(CO) Fight with computer brings SWAT team

[DeltaElite]

Cor,
True enough, I was working under the mistaken assumption that with him reportedly yelling b--- and waving the gun around implicated that he had said "b---" with him and it was human.
My mistake.
I hate wasting my time waiting on SWAT, really cuts into my time napping under a shade tree.

Now back to your scheduled programming.

 

[El Tejon]

Cor, is there a police exception to Fraud or Theft by Trickery? Could be an exception, don't know Red law.

Besides call the grand jury, the `puter commando could also sue. Many states have civil counterparts of Criminal Conversion where an individual may recover triple damages and attorney fees for his damages. Don't know if Red has this or not.

Criminal Conversion was the taking, not the keeping. However, I am certain the DA is not inclined to go hunting his own po-po. Never a popular move.

 

[cordex]

OBVIOUSLY the moron isn't stable in the first place or he wouldn't have been shouting at his computer while waving a replica firearm around!! Hello, McFly!

Maybe it's just me, but it doesn't seem that stability can be accurately determined from these particular manifestations of frustration over a stubborn computer. Many are the times that I've seen people become profoundly unhappy with their computer to the point of yelling, and some would no doubt have drawn down on their monitor with a replica gun (something they know will do no real harm) had one been available. But I don't have a psych degree, and I don't claim to be an expert.

Still, it's one thing to practice point-shooting your monitor with an airsoft everytime you get BSoDed, and another to do so only partially in sight of witnesses.

Sometimes eager citizens do more harm than good, though.
I remember a case not to long ago where a man came stumbling home drunk. He couldn't find his keys, so he climbed in through a window (his own home, mind you - nothing wrong with that). A neighbor spotted him and called the cops. It seems that there was a possibility that the neighbor had recognized him, but was just giving him a hard time.
Anyway, police burst into the guy's home with the intent of stopping a criminal. The guy jumps out of bed still intoxicated and sees a group of men running into his bedroom, so he grabs a knife and goes at them. Cops shoot, man dies.
Everyone ('cept maybe the "concerned neighbor") was acting appropriately based on their knowledge of the situation and with the best intentions. The man was trying to defend his home against intruders, the police were trying to stop a potential robbery and then trying to defend their own lives.
This was discussed at length on TFL.
Bad calls can lead to bad situations without cops always being JBTs.

This was a bad situation that could have been much worse had the SWAT been a bit more trigger-happy. The cops seemed to do very well, all told. Without knowing if the gentleman was pressured into giving up his firearm and if he will get it back, I won't judge that.

 

[Tamara]

OBVIOUSLY the moron isn't stable in the first place or he wouldn't have been shouting at his computer while waving a replica firearm around!! Hello, McFly!

Obviously! I usually go straight to lobbing the offending piece of hardware through the nearest window, myself.

"We're gonna need to take your guns."
"You're gonna need a bigger truck."

 

[JohnBT]

Maybe the gentleman, upon reflection, realized that he was a danger to himself and that having a gun around was a bad idea. Maybe the voices said that it was okay to let the police have the gun.

I really don't care. He let them take it. He was there. It was his decision to make. He can deal with it in the morning if he gets his head screwed on straight.

John

 

[J Miller]

OBVIOUSLY the moron isn't stable in the first place or he wouldn't have been shouting at his computer while waving a replica firearm around!!

Being stable is not for the average person to decide. It varies from moment to moment.
I could say that an officer pointing a gun at an uncooperative suspect and screaming at the top of his lungs for the suspect to drop his weapon wasn't stable because he was screaming.
It isn't true, but he was screaming and waving a gun, right?

I believe someone should call the PD and politely ask them what they would have done in this or a hypothecicle (sic) situation had the person refused to allow them to take his gun.
Just for the information of it.

As for being unstable and waving a replica gun at the computer I have have yelled and threatened my computer with a real gun! Loaded no less. Was I unstable? No. Was I a threat to anyone? NO. Would I have had a visit from the SWAT team if someone had seen what I did? I live in Springfield, IL, you decide. After all the BS was over would I have allowed the PD to take my guns for "safe keeping"? HELL NO!

It apears to me that two things apply here.
One; there is more to this story than we know, so we are second guessing everything.

Two; we are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
From what I read in the original post, the situation was handled very well. I hope that the original poster will watch for an update and report if anything else comes from this incident.

Oh, after threatening this computer with a gun it quit messing up. Go figure.

 

[El Tejon]

John, maybe so, but that's why you call grand juries. Maybe consent, maybe no consent, maybe fraud--call the grand jury, see what happened.

 

[bogie]

Well, it's a good thing that I donated my old (and working) confusers to Goodwill last year.

 

[thumbtack]

This is not the first time this has happened, over the past few years I have read about several occasions when LEOs were called only to find someone screaming at their computer. I doubt this will be the last. I am just glad no one got hurt.

 

[Azrael256]

OBVIOUSLY the moron isn't stable in the first place or he wouldn't have been shouting at his computer while waving a replica firearm around!! Hello, McFly!

I won't make any comment about the guy's stability upstairs, since I have no real knowledge of him, but it doesn't seem that you've ever worked in IT. I know dozens of people who have actually shot their computers. 7.62x39 does a real number on a Compaq. Granted that all but one was shot under rather controlled circumstances (range or something like it), but it is evidence that a computer really can frustrate a person to the point of carbon-on-silicon violence.

