Classic Autoloaders

[birdshooter]

Suppose you wanted to build a collection of Classic Autoloaders, what would you include on that list. I would think the following belong on that list as well as others. What guns would you include?

1911
Ruger .22 Automatic
Colt Woodsman
CZ 75
Browning Hi Power
S&W 59
Luger
Walter P38
Glock 17

I look forward to hearing your other thoughts.

 

[usp9]

Walther PP
Beretta, several models qualify. A 92fs would be a good start.
Baby Browning.
HK P7
Kahr K9
Sig, several models, P230, P226, P210 ...
Makarov

 

[bannockburn]

S&W Model 39
Colt Commander
Walther PPK
Beretta Model 1934
Mauser HSc

 

[earplug]

Luger
Mauser Broomhandle
Lahti
remington 51
Savage
Webley Fosberry recoil operated revolver.
HK P9 the gas gun.
Modragon ? Mexican rotary barrel locking, gun looks a bit like a 1911
SIG 210

 

[jfrey]

1911
Browning Hi Power
Colt Woodsman
S&W 951-1
Glock 19

 

[Nom de Forum]

I tried to define classic as most influential and keep the list as short as possible. I am probably leaving something off that many will think is just as influential.

#1 - The 1911 - Most influential of all time. Disregarding the influences great and small on semiautomatic design, if nothing else it influenced the general shape of most of everything that came after it during a time when other semiautomatics were shaped very differently: C96, Luger, Webley, Steyr, etc.

#2 - The Luger - The first 9mm Parabellum caliber pistol and influenced the appearance of #5 on the list.

#3 - The P-38 - The first successful DA semiautomatic service pistol and had a locking system alternative to the Browning System that contributed to the replacement of the 1911 with the U.S. Military.

#4 - The P-35 High Power - The first successful double column magazine “Wonder 9”.

#5 - The Ruger Mk1 .22LR - The most successful .22 ever made and one that millions of shooters have used.

#6 - The Glock17/22 - The first successfully proved example that plastic and simple is a great idea and the first out of the blocks in .40 S&W. The most formidable challenger to the 1911 for the title of Best Semiautomatic.

#7 - Beretta 92 - replaced the 1911 as the U.S. service pistol and convinced millions of people to personally choose many other designs of 9mm pistols instead of a Beretta 92.

 

[birdshooter]

Great additions everyone. There are certainly some models I had not considered. Would you consider the S&W Model 41 a classic?

 

[C0untZer0]

#1 Colt M1911
#2 Luger
#3 Browning High Power
#4 HK P7
#5 HK P9

 

[Luger_carbine]

#1 Pistole Parabellum 1908 the first auto-loading pistol adopted by the armed forces of a major world power and most influential pistol ever.

#2 Broomhandle Mauser

#3 Walther P38

#4 M1911

#5 Browning Hi-Power

#6 The Ruger Standard (Bill Ruger admired the genius of Georg Luger)

 

[bannockburn]

Have to add the Colt Pocket Model 1903.

 

[tarosean]

I'm not seeing anything from the 80's being "classic"

 

[el Godfather]

Luger
1911
Mauser
Stechkin
BHP
Walther PPS
H&K vp70
Sig P210

Not that I would want collection of stuff I dont care for. May be good for public/private museums.

 

[BlindJustice]

The BHP besides being the first high capacity magazine
also has the cam pivot action with no link like the 1911 desgn
and is copied more than the 1911 in that regard.

The HK VP70z of 1970 was the first
polymer framed semi-auto.

Sig P210 the slide sits inside the frame instead of
warpping around it with the slide / rails relationship reversed.

P-38 first full size servce DA/SA semi-auto
it's little bro the PP/PPK was the first DA/SA
& it certainly influenced eruopean leo carry.

R-

 

[Thompsoncustom]

I'm not seeing anything from the 80's being "classic"

Ya for me it has to be pre 80's and polymer can't be a classic.

 

[el Godfather]

Ya for me it has to be pre 80's and polymer can't be a classic.

Agreed except Vp70 for being the first.

 

[HammsBeer]

Keep in mind pistols from the 80's are going on 30 years old now. I see alot of expensive classics in these lists. What about budget (under $400) classics such as:

Makarov and variations
Sig P6
Ruger MKI/II
postwar P38's

 

[Nom de Forum]

A fair number of suggestions.

