchester "Ranger" ammo, but I don't seem to have anymore left in my small inventory. Apparently, this is still packaged in 50 round boxes (for a better price per round):
 
Go to you tube and search 38 special snubby for many videos of performance. I used to prescribe to the light JHP 110/125 HP group but lately the 158 SWC or even grandpa‘s 158 RN still performs with good penetration. If wadcutters are loaded to full pressure, sure…..but most factory wadcutters are reduced velocity for punching paper. My cast reloaded wadcutters (3.0 grains bullseye) are for indoor range shooting and sometimes bounce back from the ground rubber backstop.
 
Lucky Gunner as mentioned did some good testing on this.

I prefer 158gr LSWC myself or 148gr WC myself, loaded hot. May not expand but penetrate well and cut a clean hole of good size. Plus, a bit cheaper (even more so if you reload) than the HP options. I'm always a bit leery of HP's from a short barrel expanding, and then they perform more like a FMJ. Also, the best HP's are rather $$ so people don't train with them much which also would be a concern for me.
 
Ohen Cepel said:
Lucky Gunner as mentioned did some good testing on this.

I prefer 158gr LSWC myself or 148gr WC myself, loaded hot. May not expand but penetrate well and cut a clean hole of good size. Plus, a bit cheaper (even more so if you reload) than the HP options. I'm always a bit leery of HP's from a short barrel expanding, and then they perform more like a FMJ. Also, the best HP's are rather $$ so people don't train with them much which also would be a concern for me.
Click to expand...
Lead 158 grain semi wadcutter for me for the same reasons.
 
L-2 said:
Post 6 beat me to posting the LuckyGunner link.
I'll add, finding .38 Special ammo at a good price is often hard to do.
I'm not too picky about what ammo I'll carry, but it's typically a name brand JHP and then I buy a case.
Right now, I've still got several 50-round boxes of Winchester 125 grain "Silvertip" .38 Special +P. "X38S8HP" seems to be the product number on the boxes. I don't know if it's even being packaged in 50 round boxes anymore as I don't see it on the website:

I also was carrying Winchester "Ranger" ammo, but I don't seem to have anymore left in my small inventory. Apparently, this is still packaged in 50 round boxes (for a better price per round):
Click to expand...

Back in the day 1982 I bought a box of those in +p. I’ve still got most of them. I test fired them into a couple wet Denver City phone books and they dug out a ragged .50 caliber. That’s from a SW Model 28 w/ 4” . My buddy shot the same books with the same ammo in 45 ACP and it didn’t even come close in penetration and opened up a very little bit.
 
Mark_Mark said:
Are Semi-Wadcutters really that effective… say compared to modern Bonded JHP
Click to expand...
Advantage of wadcutter and semi-wadcutter is that the mechanics of the bullet are not entirely based upon speed - they'll cut a nice hole. Whereas hollowpoints make a bigger hole if they expand but a smaller one if they don't and the majority of hollowpoints don't expand reliably out of 2" barrels. Wadcutters are also touted for easier recoil and follow-up shots but if you look at the ones from BB or Underwood they're aimed a little more towards penetration than easy shooting.

I also like that the 148-158gr WC and SWCs shoot to most snubbie's point of aim. The lighter weight hollowpoints are going to impact low.
 
With carrying a 442/642 the past 12+ years, I have went full circle. I started with 158 & 125 grain hollow points mostly XTPs. After watching many YouTube videos reading articles, and enjoying the threads of THR I have switched.
I currently carry Hornady 110 FTX Critical Defense. Both the +p and standard velocity make the FBI minimums in a 2" barrel.

If I am hiking the wilderness I have been carrying Underwood 158 grain hardcast +p even from the 2" barrel it is getting 1100 fps.
 
nugi said:
Advantage of wadcutter and semi-wadcutter is that the mechanics of the bullet are not entirely based upon speed - they'll cut a nice hole. Whereas hollowpoints make a bigger hole if they expand but a smaller one if they don't and the majority of hollowpoints don't expand reliably out of 2" barrels. Wadcutters are also touted for easier recoil and follow-up shots but if you look at the ones from BB or Underwood they're aimed a little more towards penetration than easy shooting.

I also like that the 148-158gr WC and SWCs shoot to most snubbie's point of aim. The lighter weight hollowpoints are going to impact low.
Click to expand...
Well, that’s a good excuse to carry Wadcutters in my Colt Detective and S&W 36!!!
 
Lots of good suggestions, some tried and true. I’ve carried either a J frame or a Colt Agent for years and my choices have been generally toward the heavier loads. It seems that all snubbys (and maybe 38 specials) come factory zeroed for 158 gr loads. But that could just be my experience.

For the last several years I’ve used the Buffalo Bore 158LSWCHP in standard pressure for my 442 and/or Agent. I have had accurate results from the “newer” Federal 130 HST load, and 135gr Gold Dot (if you can find them).

Old school is a 148 HBWC loaded upside down, the softer the better. It doesn’t take much to get one to open if that hardness isn’t there. I’ve seen them open to quarter size. Bottom line, a snubby is for bad-breath distance, so hits count. I’d be more concerned with that than anything else.
 
CDW4ME said:
If I had to carry a snub, it would be with a bullet that penetrates at least 12'' and consistently expands from a 2'' barrel.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
Federal 130 HST Micro, Hornady FTX Critical Defense 110 +P, Golden Saber 125 +P, Winchester 130 +P PDX Defender.

I do not see a 158 LSWCP +P that can accomplish both of those goals from a 2'' barrel.
Wadcutter? Poor performer compared to the loads I listed above, Winchester 148 Super Match wadcutter - 15.8'' / .36 (Expand it does not)
In contrast the Golden Saber with 13.9'' / .62
Click to expand...
Glad you posted that link. I was going to post it until I saw that you did.
Personally, I like to carry Hornady Critical Defense mostly because it seems to be more available on gun store shelves and it’s accurate from my J frames. Golden Sabre and Federal HST are not as accurate.
It can be an expensive test, but buying all the top performers on Lucky Gunner’s list and shooting them to test accuracy and POA vs POI is very important as well.
Having the best performance in gel and having the best expansion doesn’t mean a thing if the round is not accurate from the gun you intend to carry.
That Luck Gunner test was a real eye opener for me. My favorite SD ammo for my J frames was Hornady’s American Gunner XTP .38 Special. It was the most accurate ammo in all my .38 Spl firing revolvers. It totally sux regarding expansion from a 2” barrel. I may as well have been carrying FMJ ammunition.
 
I have several videos gel testing 38 loads, so far the best for lots of expansion with sub optimal penetration (8-9”) is hst micro. Best for smaller expansion and sufficient penetration (within fbi standard of 12-18”) Hornady 110g+p ftx. The only one that gives both consistently… buffalo bore 158g+p lswchp, but it is an ABSOLUTE handful in an air weight.
 
Hornady Critical Defense 110gr +p and Critical Defense Lite 100gr are pretty good from a snub.

I think Federal has a special HST for .38, probably good.

Inceptor .38 would be a good choice if you want to forego any hope of expansion and use a fluted nose that tumbles in soft tissue.
 
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