Cops: Man Admits Killing Child Molesters

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Flechette the difference between a teenager having sex before their emotionally equiped to deal with the conseqences,and a adult who prays upon unsuspecting children to sexually grattify themselves is a TOTALLY different ballgame and im sorry to see you dont differentiate the two.

Ajax,

Don't be sorry, I DO differentiate between the two; it is the law that does not. This is the point that I am trying to make (and a point that many of you seem incapable of acknowledging) - many of the people on these lists are not really a danger to society - they merely did something (like urinating off a balcony or dated an underage girl) that got them labelled as "sex offenders". I simply do not believe it is ok to murder these people because they are on the list.

Flyboy said:

However, I still don't think that means we need lists; rather, it means we need longer prison terms, up to and including life without parole.

If he's still a danger, he shouldn't be out of prison! If it's not in prison, he's served his time, and should be free to enjoy the rights of any other free man.


Bingo! I agree exactly! If they are truly a threat to society (forced rape of a six year old) lock him up for good. I'd even support an execution for such a crime (by a jury, not a lunatic). Public urinators and cheerleader mooners should not me murdered and should not be on any "list".


A Cleaner said:

My final comment, without rhetoric is this: The list is a good thing. It informs everyone around these criminals to be on guard. This information is no less relevant to neighbors of a rapist or pedophile than a criminal history report is to a potential employer.

Let me post a question. Should we execute all criminals convicted of second-degree murder? Should all second-degree murder convicts be given life without parole? Think about it.
 
Fletchette,

There does indeed seem to be proof that the lists diferentiate, as excerpts were posted here. They seemed as specific as necessary with out being graphic. That you choose to ignore this is a problem.

Second point. They already do post lists of gun owners in some states. Do you have a CCW permit? I do and in my state my name goes in every newspaper for a hundred miles. Do they post lists for vandalism? Read the blotters much? There's the hometown crowd up to the hometown gettin' arrested and you can keep tabs on who the trouble makers are in your neighborhood. So if you read that there are a lot of vandalisms in a particular area, you won't buy property there.

Bottom line is that these individuals gave up their right to privacy when that privacy became a weapon. Rapes don't happen in public. You have a right to do nearly anything you want as long as you don't hurt anyone. They hurt people. The problem is not that I and others are draconian, the problem is that political correctness has trumped common sense. Assume I'm a convicted sexual predator and offer to drive your 10 year old daughter home from school next tuesday because you're busy. Am I a good neighbor or a sick bastard that you won't know about until it's too late?
 
One of the problems that arises in our media driven society it that certain issues become "We have to do something about this!!" issues. You know the kind, where the newscaster leans in to the camera and asks so seriously, "When is someone going to do something about this issue....." and the legislatures get all wrapped up in pounding something out to satisfy the dufus constituents who scream that they throw away the key on this criminal or on that convict.

Then these laws show up that are hurried up, ill thought and poorly reasoned and then some prosecutor, instead of using some common sense, files charges against someone because he can, not because he should.

What happens then? 18 year old boys who date a younger girl get arrested and jailed for what a couple of years ago would have been considered a youthful indiscretion. A highschool student who "streaks" a girls activity is branded a sex offender. A banker who has a couple beers and instead of walking away grabs his crotch and yells "I got your dinner right here" in response to a name calling incident. what is the result he gets put on the list.

Let us refine the list. let us us it with discretion. Let us put on the list only those who really deserve. And then the list can read..."here lies tommy wayne offender, executed on june 1 last year, for the rape and murder of a child."

Then let us also empower judges to say to prosecutors I think not. hire judges we can trust and let us rely on them, but also let us place in to effect the ability to recharge those indiviuals who sneak thru the cracks.

A pissing contest off a balcony is not a sex crime. a high school senior dating a soph or jun. is not a sex crime. A pervert who rapes and murders a little boy and then keeps his sister as his sex slave has forfieted his right to live on our planet.
 
There does indeed seem to be proof that the lists diferentiate, as excerpts were posted here. They seemed as specific as necessary with out being graphic. That you choose to ignore this is a problem.

Actually, I thought it was the other way around - several people here are not willing to acknowledge that some very innocuous things can get you onto one of these lists.

For the record: Some states list the specifics of the offender's crimes, some states do not. Please acknowledge that some of these people do not deserve to be called "sex offeders" (especially before advocating murdering people off of the lists).

They already do post lists of gun owners in some states. Do you have a CCW permit?

Yup. And I have been stopped in traffic just because I am on the list. Lists of people are bad.

Rapes don't happen in public. You have a right to do nearly anything you want as long as you don't hurt anyone. They hurt people.


I never argued that they didn't hurt people. I am arguing that the punishment should fit the crime. I am arguing that it is NOT ok to murder people you read on a sex offender list.

Assume I'm a convicted sexual predator and offer to drive your 10 year old daughter home from school next tuesday because you're busy. Am I a good neighbor or a sick bastard that you won't know about until it's too late?