Is it time yet to debate which ones should be ranked lower or not in the top 10 of a "classics" list?

1911 versus Luger for #1 is always good for a merry-go-round.

Leaving the Glock off the list is denial of reality. Wake up and smell the coffee.:banghead: Go take a look at the shelf in your LGS. Notice a trend in frame material from all the major gun makers? I am suddenly reminded of the deputy sheriff I spoke to in the early 1990's that was extolling the virtues of the SIG and how SIG would never make a "plastic gun".

 

[Thompsoncustom]

Leaving the Glock from the off the list is denial of reality. Wake up and smell the coffee. Go take a look at the shelf in your LGS. Notice a trend in frame material from all the major gun makers? I am suddenly reminded of the deputy sheriff I spoke to in the early 1990's that was extolling the virtues of the SIG and how SIG would never make a "plastic gun".

I don't think anyone was saying that glock's or tupperware pistols aren't crazy popular and work just fine. Not sure they should be defined as a classic tho and in my book there not, maybe when they phase out plastic for the next material like they did with all steel pistols I will change my thinking.

 

[Nom de Forum]

(Bill Ruger admired the genius of Georg Luger)

Admired his genius? Isn't Georg really a minor gun genius at best. Didn't he just modify an operating system, necked-up a cartridge when told to, and never did much else significant in gun design. I thought Bill Ruger recognized the mystique the Luger had in the popular imagination in the mid-20th century and designed something with a familiar look and feel that would sell well. Please let me know if I am misinformed, I am not a Luger or Ruger SME.

 

[Nom de Forum]

I don't think anyone was saying that glock's or tupperware pistols aren't crazy popular and work just fine. Not sure they should be defined as a classic tho and in my book there not, maybe when they phase out plastic for the next material like they did with all steel pistols I will change my thinking.

Twenty-five years and older will get you a classic car registration and license plate in many states. The Glock meets that time criteria for a pistol. It is not the polymer frame, striker, polygon barrel, trigger mechanism, lack of separate manual safeties, low bore line, finish, low number of parts, out of the box reliability and accuracy, etc. that make it a classic. It is the combination of all those in a low cost easy to use design that dominates LEA purchases, is incredibly popular for civilian competition and self-defense, and forced all major gun makers to emulate it to greater or lessor degrees.

 

[Zeeemu]

"Would you consider the S&W Model 41 a classic?"

Until you asked I was wondering when the Model 41 would show up. Beautiful gun, wonderful trigger, a true classic to me.

 

[Thompsoncustom]

Twenty-five years and older will get you a classic car registration and license plate in many states. The Glock meets that time criteria for a pistol. It is not the polymer frame, striker, polygon barrel, trigger mechanism, lack of separate manual safeties, low bore line, finish, low number of parts, out of the box reliability and accuracy, etc. that make it a classic. It is the combination of all those in a low cost easy to use design that dominates LEA purchases, is incredibly popular for civilian competition and self-defense, and forced all major gun makers to emulate it to greater or lessor degrees.

Yup still not a classic in my eyes. Not sure if any of that really makes something a classic or if it's just ones personal feelings. The 1911 has half of the above but almost everyone will tell you it's a classic unlike the glock it doesn't have to be debated.

 

[TRX]

Mauser Bolo - the first successful autoloading handgun
Luger - the developed version of the Borchardt
FN Browning Model 1903 - the grandfather of many, many small automatics
Colt 1911 - still around, and going strong
CZ 75 - also the parent of many imitations
Gabbett-Fairfax Mars - the Magnum autoloader
Desert Eagle - gas-operated Magnum
AMT Auto Mag - my preciousss...

 

[Nom de Forum]

Yup still not a classic in my eyes. Not sure if any of that really makes something a classic or if it's just ones personal feelings. The 1911 has half of the above but almost everyone will tell you it's a classic unlike the glock it doesn't have to be debated.

We at least agree on one thing, there is no debate about the 1911. Would you agree we both have a bias? I think based on your signature line, your bias is a little more extreme than mine. My prediction is that a couple of decades from now there will be no debate about the Glock, either it will be or will not be considered a classic by most shooters. I hope we will both be around on THR to discuss it. Good health to you sir.

 

[HammsBeer]

What defines a classic?

Popularity?
Looks?
Track record?

There are tons of old pistols, some are legendary, some were good but didn't sell many, and some were dismal. What factors are required to be a "classic" auto pistol.