Blackpowder Loads In The '73 Winchester

[krinko]

If I were to shoot the GOEX Black Dawg rounds in my historically inaccurate .45 caliber 1873s, would I have to go beyond removing the side plates and dust cover to get them clean?
When somebody stuck a +1/16" round in the tube and got it hung in the elevator, I had to take the butt off to get the dang thing out. This not something a sane man would want to do regularly.

I shoot the Snider and the Martini with the Holy Black---they're fairly simple mechanisms and appear to be designed for a regular tear-down scrubbing in the field.
Not the case with the Swiss Vetterli, the Mauser 71/84 or the lovely 1873s. (I read how Oliver Winchester impressed the Turks with his special Field Cleaning Technique, but if I do that, I will get kicked out of the rifle club tout de suite.)
Anyway, if you have experience here, let me hear about it, please.
-----krinko

 

[DocRock]

I am afraid I'm serving waffles today.

The 45LC is notorious for capacious chambers and tougher brass allowing more blowback than the 44-40, for example. So, 45s get more residue into the action. In a dry climate, I would clean bore and action through side plates after every shooting and only go for full disassembly every few shootings or if it was going away for a while. Id hit the action hard with Ballistol and leave it a little wet when doing so. This is no guarantee against corrosion. Would you like honey or maple syrup with your waffle?

 

[troy fairweather]

What docrock said. I miss my uberti 66 in 44-40 great with bp.

 

[Tommygunn]

If I were to shoot the GOEX Black Dawg rounds in my historically inaccurate .45 caliber 1873s, would I have to go beyond removing the side plates and dust cover to get them clean?
When somebody stuck a +1/16" round in the tube and got it hung in the elevator, I had to take the butt off to get the dang thing out. This not something a sane man would want to do regularly.

I shoot the Snider and the Martini with the Holy Black---they're fairly simple mechanisms and appear to be designed for a regular tear-down scrubbing in the field.
Not the case with the Swiss Vetterli, the Mauser 71/84 or the lovely 1873s. (I read how Oliver Winchester impressed the Turks with his special Field Cleaning Technique, but if I do that, I will get kicked out of the rifle club tout de suite.)
Anyway, if you have experience here, let me hear about it, please.
-----krinko

Now, that's got me curious! What was his special field cleaning technique?

 

[J-Bar]

I shot blackpowder .45 Colt in a Uberti ‘73 for years in cowboy action competition. Great fun!

The straight wall case allows some blowback. Minimize blowback by using heavy powder charges, heavy bullets (200-250 grains) and heavy crimps. This helps to expand the case and reduce blowback, but you will still get some on the carrier.

Prep the rifle by greasing the carrier, bolt, extractor, and the receiver metal surrounding the carrier. Spritz a little bit of aerosol Ballistol into these parts after every 50-60 rounds, or when the carrier starts to drag.

After shooting, the fouling can be wiped out of the exposed parts with a paper towel. I took the side plates off once a year in the winter for more thorough cleaning. Very little blowback gets back into the toggles. (I keep the toggles and insides of the side plates greased too.) I never found it necessary to remove the buttstock for anything. Cartridge jams that can’t be cleared otherwise can be cleared by removing the magazine plug and unloading the magazine. The jam on the carrier can be worked out backwards through the magazine. Careful, there’s a spring in there! Cleaning and lubing the magazine tube and spring once a year is a good idea if you shoot blackpowder anyway. Uniquetek makes a magazine tube plug wrench...it’s worth it. The slot in the magazine plug is too thin for conventional screw drivers.

http://uniquetek.com/product/T1380

 

[krinko]

I love waffles, Doc! Especially with Maple syrup...

" What was his special field cleaning technique?"
The story I heard was---Urination---without getting too descriptive.

J-Bar, thanks. Knowing what to watch out for is half way there.
-----krinko

 

[Tommygunn]

I love waffles, Doc! Especially with Maple syrup...

" What was his special field cleaning technique?"
The story I heard was---Urination---without getting too descriptive.

J-Bar, thanks. Knowing what to watch out for is half way there.
-----krinko

.... ooookay. I believe it. It's said WW2 servicemen freed up Garand actions in WW2 that had become frozen in winter warfare using the ....um, Oliver Winchester technique ....