If I had a 10 year old daughter I would become "un-busy" and drive her home myself. It is a matter of priorities. Family over work. After all, you could be a sexual preditor and not be on the list (as in never been caught yet). That plumber that "A Cleaner" mentioned could be a murderer, just not caught yet. Not being on "the list" does not make you "safe".

Arm yourself, and take precautions with all strangers. Do not violate our privacy by creating worthless "lists" of people and then expect to waltz through life without a problem.

Pete F said:

Let us refine the list. let us us it with discretion. Let us put on the list only those who really deserve.

Thank you for posting a truly good suggestion. This suggestion is much better than "it is ok to murder people of this list and I don't care if they really should not be on this list. It's for the children."
 
Excellent Suggestion

I agree wholeheartedly with the notion of keeping mooners, whizzing contestants and highschoolers with under 18 girlfriends off the lists. This does two things. Keeps relatively innoccuous people from scrutiny for behavior which while not admirable is also not criminal until the PC movement got ahold of it. It also shortens my search for possible threats in my neighborhood.

On a personal note, you and I agree about the priority thing with family. They come first, which is why the list, while not perfect, can be a useful tool for protecting them.
 
Just out of curiousity, who here has dealt closely with this issue? And actually seen the damage these people cause? And still sticks up for the rights of these nonhumans? It's not like you can't tell the difference. Whizzing off a balcony does not warrant "Aggravated sexual assault" with a "Sexual Predator" label. Giving these people privacy results in children getting raped. And it's nice to know that nothing ever comes up where it's impossible to pick up your child from school. Is there anyone who doesn't believe vicious child molesters shouldn't die or serve life in prison? Because until that happens I'm all for the registry. And the merciless slaughter of the people on that list by victims and their families. How can anyone say these people have rights. If someone was killing minor drug offenders off, then it would be different. These are child molesters. It doesn't matter how cautious you are, it can happen to someone close to you. The sex offender registry can cut down on the chances of that happening. The safety of law abiding citizens come before the rights of sex offenders. I do see your point. There shouldn't be a registry. There shouldn't be a need for a registry. The sick sick nonhumans should never see daylight. But seeing as how a man can serve less than four years for aggravated sexual assault on a victim under the age of thirteen, the list is kind of necessary. The cost of execution is bogus. Bullets are cheap. So are broomsticks. I agree there shouldn't be a list, but there should also be longer terms. Like life. And death. But given the RIDICULOUSLY short sentences, the list has to stay. Forget these people's rights.
 
Forget these people's rights.

Yep, and since every gun owner will have an accident which could kill a kid, we should ignore their rights too.

And I still do not see a motive here. Everyone is assuming that he killed them because they were child molesters (or whatever they were). What if he just wanted to kill, and thought he may be better off picking names off a list of 'bad people'?
 
Key word is accident bro. Raping a child isn't an accident. It's a cold heartless crime. Owning a gun isn't a crime. Raping a kid is.
 
OK, I don't remember the whole thread, but IIRC, this particular crime could have been anything from exposure to a minor, to rape. Just picking the highest crime it could have been and saying that is what they did does not help your argument.

Furthermore, even if it was the harshest crime that was committed, it still does not give anyone with a gun the right to go and kill them.

Maybe a better argument would be pulling out a statistic that most gun owners will end up killing someone, and saying it should be open season on them because of course, like the sex offenders, they are obviously going to committ a crime.

And why don't we have lists of convicted murderers, theifs, gang members, prostitutes (are they on the sex offender lists?), and drug users? What makes the sex offenders special?
 
Just out of curiousity, who here has dealt closely with this issue? And actually seen the damage these people cause? And still sticks up for the rights of these nonhumans?

Logjon, that would be me. I have had two close relationships with women who have confided in me that they were raped by members of their family when they were young. The first, raped by her half-brother. I was in my young twenties and wasn't in a position to help much other than as a distraction. I also had issues of my own at this time. She ended up overdosing on heroin a couple of years after we parted ways. I'd like to think it was an accident.

Later on, I was quite involved with a woman in her thirties that confided in me that she had been repeatedly raped by several of her male family members when she was a little girl (young as four). This did not sit well with me. I tried to get her to tell me where they lived so I could *. She knew better, and refused to tell because she was afraid of the consequences. She had a young daughter and that was her primary responsibility in life. She also said that she had gone through councilling for years, and had put it behind her. She wanted to live the rest of her life, not the first part.

This bothered me for years.

I have had much time to contemplate these situations. My arguements here are the result of years of contemplating this issue. Murder is simply not an option, even if it would feel good for a moment. This is definitely a job for the State, as one of the primary reasons governments exists as cited in the Constitution. Vigilantism here would simply ignite family fueds and many innocent people would be killed.

I agree that the Justice system needs to be improved in this area. Vicious child rapists like these most certainly deserve to be in prison for a very long time. I would even support execution (by jury, not by lunatic) for the most heinious of these crimes. But it HAS to be done with Due Process.

However, the present system has constructed a list that is frought with errors. People that have committed no real "crime", or those who have committed much, much lesser crimes, are also on these lists. Arguing that it is ok to murder these people is simply wrong, as wrong as the crimes mentioned above.

