Can someone explain this.

[Mn Fats]

View attachment 782824 View attachment 782823
These are screenshots from Etsy.com. Both are claimed to be hand made, hand forged? I can't imagine a hand forged, damascus knife with a bone handle going for $80. I put the $150 plain jane knife in as a comparison. What gives? Are the cheaper ones a scam?

 

[Jim Watson]

Same way they made $10.50 Damascus barrel shotguns for Sears & Roebuck.
Cheap foreign labor.

 

[hso]

The $80 pattern-welded knives are subcontinent (Pakistan) cheap mystery metals.

 

[Mn Fats]

So it is just a photogenic pile of junk.

 

[Mn Fats]

Another example.. Im trying to understand what's up with these prices? I built my own forge because I was never happy with my knives (with the exception of one old German skinner) and more unhappy paying $200+ for what I want. That said, Im thinking on selling a few of my creations but these variations in prices really have me confused.

 

[Mn Fats]

All pics posted claim to be "American made".

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

Interesting, Titan International has a Madison WI address. I'll ask a could of the cheese head packer lovers I know about it.

 

[hso]

THIS is subcontinent mystery metal. You'll find these all over ebay and at gun shows with claims of being made here.



Everything from Buck & Bear (I recognize the logo on the sheath of the first knife) is better quality "subcontinent" stuff. The brothers (one here in the US and one in Pakistan) are working together get their overseas source to do a better job for them than the junk makers. Reputable sources like Blade HQ are even selling the B&B knives. I even met them at Blade Show last year and they were a couple of young guys from Pakistan educated here in the US that decided to start a company to get something better suited to the American market than the POS stuff seen elsewhere. Still, the reviews from buyers are hit and miss on what they get (some come dull, some won't hold an edge, others are ok). Just understand what you're getting for the money.

It is easy to spot the rest of the stuff once you've seen enough of it (especially spread out on some poser's table at a gun show). The patterns are large low layer count that is uneven and the handles look oddly elaborate. The price makes no sense either since it takes hours to make any finished knife and you'd go broke in a hurry selling any "damascus" for $80.
Don't mistake any of it for the quality you expect to get from damascus made here or in Europe. Look at Sorrells' video explaining "damascus" and think what the effort would cost here.

 

[Slamfire]

American Damascus is a lot more expensive:



I do have a couple of cheap Pakistan Damascus knives, and you know, they cut. What else do you use a knife for, except to cut? I have not tried any edge retention tests or any destructive tests. Personally, I don't care for acid etched Damascus, if you use the knife, the pattern wears off and the outside surface is rough. I would they simply not acid etched the stuff, but then, the pretty patterns are why people buy the stuff.

I have bought a number of inexpensive knives on ebay made out of D2 steel, and I am very happy with those. I am of the opinion that D2 steel makes for a sharper, more care free knife, than Damascus.

 

[kamagong]

I can't imagine a hand forged, damascus knife with a bone handle going for $80.

They can't. The phrase caveat emptor comes to mind here.

 

[C0untZer0]

From what I've gleaned watching YouTube "reviews" of some of these knives is that there are people who consider themselves knife collectors and they buy knives which appeal to their sense of aesthetics, and I don't think they even intend to use the knives for cutting anything - they just sit in a curio cabinet on display the way some people have their Lladro figurines on display. Their idea of quality is not whether or not the thing can baton wood or make feather sticks or prepare food or whatever. Their idea of quality is good fit and finish, that it looks nice and there are no obvious visible flaws or anything that mars the knife's visual appeal.

And most of the videos that I see where the reviewer is mainly talking about the knife's beauty - and not the functionality - involves these knives from Pakistan.

So I'm thinking, if you want a really beautiful knife that is made out of quality steel(s) using quality processes and quality workmanship - its going to be very expensive. If you just want a knife that you think looks pretty - then its probably coming from Pakistan.

Just my opinion...

 

[C0untZer0]

I can't imagine a hand forged, damascus knife with a bone handle going for $80

Probably - "Hand Forged" means a worker used a finger on their hand to press a button which started a conveyor belt which fed a billet through an oven with a power hammer at the end. The billet was probably made from extremely thin steel shim stock of slightly different cheaper stainless steels.

The two things that I'd wonder about would the bone and the shiny parts on those knives. I think they're more likely to be plastic and spray-on chrome over plastic as opposed to highly polished stainless steel and real bone.

 

[Valkman]

you'd go broke in a hurry selling any "damascus" for $80.

For sure! Seeing as how good Damascus goes for that or more PER INCH you won't find any American Damascus knives for $80.

 

[Speedo66]

Hey, you never know. There's been a cottage industry in that part of the world forever making gun copies that by many accounts work fine, even semi auto. They're handmade one piece at a time, and cheap. Same skills and economies might be applied to knife making.

 

[hso]

Their idea of quality is good fit and finish, that it looks nice and there are no obvious visible flaws or anything that mars the knife's visual appeal.

The problem is these folks aren't even getting good fit and finish compared to the craftsmen and artisans here. As they get deeper into collecting they'll find themselves looking at these and understanding they wasted money on something that doesn't measure up.

 

[Skoghund]

My hand forged, and i mean hand forged with a hammer, Damascus bladed knife by Roger Bergh. A Swedish knife maker who sells a few knives in the US. Mines a earlier one that I've had for many years. It cost a fair bit more than $85 over twenty years ago.
The cheap Damascus knives come from Pakistan and you get what you pay for.

 

[bikerdoc]

Unfortunately most off shore damascus doesnt measure up.

 

[Valkman]

I made a few but couldn't afford the real good stuff like Chad Nichols makes so I'd buy a piece of Alabama Damascus on ebay. Made stuff like this, which was my cheapest model but still would've been $150 to $200. Also found a pic of a 4" knife I made using the same kind of Damascus.

 

[bikerdoc]

From what I have seen the problem is mystery metal and poor heat treatment.

 

[kamagong]

From what I have seen the problem is mystery metal and poor heat treatment.

That's a huge problem.

 

[hso]

If any heat treat at all.