Bullet 45-7O for 460 bore

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flibuste

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Hello,

A friend of mine has a Springfield Trapdoor and the bore is 460 ; do you know where he could get a bullet mould in 460 ?

Thanks for him

Regards
 
I would recommend a .461 dia. as it will give you a better seal. A lot of older barrels are not consistent in bore diameter so that extra .001 will make a difference.
 
Lee makes a 405 grain hollow base mold that casts a good copy of one of the original bullets designed for the 45-70. Not sure if they ship to you guys but worth looking for.
 
Yep,Strawhat nailed it.Not only is it hollow based so that the ''skirt'' expands to fill the rifling, but mine drops out of the mold at .459 cold,.461 with a hot mold.
 
Get it right!

Check out LBT bullet molds. I followed his instructions, which are simple to do and he made a custom mold to fit my rifle. It will shoot good groups with what ever I put behind the bullet, but when I hit on the right charge of powder it will shoot 3/4 to 1" groups at 100yds. I have done this with 3 different powders. Once you read his info. and understand how the bullet, rifling and chamber works together you will see that making a bullet for your rifle is the best way to go.
 
tell him to save his money. Get a Lyman 457125 mold and mold his bullets with pure, or nearly pure lead. First of all, the pure lead doesn't shrink as much as most bullet alloys as it cools. So the 457 may actually throw a 459. Next the soft lead bullet Obturates upon ignition. That means it is hit from behind by the sudden pressure of the burning powder and is "bumped up" in size to fill the bore. 460 is actually kind of small as trapdoors go, for a while Gov't inspectors were told to accept/pass any bore less than 468. I shoot a lot of BPCR, and in a trapdoor, with the Springfield rifling, a pure lead bullet works great. (I've knocked over 9 out of ten 500 meter rams at matches with an 1884 trapdoor, that even has a slightly pitted barrel.)

If your Buddy still decides he needs a larger bullet, to go out a thousandth or two, just cast a hard alloy bullet. Coat it with abrasive and spin it in the mold to make the mold diameter larger. Depending on what abrasive is used, it can be done in less than 15 minutes. including clean up. You are only going out 2 or 3 thou in diamter, which is especially easy in an aluminum mold. There are other ways to take the mold diameter out, but that is the easiest for the home/hobby shooter.
 
Not a bad idea on the 457125. I borrowed one that dropped bullets at 459, which was actually too tight for my Sharps bore. I had a tremendous increase in accuracy by going to a Brooks mould, but that's not to say a Lyman can't produce good results too. It's all about finding the mould that works for your gun.
 
$80.99 from Midway:
Saeco 1-Cavity Magnum Bullet Mold #023 45 Caliber (458-459 Diameter) 375 Grain Spitzer Point
''Spitzer'' it ain't,but it IS slightly pointed,making for superior aerodynamics.
 
Hello,

Thanks for all the info ; actually my friend will go to the easiest/ cheapest solution : Lee 405 grain hollow base mold ; we can get it easily in France ;

Thanks again and the old Trapdoor will wake up again soon !

Regards
 
flibuste

Hello,

Thanks for all the info ; actually my friend will go to the easiest/ cheapest solution : Lee 405 grain hollow base mold ; we can get it easily in France ;

Thanks again and the old Trapdoor will wake up again soon !

Regards

Easiest/cheapest is often a good way to start.

If you plan on using black powder here is a good book to read.

http://www.the45-70book.com/The-Book-3rd-Edition-by-Spence-Pat-Wolf
 
I have the Lee hollow base, i use it in a H&R trapdoor carbine, it's work good.
Keep alloy soft from 30-1 to 40-1 of lead-tin, i haven't try pure lead, may be in the future...
Very important is an expander for the case so you don't damage the soft bullet, it must enter in the case pushing by hand, and make a crimp in a second passage in the dies, i resize the brass each time i fire its, i clone the 45/55/405 originally adopted in the carbine, the problem is to load so little powder in the big 45/70 case!
ciao
Rusty
 
Every kind of filler i have tryed enlarge the group on target, corn, felt wad, lubed felt wad, my experience say that only card wad between powder and bullet work well for me:)
H&R bore have 8 groove, real different respect original 3 and like Pedersoli repro!
I know a Pedersoli trapdoor rifle of a good friend that group 5 shot in 2 inch at 100mt, my carbine at the same distance in a luky day keep the black of the target.
His cartridge is loaded with 68 grain of FFg and a Postell bullet, more than 500 grais of lead:)
ciao
Rusty
 
I have very good results with a card wad between bullet and powder also. I use a .030 wad with a solid base bullet, but my bullet is right at bore diameter and doesn't need to obdurate.
 
I have very good results with a card wad between bullet and powder also. I use a .030 wad with a solid base bullet

A card wad with a solid base is usually not a bad thing. My results with a card wad and a hollow base have not been as good.
 
When using a card or felt wad between powder & bullet, with less than a full case of powder, you run the risk of ringing your chamber. The wad takes the place of the bullet, & the bullet becomes an obstruction in the bore. Many years ago it was common practice among the people I used to compete with to put a card wad over light charges of powder in straight-walled cases. One day my friend, who shot a .32/40, asked to take a look at the chamber in my .38/55 as he had found a ring in his chamber right were the base of the bullet would be in a loaded round. Sure enough, we pulled the bolt on my Marlin & found a ring in exactly the same place. I think Rusty's load of 55gns of BP in a modern .45/70 case may take up most of the available space with the aid of a wad or two so should be ok, but you certainly want to make sure there is little to no airspace between the powder/wad column & the base of the bullet.
 
The trick with loading a black powder cartridge is to get the right amount of powder compression and powder volume and bullet length and seating depth to not have any space between bullet, powder and wad, while still finding a combination that gives you optimum accuracy.

Or you can just dump the powder in, then seat a wad and bullet with your thumb until it's firmly seated against the powder and call it good. As long as there's no air space you're safe.
 
About ringing i have nothing to say, my chambers look well, but using filler to reduce the load, obviously no air space in the case, i had many case of broken down brass with a perfect circle at his half!
Similar to what happened in my N°1 .303british, but for long head space!
ciao
Rusty
 
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