 

[El Tejon]

"Office Space"!

 

[Strings]

hey... wait a sec...

I've done the "point gun at 'puter and *mumble, grumble*". Only response *I* ever got was my wife giving me grief about not being able to hit it at that range...

I'm with most here: if he gave permission for them to take the gun, no harm/no foul...

 

[DMK]

Perhaps the individual was heavily intoxicated

If that were that case, and as it appears, he was acting irrationally, and as it appears, he did give them permission to take the firearm, I see no harm or foul.

 

[Betty]

I would love to shoot my office computer (and the rest of the production staff here would like to do the same to theirs). It always crashes on deadline. Always. I've run TechTool, Diskwarrior, and done jusy about everything there is to do to this box of circuits.

I swear it's possessed! (Can Preacherman do excorcisms?) I curse at it all the time. (Sometimes I pretend I'm the computer and answer back in a squeaky voice.)

"I HATE YOU! WHY DO YOU ALWAYS HAVE TO DO THIS TO ME!"
"You just wait 'til tomorrow when you start working on S.W.A.T. I'm designing a new pop-up bomb warning just for you. heh heh heh"

Okay. End rant. If I do get a new computer at work, the old one is going to meet Mr. Mosin and his bayonet.

 

[Intune]

JBT's??

Sounds like the police did a good job. I wonder sometimes if they can perform their jobs in ANY manner that would suit everyone. The LEO's who post here must have rhino hide but I bet sometimes the negativity gets under it.

 

[rock jock]

Mike,

The article implies that the man did not volunteer the gun, but was rather asked to turn it over. The question is, why? Because he threatened his computer? If so, lock us all up and throw away the key.

 

[AZTOY]

WOULD THIS BE I GOOD REASON TO SHOOT YOUR COMPUTER

 

[rick458]

I saw the funniest cartoon a few years back
One man was drawn down on another man who was backed up against a copier the man with the pistol was saying "just get out of the wat Scott this has nothing to do with you".
I was posted next to a Copier that I would have loved to use for a reef starter.

 

[nualle]

What I find "sick and wrong" is that, having determined that the man had committed no crime and endangered noone, the police nonetheless took upon itself the storage of his gun. Sure, it was his choice to submit to that... but upon what basis did the State request it?

With only the Camera report to go on, we're all making assumptions. Coronach assumes that the man's choice was made freely (without the threat [explicit or implicit] of some other legal repercussion should he choose to retain his gun). I assume the reverse... that heavily armed men with the legal authority to say what goes in one's own home tend to predispose the resident unfamiliar with this scenario to assent to just about anything they suggest, regardless of legal niceties.

I'm closed-minded for having this opinion? So be it.

 

[JohnBT]

El Tejon - You've lost me with the grand jury stuff.

The article says the man let them take the gun.

"...but with the man's permission.."

He let them take it. They asked, he said yes. That is what we know from the article.

What's with the grand jury stuff?

They could have taken him in on what, in Virginia, is called a Green Warrant for mental health observation if they believed that he was a danger to himself or others. He could get the 72-hour observation period and hearing to be commited or released.

Again. What is it with the grand jury stuff?

If they asked and he said no they had other options you know - like locking his butt up for disturbing the peace or something.

John

 

[El Tejon]

John, grand juries can be used to investigate a purported crime. The grand jury could be used to determine whether the po-po had consent or whether the `puter commando was tricked or defrauded into consent, such as "give us the gun or go to jail" that you describe.

The criminal investigation would be independent of the state crim conv. civil lawsuit or the federal 1983 lawsuit.

The officers did NOT take him to a mental hospital. They only took his property.

The criminal investigation of the officers involved would be dependent upon Red law. Further, even if the officers did commit a crime, unlikely for the Red DA to hunt his own, even if special prosecutor appointed.

 

[cordex]

If they asked and he said no they had other options you know - like locking his butt up for disturbing the peace or something.

Yeah! How dare he do something that a peeping-Tom busybody could possibly misinterpret?

 

[JohnBT]

I don't about how it is where you live, but around here they don't take silly little cases like this one to a grand jury.

They don't even arrest the person for acting funny and jumping up and down - hey, wait a minute, they didn't arrest this guy either.

And we'll never know what the police would have done if the gentleman had refused to hand over his gun.

I guess I'll never understand what all the hoopla is all about.

John

 

[El Tejon]

John, I'm not talking about arresting or investigating the `puter commando. I'm talking about calling the grand jury to investigate the mall ninjas for taking his property to see whether this taking was lawful or not. May be, may not be.

Around here we do investigate suspected police corruption. The hoopla amongst us serfs is about ensuring that no one is above the law, not even the Knights of the LE Order.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Nothing wrong here. Call made that there were threats of death being made and a gun was seen. Wasn't an "active shooter" situation and SWAT could be sent in. The officers were well trained and everybody involved is alive and unhurt. The man gives consent for the cops to take his gun and he'll get it back.

BTW, guess there's new laws that prevent computer abuse. First spousal abuse became a crime. Animal abuse got criminalized. Now computers? Thankfully not and we can still yet at them. Just don't wave BB or replica guns at one if a neighbor or passerby can see you.