Fixing the list to include only the most heinous crimes may be a partial solution, but it is still frought with error. What if someone happens to have the same name as someone on the list? Who gets to decide what is a crime worthy of the "list"? Remember, there are plenty of people out there that think consensual sex between adults who are not married is wrong and should be a crime.

Saying that the lists makes you "feel" safer is non sequitur. If you look up on your computer and find that no one on the list lives nearby are you "safe"? Of course not! There are rapists that have not been caught yet, and those that have can travel to your town from afar. These lists not only violate the privacy of citizens, and encourage vigilantism that may result in murdering innocent people, but they also establish a false sence of security for parents.

There is NO good reason for such lists.

Arm yourself, take precautions around strangers and stay alert. That is the best you can do...no list required.
 
With all of that said, i am against these lists on the basic premis that they circumvent due-process. None of these guys were sentanced to have thier names placed on a state mantained and publicly accessable list, and as such, that is a punishment that the state CANNOT hand down.

Baloney.

Conviction records are public. You can go down to the courthouse and read almost any legal record at any time. (There are a very few exceptions involving youthful offendors and the like...)

These lists are simply a resorting of public information. If I had the time, I could, perfectly legally, set up a web site which listed every gun crime offender, skateboard crime offender or rubber chicken crime offender.

I am FOR these lists on the basic premise that, while imperfect, they are better than nothing in a society where we lock up people who smoke dope and let loose ones who rape little kids.
 
I saw on TV this morning that he did this crime so he could be inside the prison when Joe Duncan (abductor of the Groene children in Idaho) was convicted and incarcerated. That way he would have the opportunity of taking him out. I am a bit confused though,as this happened in WA and the other happened in Idaho.
 
1911 guy

+1

Might I add that the law needs to change, those that are violent sex
offenders or who assault children should (if so convicted) be executed.
Not the fools mooning or the guy taking a wiz. Action and intent go
hand in hand.

One running theme on this thread seems to be an issue with the governing
laws on this matter.

I also agree with logjon's statements on how such grievous actions
against people will forever change their lives. They have been issued a life
sentence in which there is no pardon or parole and fear is their constant
companion.

I know a few that have fallen victim to such atrocities. I know one that
even 20 years later is still haunted by that night. It never lets go.
 
I saw on TV this morning that he did this crime so he could be inside the prison when Joe Duncan (abductor of the Groene children in Idaho) was convicted and incarcerated.

His original statement was that he did the crime so that he would be put to death and could then beat up Duncan in hell.

He is pleading "not guilty" now, and he wants a lawyer. Apparently his commitment is faultering in the face of actually facing consequences for his actions. Its odd that the man is really suprised by whats happening, its not like this is the first time he has been in a court room.
 
Working man. Well put. I think the arguement is arising from the fact that people are arguing only the list, when the whole system is in need of revamping. I don't think anybody's arguing that child molesters should serve a year and slip into back society unnoticed. Nobody ever said the list completely removed the risk, but nobody thinks it cuts down on the risk of it happening again? How about this. In a way it is arming yourself. Knowledge. Knowledge is power right? If these people are going to be allowed back into society, they need to be watched, regardless of the chances it'll happen again. Flechette, execution for the scummiest with due process is a wonderful idea. I see your point, but I'm sorry I cannot envoke any sympathy for the rights of the worst part of society. The whole thing is bogus. 18 year olds with a 17 year old girlfriend don't need to be on there. I was almost on there over that.But since she was within 4 months of her 18th birthday, the cops just shook their heads at the parents and told them it was useless to pursue. But the list differentiates between them and the real scum. It's just that I can't see how anyone can argue for the rights of child molesters. Whizzers statches, etc don't need to be on there. BTW, does anybody know: In states where bestiality is illegal, can that get you on the sex offender list? Not that I'm considering it (whatever happened to consensual relationships between humans?) But as sick as it is that would be a retarded reason to be put on the list. Oh and one more thing. You could compile the list from public records, but sex offenders are required to notify the state every time they move and once a year. They also have to go door to door and tell people that they are a sex offender when moving into a new neighborhood. This includes statches and whizzers. If the list really is for public safety, then these people don't need to be on there. Nobody thinks these people belong on the list, but it's a useful tool when you have a child molester in the neighborhood. I wish there was no need for a list. The government doesn't want to spend the money to kill these people and lock them up for life. So instead they opt for the cheap alternative. Make a list of them. Regardless of their rights, you have to agree that one way or another these people can't be allowed to slip back into society unnoticed. Again to recap: nobody thinks child molesters should be allowed to go on living a life of secrecy again. It's just that some people feel the list is ineffective and a violation of the rights of child molesters. It wouldn't be a violation of their rights, however, to lock them up until they die or execute them WITH DUE PROCESS. While I agree with some of these views, I also advocate the merciless murder of child molesters by the victims and the family of the victims. I think the general consensus is that these nonhumans are dealt with ineffectively. But the arguments are driven by emotion, and communication suffers because of it. Just to clear the air, is there anyone who does believe that child molesters and violent rapists should be allowed to slip unnoticed into society after serving only a few years?
 
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