 

[Cowhide Cliff]

Probably not, you can pretty much wipe out and clean around the bolt pretty good from there. With the WCF calibers I never even take the side plates off maybe every couple years on my guns I shoot a lot in main match cowboy action shooting. I only shoot black powder. I would be as worried about the bore fouling out with that stuff in a rifle, I only ever shot it in revolvers and it was horrible in short barrels.

Are they making Goex Black Dawg again? That was some of the dirtiest ammo you could shoot, I don't know what the bullets were but much not had much lube. I shot it in the 45 black powder shoot offs in NCOWS and won some of the ammo as a result and also bought a bunch of it since they were sponsoring the events. I never complained about it since they supplied the ammo for the events and then got free ammo as first place prize but it was some dirty stuff. If they are making it again I hope they are using different boolits or lube.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

You could also start reloading or using reloads that feature Universal Clays smokeless powder, and not worry about it. Universal Clays will load to black powder pressures, and will function well in .45 Colt, so you can use it with conversion cylinders in say a '58 Remington. Disqualifies you from the "black powder" cartridge subset in CAS though if you do use such cartridges....

LD

 

[foureyeshenry]

I too shoot 45 Colt in my Rossi in Frontier Cartridge and it has a generous chamber. Had my sizerdie reamed out a little ( I can thumb seat the bullet ) and use only MagTech ( CBC ) brass. That really works for me. I use 18 grains of BP, filler and the JP 200 grain Big Lube bullet.

 

[Jimster]

I’m sure it’s been said but the 44-40 seals the bore so well that the action remains practically spotless.

 

[Cowhide Cliff]

I’m sure it’s been said but the 44-40 seals the bore so well that the action remains practically spotless.

Yes and no, yes if you are slow firing but if shooting cowboy action rapid fire you will suck embers in the chamber area as the brass is ejected. Still 50 times cleaner than a rifle chambered in 45.

 

[Jimster]

No, I just plink but I envy those CAS guys that can empty the magazine with 12 or 13 lightening fast lever spankings with good accuracy. YouTube has some jaw dropping videos.

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Howdy

No, you absolutely do not have to go beyond removing the side plates to clean your '73.

Go to this post and read what I have to say on the second page of the post. My comments are about cleaning revolvers after firing them with Black Powder cartridges, but I treat my rifles the same way.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...revolver-cleaning.859465/page-2#post-11314725


Yes, 44-40 and 38-40 cases seal the bore better than 45 Colt does in a rifle, and I do not own any rifles chambered for 45 Colt, but if I did I would follow the same steps. Take apart as much of the action as you can, remove all petroleum based lubricants with alcohol, relube generously with Ballistol, and put everything back together again.

Yes, my 44-40 rounds keep almost all of the fouling out of the action of my 1860 Henry, and it only takes about 10 minutes max to clean without taking anything apart. Just as well because the side plates on a Henry are much more of a pain to remove than those on a '73.

No screw to remove with the Henry side plates. You have to remove the lever screw and lever, then drive the plates out with a soft mallet. And the front and rear edges are razor sharp, so keeping a box of band aides handy is always a good idea.

 

[Cowhide Cliff]

Howdy

No, you absolutely do not have to go beyond removing the side plates to clean your '73.

Go to this post and read what I have to say on the second page of the post. My comments are about cleaning revolvers after firing them with Black Powder cartridges, but I treat my rifles the same way.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...revolver-cleaning.859465/page-2#post-11314725


Yes, 44-40 and 38-40 cases seal the bore better than 45 Colt does in a rifle, and I do not own any rifles chambered for 45 Colt, but if I did I would follow the same steps. Take apart as much of the action as you can, remove all petroleum based lubricants with alcohol, relube generously with Ballistol, and put everything back together again.

Yes, my 44-40 rounds keep almost all of the fouling out of the action of my 1860 Henry, and it only takes about 10 minutes max to clean without taking anything apart. Just as well because the side plates on a Henry are much more of a pain to remove than those on a '73.

No screw to remove with the Henry side plates. You have to remove the lever screw and lever, then drive the plates out with a soft mallet. And the front and rear edges are razor sharp, so keeping a box of band aides handy is always a good idea.

View attachment 878587

Uberti changed theirs a few years back. Now the rear dovetail is backwards and the only thing holding it is the screws. Much easier to take apart.